🚀 go-pugleaf

"Radium" <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:1187045374.227004.161110@g12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...

> Does this mean that Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
> can be used -- at least in theory -- to give dial-up modem connections
> around the same fast speeds provided by Broadband cable modems?
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Radium
>

Radium, we know you claim to suffer from aspergers and when you troll
and crosspost to multiple groups you do at least attempt to follow up
with an apoligy, but it dosen't detract from the fact that you're an 
annoying
juvenile fool. 

"Radium" <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:1187045374.227004.161110@g12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> Hi:
>
> Quotes from 
> http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.basics/msg/0c013cf5371da8dc?hl=en&
> :
>
>>Multiple-level quadrature modulation,
>>"constellation modulation",
>>is most common for packing
>>lots of bits per Hz of bandwidth.
>>The more you pack,
>>the better the s/n ratio has to be.
>>
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrature_amplitude_modulation
>>
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constellation_diagram
>
> Does this mean that Quadrature Modulation and Constellation 
> Modulation
> can be used -- at least in theory -- to give dial-up modem 
> connections
> around the same fast speeds provided by Broadband cable modems?


It's called aDSL.  Uses the same phone line as your analog modem.  Go 
search on Wikipedia or Google for info. 

On Aug 13, 4:21 pm, "Vanguard" <vangu...@mail.invalid> wrote:
> "Radium" <gluceg...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1187045374.227004.161110@g12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > Hi:
>
> > Quotes from
> >http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.basics/msg/0c013cf5371...
> > :
>
> >>Multiple-level quadrature modulation,
> >>"constellation modulation",
> >>is most common for packing
> >>lots of bits per Hz of bandwidth.
> >>The more you pack,
> >>the better the s/n ratio has to be.
>
> >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrature_amplitude_modulation
>
> >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constellation_diagram
>
> > Does this mean that Quadrature Modulation and Constellation
> > Modulation
> > can be used -- at least in theory -- to give dial-up modem
> > connections
> > around the same fast speeds provided by Broadband cable modems?
>
> It's called aDSL.  Uses the same phone line as your analog modem.  Go
> search on Wikipedia or Google for info.

Does ADSL also make the sounds associated with the dial-up modem --
i.e. the sounds that result as a computer connects to the net via its
dial-up modem?

On Aug 13, 4:27 pm, Radium <gluceg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Aug 13, 4:21 pm, "Vanguard" <vangu...@mail.invalid> wrote:
>
>
>
> > "Radium" <gluceg...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:1187045374.227004.161110@g12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > Hi:
>
> > > Quotes from
> > >http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.basics/msg/0c013cf5371...
> > > :
>
> > >>Multiple-level quadrature modulation,
> > >>"constellation modulation",
> > >>is most common for packing
> > >>lots of bits per Hz of bandwidth.
> > >>The more you pack,
> > >>the better the s/n ratio has to be.
>
> > >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrature_amplitude_modulation
>
> > >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constellation_diagram
>
> > > Does this mean that Quadrature Modulation and Constellation
> > > Modulation
> > > can be used -- at least in theory -- to give dial-up modem
> > > connections
> > > around the same fast speeds provided by Broadband cable modems?
>
> > It's called aDSL.  Uses the same phone line as your analog modem.  Go
> > search on Wikipedia or Google for info.
>
> Does ADSL also make the sounds associated with the dial-up modem --
> i.e. the sounds that result as a computer connects to the net via its
> dial-up modem?

OOPS! I forget that those sounds only occur on analog modem. ADSL is
obviously digital.

My question was can Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
allow analog dial-up modems to have the same speed as cable modems?
Not any kind of DSL, just analog.

Can the analog phone line make use of the above two modulations
schemes to achieve cable-modem speeds at the voiceband frequencies
used by the analog dial-up modem?

NO! just use DSL it's cheaper, better, and faster, why re-invent the wheel.


-- 

Newsgroup Trolls. Read about mine here http://www.pcbutts1.com/downloads
The list grows. Leythos the stalker http://www.leythosthestalker.com, David 
H. Lipman, Max M Wachtell III  aka What's in a Name?, Fitz,
Rhonda Lea Kirk, Meat Plow, F Kwatu F, George Orwell



