🚀 go-pugleaf

The way I do it is to do View > Color > Definitions. The default "Name" is "New Color 1". Backspace through this default name and type in my preferred new name. Then click Add.

Now change the color values as needed. Click Done. The new color name should now appear in the list of colors in the document and be able to be selected.

For example, if I use Paragraph Designer, I can now see the new color's name listed under the Default Font > Color dropdown.

Be sure to save the document so that the new color is saved.

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Note to forum posters: help us help you -- always post your exact FM version, including the "pxxx" numbers from the Help > About window, so that we have a fighting chance in giving appropriate assistance.

Thank you Sheila and Art.

Sheila, that is exactly what I've been doing, and nothing is "done."

Art, Yes, I've tried it with nothing selected.

In color views the colors I've created all show up in View 1. I have clicked the "set" button, and saved the document.

Still, in the Tools Palette > Colors, it is not listed, nor can I guess any other way to access the colors showing in "View 1" such as to actually use them.

Is this Version 8 just junk, or what gives?

Arnis, thank you too.

All of this you have described is SOP, standard operating procedure, and that is what I've tried, much as I would in Illustrator.

However, in Adobe FrameMaker 8, nothing happens. The color appears in View 1, whatever that is, and nowhere else. It is not available to be used any which way.

stevenjs,

How exactly (i.e. what options, buttons, etc.) are you trying to get
the colour for your use?

If it's defined and you can see it in View 1 (these are FM's
pseudo-layers, you can toggle colours on or off in different views),
then it will be available to you in the various designers and in the
graphics palette tool.

To apply the colour to a "new"  line, you need to first set the colour
by clicking on the "Set Color" button (third up from the bottom on the
Tools Palette) and select it from the list. The swatch should change
to the selected colour.

Then draw your line and it should be rendered in the correct colour.

To change the colour of an existing line, either use the Graphics >
Properties and set the value in that dialog window, or select the line
and use the Set color button on the Tools palette to change it.

Steven, what specific version, from Help > About. Although we can certainly sense your irritation and we'll do our best to assist you, we can't sense the version you're using.

The precise version is 8.0p277.

"If it's defined and you can see it in View 1, then it will be available to you in the various designers and in the graphics palette tool."

Arnis, I understand that is what is supposed to happen. The problem is that it does NOT. The color is not there to select.

stevenjs,

Exactly what is the colour that you're defining and how many colours
are already defined?

Have you tried saving the File to MIF format and checking to see if
the colour is in the Color catalog there? Note: get Mifbrowse from
http://www.wideman-one.com/gw/tech/framemaker/mifbrowse.htm to make
viewing the structure of the MIF easier.

Have you tried doing a MIF wash, i.e. save to MIF and re-import the
MIF?

If it's in the catalog (from inspecting the MIF using Mifbroswe), and
you don't have hundreds of colour definitions, like RGB10:30:75, and
still can't see it in any of your designers or tools palette, then
something may be hosed with your installation of FM, and you might
have to try a re-install.

I select new color from the color definitions, and make an 80% Red, zero % Green, 10% blue. Add, and Done buttons.

I have also chosen the Munsel library and selected a burgundy-like color from there.

Both show in Normal, View 1.

There were, are and remain only 33 colors in the tools > color palette, none of which are the ones I defined.

I'll see if I can do the MIF thing and get back to you.

how do you 're-import the MIF' ? File > Import? into a blank .fm document? into the .fm I'm working on?

where in this Mifbrowse thing do I find the color catalog?

I already know I don't have hundreds of colors in the catalog without any of this MIF merry-go-round. There's a long, long list in "View 1" but exactly 33 in the catalog.

Ah,ha ! ;-)

I re-opened the .mif and lo, behold the colors I'd defined !

I saved the .mif back over the .fm I'd been working on, and the colors are still there.

That solves the immediate problem.

So what do I conclude, FrameMaker 8 is a POS unless you take a ride on the MIF merry-go-round?

>There were, are and remain only 33 colors in the tools > color palette, none of which are the ones I defined.
>

FM only has 15 pre-defined colours: Cyan, Magenta, Yellow, Black, Red,
Green, Blue 

and new for FM8 are: Dark Grey, Pale Green, Forest Green, Royal Blue,
Mauve, Light Salmon, Olive and Salmon.

Anything else is user supplied.

