🚀 go-pugleaf

Always tell your version of software when asking for a hand. <g>

R241 isn't really 241% red, it's 241/255*100% red. So, you don't have to enter RGB values greater than 100% in FrameMaker.

Even with FrameMaker 9, I'd recommend avoiding CMYK in FrameMaker and using CMYK only in EPS files created elsewhere and imported into FrameMaker by reference.

What are you using the CMYK colors for?

Cheers,

Sean

I echo Sean's suggestion that you try adding color by using referenced eps files that use the cmyk color. Frame passes these through to Distiller as is.

There is another strategy to add color within FrameMaker; however, I cannot find a reference to the information that I used to do this. FrameMaker allows you to add custom inks to the application with an acf file. You define the custom colors in the acf file in both cmyk and rgb. So you can specify the rgb equivalents as they come from Photoshop or Illustrator, which are different than the ones used by Frame.

Note that the acf file specifies rgb colors in 16 bits, not 8 bits. The formula I used was

16-bit component = (8-bit component * 256) + 255

The 8-bit component values are the ones you got from Photoshop.

The acf file is added to the fminit > color folder within the FrameMaker programs folder.

I tested this in my case by importing a square eps file painted in the cmyk color. Then overlapped it with a square created in Frame and painted with the custom rgb color. Printing on my color laser printer showed negligible difference. We have yet to print to an ink printer.

I know this is vague, but maybe someone else can provide the link to a better explanation. THere might be something about this in the Frame help files.

Good luck,
Van

Thanks! I knew there had to be a simple answer. I fixed that problem by lying in Frame--I just adjusted the values until I got the correct output in Acrobat.

I am using CMYK colors because my company told me to :)

As I said, I got the same results in Frame 7.1 and Frame 8.

Thanks! I found a link to the info here:
 <http://help.adobe.com/en_US/FrameMaker/9.0/Using/WSBDFAC4BF-8326-4715-8E24-8F67B33103CF.html>

I fixed the orange and yellow colors by lying to Frame and they now output correctly to pdf. However, I am having trouble converting this color:

C100 K40.

The color prints on four plates, not two, in Acrobat. I can use Pitstop to adjust the color, but I would rather work with a color definition file, if possible. Can anyone help out here?

As you know, there is no unique conversion from rgb to cmyk. I do work in a workflow that needs color management, so I am just making guesses here. You might look into your Distiller settings. Maybe you can play with the color options, such as preserving or not under color removal. Or turning off color management.

Just guesses,
Van

The best way, I think, it to just convert the color using PitStop and hope that at some point, Adobe brings Frame color management into the 21st century. Thanks so much for your help!

Sue,

You also need to make an adjustment in a maker.ini setting that
affects how FM renders colours on output.

Find the entry for GetLibraryColorRGBFromCMYK in the [Preferences]
section.

Set it to: GetLibraryColorRGBFromCMYK=None

For more detailed info about this see:
http://www.techknowledgecorp.com/help/color.html at Tim Murray's site.
This info was originally posted by Mike Hardy a couple of years ago on
this site, but it's scrolled off now. Here's the original posting
content:

+++++++++++++++++++++

This post gives all the information I know about using colors in
FrameMaker 
under Windows. It does not cover the use of separations. It instead 
describes display, and direct output to color devices such as printers
- 
including creating PDFs.


Color models
=====================================
FrameMaker supports three different color models:

- CMYK (Cyan, Magenta, Yellow, Key)

- RGB (Red, Green, Blue)

- HLS (Hue, Light, Saturation).


FrameMaker uses an algorithm to convert between each of these color
models. 
For example:

RGB to CMYK:
C = max(R, G, B) - R
M = max(R, G, B) - G
Y = max(R, G, B) - B
K = 100 - max(R, G, B)

CMYK to RGB:
R = min(100 - K - C, 0)
G = min(100 - K - M, 0)
B = min(100 - K - Y, 0)



Color output
=====================================
Like most Windows applications, FrameMaker uses the Windows graphics
device 
interface (GDI) for its output. The GDI handles both display and
printer 
output.

Unfortunately, the GDI only supports the RGB color model. Any colors
that 
are defined in other color models are therefore converted to RGB for
output 
(see below).

The only exception to this is Encapsulated PostScript (EPS). When you
print 
to a PostScript printer, or distill a PDF, the EPS is inserted
unchanged 
into the PostScript. So any CMYK colors in the EPS get printed
unchanged. 
This is the only way to output a CMYK color from FrameMaker under
Windows.

(Note that if you instead print to a non-PostScript printer, any EPS
files 
are output using their preview bitmap, in RGB.)


Types of color in FrameMaker
=====================================
There are two types of color in FrameMaker:

- those defined by component values that you type in

- those defined by choosing a named ink from a color library.

FrameMaker handles these differently.


If you type in the component values
-------------------------------------
FrameMaker stores the color in the document as CMYK. If the color was
not 
defined as CMYK, FrameMaker uses its own conversion algorithm. So the
CMYK 
values that are stored are the same values that you see in the CMYK
view of 
the Color Definitions dialog.