"Radium" <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:1187047992.660981.318810@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 13, 4:27 pm, Radium <gluceg...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Aug 13, 4:21 pm, "Vanguard" <vangu...@mail.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> > "Radium" <gluceg...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> >news:1187045374.227004.161110@g12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> > > Hi:
>>
>> > > Quotes from
>> > >http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.basics/msg/0c013cf5371...
>> > > :
>>
>> > >>Multiple-level quadrature modulation,
>> > >>"constellation modulation",
>> > >>is most common for packing
>> > >>lots of bits per Hz of bandwidth.
>> > >>The more you pack,
>> > >>the better the s/n ratio has to be.
>>
>> > >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrature_amplitude_modulation
>>
>> > >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constellation_diagram
>>
>> > > Does this mean that Quadrature Modulation and Constellation
>> > > Modulation
>> > > can be used -- at least in theory -- to give dial-up modem
>> > > connections
>> > > around the same fast speeds provided by Broadband cable modems?
>>
>> > It's called aDSL.  Uses the same phone line as your analog modem.  Go
>> > search on Wikipedia or Google for info.
>>
>> Does ADSL also make the sounds associated with the dial-up modem --
>> i.e. the sounds that result as a computer connects to the net via its
>> dial-up modem?
>
> OOPS! I forget that those sounds only occur on analog modem. ADSL is
> obviously digital.
>
> My question was can Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
> allow analog dial-up modems to have the same speed as cable modems?
> Not any kind of DSL, just analog.
>
> Can the analog phone line make use of the above two modulations
> schemes to achieve cable-modem speeds at the voiceband frequencies
> used by the analog dial-up modem?
> 

> Does this mean that Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
> can be used -- at least in theory -- to give dial-up modem connections
> around the same fast speeds provided by Broadband cable modems?

Dialup is not capable of anything close to cable internet speeds. To make 
matters worse, if you are in an area where DLS or Cable internet is not 
available, the quality of your phone lines is probably not as good as in the 
highly populated areas.

If you want broadband speeds you need a broadband connection. 

> My question was can Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
> allow analog dial-up modems to have the same speed as cable modems?
> Not any kind of DSL, just analog.

Is this the idiot who likes to sit and listen to the modem tones from 
Sweden? 

*-* On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 00:26:29 GMT,
*-* In Article VE6wi.57571$fJ5.18340@pd7urf1no,
*-* Noozer wrote
*-* About Re: Increasing the speed of dial-up to that of cable -- 
possible?

>> My question was can Quadrature Modulation and Constellation
>> Modulation allow analog dial-up modems to have the same speed as
>> cable modems? Not any kind of DSL, just analog.

> Is this the idiot who likes to sit and listen to the modem tones
> from Sweden?

      Netherlands, not Sweden.  Yes.

                                         Ken Whiton

     FIDO: 1:132/152
InterNet: kenwhiton@surfglobal.net.INVAL (remove the obvious to reply)

Back in the day before hi-speed I used to could diagnose connection problems 
by listening to the modem sounds when I worked for AT&T. ;0)


-- 

Newsgroup Trolls. Read about mine here http://www.pcbutts1.com/downloads
The list grows. Leythos the stalker http://www.leythosthestalker.com, David 
H. Lipman, Max M Wachtell III  aka What's in a Name?, Fitz,
Rhonda Lea Kirk, Meat Plow, F Kwatu F, George Orwell



"Noozer" <dont.spam@me.here> wrote in message 
news:VE6wi.57571$fJ5.18340@pd7urf1no...
>
>> My question was can Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
>> allow analog dial-up modems to have the same speed as cable modems?
>> Not any kind of DSL, just analog.
>
> Is this the idiot who likes to sit and listen to the modem tones from 
> Sweden?
> 

On Mon, 13 Aug 2007 15:49:34 -0700, Radium
<glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote:

>Hi:
>
>Quotes from http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.basics/msg/0c013cf5371da8dc?hl=en&
>:
>
>>Multiple-level quadrature modulation,
>>"constellation modulation",
>>is most common for packing
>>lots of bits per Hz of bandwidth.
>>The more you pack,
>>the better the s/n ratio has to be.
>>
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrature_amplitude_modulation
>>
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constellation_diagram
>
>Does this mean that Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
>can be used -- at least in theory -- to give dial-up modem connections
>around the same fast speeds provided by Broadband cable modems?
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>Radium

No, and you're "doing it again", drifting off into crazy
wasteful nonsense. If all they had to do to get broadband
cable speeds was modulate differently, they'd have done it
years ago.  They did actually, but it had a cap too low to
make it marketable vs cable or ADSL.

On Mon, 13 Aug 2007 23:33:12 -0000, Radium
<glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote:


>My question was can Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
>allow analog dial-up modems to have the same speed as cable modems?
>Not any kind of DSL, just analog.
>
>Can the analog phone line make use of the above two modulations
>schemes to achieve cable-modem speeds at the voiceband frequencies
>used by the analog dial-up modem?

The answer is no, it can't.  Plain old twisted pair bell
wire cannot retain the analog signal at the sufficiently
high frequencies necessary to come anywhere near ISDN, ADSL,
let alone *cable* broadband speeds.

If you had bothered to do some research you would know this.

I recommmend you do some basic, prerequisite learning of
basic core technologies before trying to bite off more than
you can chew.  The building blocks of education are not
trying to invent some new thing when you don't even know how
the old things worked.