When you try to select the colour from the Tools Palete "Set Color"
button, is there by any chance a little inverted triangle at the right
side of the list at the bottom? If so, that means that you've used up
the available slots in the GUI display and FM can't display any more
colours through this interface. However, the Graphics > Object
Properties display should let you see all of the colours in the drop
down list there.

If some of those 33 colours are ones that you don't want nor need, I'd
suggest deleting them from the catalog to make more room for the ones
that you want.

Well I have to say, as usability expert, the FM GUI interface is an unequivocal POS !

Graphics > Object Properties does NOT display any more colors than the tools color palette.

Where/how then does one delete colors?

I have half a dozen colors used in the document, no more. Certainly I did NOT define the interminable list of colors shown in "View 1."

no, I take that back. There is no interminable list in View 1. There is exactly the same list shown in Graphics > Object Properties and the tools color palette.

To delete colors, View > Color Definitions, select color in dropdown and hit the Delete button. The Delete button is only active for user-defined colors.

If you have hundreds of colors defined, maybe as RGB values, Frame is probably picking them up from PNG graphics in your files.

To delete a few colors, you would use the Color View dialog box.. but select the subtly-named Delete button instead of Add.

Art

Thank you all for your kind help with the immediate problem.

The larger problem, garbageware developed and sold by Adobe, remains.

Steven, this might come as a surprise to you, but we, your fellow users, here, in the FrameMaker forum, are generally polite, respectful of each other, and open to the idea that "maybe we just don't get it yet". You seem to be under the impression that venting at us is acceptable forum behavior. It is not. You might want to check behind you for burned bridges. <mark-as-ignore>

For what it is worth...

I never do anything in View > Color > Views. Not sure what color views are, but am sure they have nothing to do with color definitions.

I create colors in View > Color > Definitions, as described by others earlier. When I click Done, the new color shows up immediately in the Set Color tool in the Drawing Tools and appears in the color drop-down in the Object Properties. There is no need to do the MIF route. I have never run into the 33 color limit as mentioned earlier.

For me, FrameMaker is working as advertised.

PEBKC

Frankly, if you can't distinguish between a user and app. failures, please do mark-as-ignore. There's nothing impolite to anyone in this forum in stating the simple fact that an Adobe product is junk.

As for venting the fact, I refuse to subscribe to the notion one should be calm about deceitful advertising and junkware, whether Adobe's or anyone else's.

I wish I had never opened FrameMaker. I got it expressly because it is advertised to import seamlessly into RoboHelp 7. It does not, and RoboHelp 7 is likewise rife with deceitful interface functionality that simply does not work. Lie-ware.

Adobe has two fine products, Photoshop and Illustrator. Based on Illustrator, InDesign also seems to behave quite well and I'd have gone with that app if I'd known about Adobe's RoboHelp and FrameMaker barefaced contempt for usability.

Really, FM is a dog among dogs.

Dear Steven,

I can understand your frustration with FrameMaker's sometimes-opaque instructions and explanations. I have made my living in printing and publishing for more than 30 years and it has the steepest learning curve of any application I have tackled.

That said, it is perfect for certain types of publications. I took over production on a 400-page catalog crammed with graphics and done in Ventura. After putting up with terror-induced insomnia caused by Ventura crashing 8-10 times EVERY DAY, I talked the customer into letting me rebuild the catalog in FrameMaker. That was five years ago and FrameMaker has crashed fewer than ten times since, usually while I was placing a giant graphic.

The "MIF run-around" has proved invaluable. My first use of it was to duplicate a specific rule style the customer insisted on for his tables. As far as I know, FrameMaker is the only application that allows users access to its source code, and MIF is the means.

As for the mysterious Color Views: I did a textbook in Framemaker in two editions--Student and Teacher. The Teacher edition was output as PDF with the magenta plate visible--the Answers throughout the book. To output the Student edition, I switched to a different Color View that made the magenta plate invisible. One file--two books--in just a few keystrokes.

I assume you were forced to use Framemaker for this project. I wish you better luck with it as you proceed.

Many thanks Nancy.

I'd been word processing for 16 years before moving into usability and instructional design. Have heard other horrors about Ventura.

Good to hear from a pro.

Software developers don't listen to users, they do what they please in abject ignorance and vain presumption, and if it someohow manages to be better than whatever beast is current, people put up with it, or call it a godsend.

Look at MS Word. I declare this software is an act of terrorism. And it's now a de facto standard. Shame on everyone.

I don't give them a millimeter. From a lifetime of experience, I believe zero tolerance is the only way to treat software vendors.