FrameMaker outputs the color as RGB. If the color was not defined as
RGB, 
FrameMaker uses its own conversion algorithm. So the RGB values that
are 
output are the same values that you see in the RGB view of the Color 
Definitions dialog.


If you choose the color from a library
-------------------------------------
FrameMaker also supports color libraries that contain named inks.
Almost all 
libraries specify both CMYK and RGB values for each ink. The important
thing 
is that the mapping between the CMYK and RGB values can be very
different to 
the algorithm that FrameMaker uses.


FrameMaker stores the color in the document as the color library and
ink 
name. It also stores CMYK values for the color, for backup. When
FrameMaker 
opens the document, it looks for the color library and ink name, first
in a 
cache, then on disk:

- if it finds the color library and ink, it reads the CMYK and RGB
values 
for the ink from the color library

- if it doesn't find the color library or ink, it instead uses the
CMYK 
values that are stored in the document, exactly as if you'd typed them
in 
(see "If you type in the component values" above).


FrameMaker outputs the ink as RGB. It can use:

- the RGB values for the ink that are stored in the library

- the CMYK values for the ink that are stored in the library,
converted to 
RGB using its own algorithm.

This depends on the output device that FrameMaker is using, and the 
GetLibraryColorRGBFromCMYK setting in the maker.ini file:

- If GetLibraryColorRGBFromCMYK is set to "Screen", FrameMaker does
screen 
output by converting the CMYK values for the ink to RGB. For printer
output, 
it instead uses the RGB values for the ink.

- If GetLibraryColorRGBFromCMYK is set to "Printing", FrameMaker does 
printer and PDF output by converting the CMYK values for the ink to
RGB. For 
screen output, it instead uses the RGB values for the ink.

- If GetLibraryColorRGBFromCMYK is set to "Printing&Screen",
FrameMaker does 
all output by converting the CMYK values for the ink to RGB. It never
uses 
the RGB values for the ink.

- If GetLibraryColorRGBFromCMYK is set to "None", FrameMaker never
uses the 
CMYK values for the ink. It does all output using the RGB values for
the ink.


For the most WYSIWYG results with the predefined libraries, I'd
suggest 
setting GetLibraryColorRGBFromCMYK to "None". This means that the RGB
values 
in the color library get used for the screen - and they're probably
the most 
faithful colors for this. The same RGB color will be printed, giving
you the 
same color mismatches that you get for most other Windows
applications. And 
you will often find that the RGB to CMYK conversion of your output
device 
will give more faithful results than FrameMaker's own conversion.



Defining your own libraries
=====================================
Finally, note that you can define your own libraries. From the online 
"Customizing FrameMaker" manual:

"ColorLib [in maker.ini] specifies the folder that contains color
library 
files. These files are read in at startup and appear in the Color
Libraries 
pop-up menu in the Color Definitions dialog box. You can add any
library 
file formatted in the ASCII Color Format (.acf), version 2.1 or
earlier, or 
in the Binary Color Format (.bcf), version 2.0. You can't use a
FrameMaker 
product to save a .bcf library file."

A web search might reveal details of these file formats, but if not,
the 
ASCII one is pretty obvious. Here's a file I put together:

ACF 1.0
My Color Library
LibraryVersion: 1.0
Copyright: � 2005 Mike Hardy. All rights reserved.
AboutMessage: Colors for my company
Names: Partial
Rows: 4
Columns: 4
Entries: 2
Prefix:
Suffix:
Type: Process
Models: CMYK RGB
PreferredModel: RGB
Data:
0 0.25 0.5 0.25
65535 32768 0
Burnt Orange
0.5 0.25 0 0.25
0 32768 65535
French Blue

You can then control exactly what RGB values FrameMaker uses for
display and 
printing:

- determine the RGB values that you want to use for display, and note
down 
the RGB values

- determine the RGB values that you want to use for printing, perhaps
by 
trial and error in another application

- set the FrameMaker Color Definitions dialog to your RGB values for 
printing, then change to the CMYK color model, and note down the 
"equivalent" CMYK values

- define your own color library

- in your color library, define an ink with the RGB values you noted
for 
display, and the CMYK values you noted for printing

- set GetLibraryColorRGBFromCMYK to "Printing"

This doesn't get you CMYK output, but it's the best you can do under 
Windows. Note, however, that setting GetLibraryColorRGBFromCMYK to 
"Printing" might not give such good results with the predefined color 
libraries (see above).

Sue,

Use the technique described by Mike Hardy to create your own custom
colour library to ensure that FM creates the expected colours.

Q: why are you manually doing the separations. This is now normally
done from composite PDFs at the ripping stage.

Oh my. Thank you so very much! This is priceless information.

I am not doing separations, I was just inspecting the conversion results in Acrobat using the Output Preview. A color C100, B40 should print on only the cyan and black plates, but instead, I get sort of a mish-mash of colors on all the plates. I will have to carefully study this information and make a color library for my company's colors.

I can't thank you enough!