"Radium" <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:1187045374.227004.161110@g12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> Does this mean that Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
> can be used -- at least in theory -- to give dial-up modem connections
> around the same fast speeds provided by Broadband cable modems?

Why use a dial up modem when there is DSL/ADSL that does what you just 
described. 

"Radium" <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:1187047674.362936.294950@g12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 13, 4:21 pm, "Vanguard" <vangu...@mail.invalid> wrote:
>> "Radium" <gluceg...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:1187045374.227004.161110@g12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>
>>
>> > Hi:
>>
>> > Quotes from
>> >http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.basics/msg/0c013cf5371...
>> > :
>>
>> >>Multiple-level quadrature modulation,
>> >>"constellation modulation",
>> >>is most common for packing
>> >>lots of bits per Hz of bandwidth.
>> >>The more you pack,
>> >>the better the s/n ratio has to be.
>>
>> >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrature_amplitude_modulation
>>
>> >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constellation_diagram
>>
>> > Does this mean that Quadrature Modulation and Constellation
>> > Modulation
>> > can be used -- at least in theory -- to give dial-up modem
>> > connections
>> > around the same fast speeds provided by Broadband cable modems?
>>
>> It's called aDSL.  Uses the same phone line as your analog modem.  Go
>> search on Wikipedia or Google for info.
>
> Does ADSL also make the sounds associated with the dial-up modem --
> i.e. the sounds that result as a computer connects to the net via its
> dial-up modem?

You are an idiot
> 

kony wrote:
> On Mon, 13 Aug 2007 23:33:12 -0000, Radium
> <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> 
>> My question was can Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
>> allow analog dial-up modems to have the same speed as cable modems?
>> Not any kind of DSL, just analog.
>>
>> Can the analog phone line make use of the above two modulations
>> schemes to achieve cable-modem speeds at the voiceband frequencies
>> used by the analog dial-up modem?
> 
> The answer is no, it can't.  Plain old twisted pair bell
> wire cannot retain the analog signal at the sufficiently
> high frequencies necessary to come anywhere near ISDN, ADSL,
> let alone *cable* broadband speeds.
> 
> If you had bothered to do some research you would know this.
> 
> I recommmend you do some basic, prerequisite learning of
> basic core technologies before trying to bite off more than
> you can chew.  The building blocks of education are not
> trying to invent some new thing when you don't even know how
> the old things worked.

Even worse than the wire (local loop) is the analog bandwidth 
restriction of 4Khz when a dial connection is carried over any Public 
Switched Telephone Network(PSTN) via digital T-carrier equipment within 
a 64K DS-0 channel. (and nearly 100% of calls are carried such today).

The "56K V.90" modem is a "hack" that tries to take advantage of such 
connections.

--reed

"pcbutts1" <pcbutts1@leythosthestalker.com> wrote in message
news:f9qv33$r68$1@blackhelicopter.databasix.com...
> Back in the day before hi-speed I used to could diagnose connection
problems
> by listening to the modem sounds when I worked for AT&T. ;0)

How do you diagnose them now?  I've had no f*ing end of modem and
connection problems.

Why don't you try it and find out?

Larry

"Radium" <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:1187047992.660981.318810@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
: On Aug 13, 4:27 pm, Radium <gluceg...@gmail.com> wrote:
: > On Aug 13, 4:21 pm, "Vanguard" <vangu...@mail.invalid> wrote:
: >
:
: OOPS! I forget that those sounds only occur on analog modem. ADSL is
: obviously digital.
:
: My question was can Quadrature Modulation and Constellation Modulation
: allow analog dial-up modems to have the same speed as cable modems?
: Not any kind of DSL, just analog.
:
: Can the analog phone line make use of the above two modulations
: schemes to achieve cable-modem speeds at the voiceband frequencies
: used by the analog dial-up modem?
: 



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

 "DemoDisk" <packrat@nospam.com> wrote:

>
>"pcbutts1" <pcbutts1@leythosthestalker.com> wrote in message
>news:f9qv33$r68$1@blackhelicopter.databasix.com...
>> Back in the day before hi-speed I used to could diagnose connection
>problems
>> by listening to the modem sounds when I worked for AT&T. ;0)

>How do you diagnose them now?  I've had no f*ing end of modem and
>connection problems.

You keep the speaker on until it connects and listen to them.

You can listen to them negotiate settings between the two, and tell if
they are going to connect or an ATZ is in order.

Running a 6 line BBS I kept the speakers on - loved to hear a connect.

I don't know the tones after 14.4 - dropped the BBS at that before the
higher speeds.

You can always set ATS10=200 that will keep you connected :) even if
the other modem drops carrier.

Google: AT modem codes 
for more
-- 
Hubble Pans Across Heavens to Harvest 50,000 Evolving Galaxies
http://hubblesite.org/newscenter/archive/releases/2007/06/image/e/warn/

Pennywise@DerryMaine.Gov said in news:bo92c357i6ock9e6poqdfu3mo9m9u0mmv3@
4ax.com:

>  "DemoDisk" <packrat@nospam.com> wrote:
> 
>>
>>"pcbutts1" <pcbutts1@leythosthestalker.com> wrote in message
>>news:f9qv33$r68$1@blackhelicopter.databasix.com...
>>> Back in the day before hi-speed I used to could diagnose connection
>>problems
>>> by listening to the modem sounds when I worked for AT&T. ;0)
> 
>>How do you diagnose them now?  I've had no f*ing end of modem and
>>connection problems.
> 
> You keep the speaker on until it connects and listen to them.
> 
> You can listen to them negotiate settings between the two, and tell if
> they are going to connect or an ATZ is in order.
> 
> Running a 6 line BBS I kept the speakers on - loved to hear a connect.
> 
> I don't know the tones after 14.4 - dropped the BBS at that before the
> higher speeds.
> 
> You can always set ATS10=200 that will keep you connected :) even if
> the other modem drops carrier.
> 
> Google: AT modem codes 
> for more

You guys lead far too exciting lifes for me, by gosh! I think there's some 
paint peeling around here I need to watch........

 Rectum Burrrrrrrrn

<Pennywise@DerryMaine.Gov> wrote in message
news:bo92c357i6ock9e6poqdfu3mo9m9u0mmv3@4ax.com...
> "DemoDisk" <packrat@nospam.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >"pcbutts1" <pcbutts1@leythosthestalker.com> wrote in message
> >news:f9qv33$r68$1@blackhelicopter.databasix.com...
> >> Back in the day before hi-speed I used to could diagnose connection
> >problems
> >> by listening to the modem sounds when I worked for AT&T. ;0)
>
> >How do you diagnose them now?  I've had no f*ing end of modem and
> >connection problems.
>
> You keep the speaker on until it connects and listen to them.
>
> You can listen to them negotiate settings between the two, and tell if
> they are going to connect or an ATZ is in order.
>
> Running a 6 line BBS I kept the speakers on - loved to hear a connect.
>
> I don't know the tones after 14.4 - dropped the BBS at that before the
> higher speeds.
>
> You can always set ATS10=200 that will keep you connected :) even if
> the other modem drops carrier.
>
> Google: AT modem codes
> for more
> -- 
> Hubble Pans Across Heavens to Harvest 50,000 Evolving Galaxies
>
http://hubblesite.org/newscenter/archive/releases/2007/06/image/e/warn/


Thanks, Pennywise.    Is it common for an ISP to terminate connections,
even if they're active? I'm sometimes online (dialup) for hours, and
when the clock reaches 4 hrs, pfft, connection ended, whether I'm d/ling
or reading.

Granted, I should get a life, but websurfing has been a good substitute.
Problem is, dialup is
    So            Damn        Slowwwwww.

JPM

"Rectum Burn" <rectumburrrn@hotmailremovethisspamtrap.com> wrote in
message news:46c14bd2$0$1343$834e42db@reader.greatnowhere.com...
> Pennywise@DerryMaine.Gov said in
news:bo92c357i6ock9e6poqdfu3mo9m9u0mmv3@
> 4ax.com:
>
> >  "DemoDisk" <packrat@nospam.com> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>"pcbutts1" <pcbutts1@leythosthestalker.com> wrote in message
> >>news:f9qv33$r68$1@blackhelicopter.databasix.com...
> >>> Back in the day before hi-speed I used to could diagnose
connection
> >>problems
> >>> by listening to the modem sounds when I worked for AT&T. ;0)
> >
> >>How do you diagnose them now?  I've had no f*ing end of modem and
> >>connection problems.
> >
> > You keep the speaker on until it connects and listen to them.
> >
> > You can listen to them negotiate settings between the two, and tell
if
> > they are going to connect or an ATZ is in order.
> >
> > Running a 6 line BBS I kept the speakers on - loved to hear a
connect.
> >
> > I don't know the tones after 14.4 - dropped the BBS at that before
the
> > higher speeds.
> >
> > You can always set ATS10=200 that will keep you connected :) even if
> > the other modem drops carrier.
> >
> > Google: AT modem codes
> > for more
>
> You guys lead far too exciting lifes for me, by gosh! I think there's
some
> paint peeling around here I need to watch........
>
>  Rectum Burrrrrrrrn

A guy who calls himself Rectum Burrrrrrn probably does have better
things to do.

So why are you still here?   And haven't you found a cure for your
condition?

 Rectum Burn <rectumburrrn@hotmailremovethisspamtrap.com> wrote:

>> Running a 6 line BBS I kept the speakers on - loved to hear a connect.

>You guys lead far too exciting lifes for me, by gosh! I think there's some 
>paint peeling around here I need to watch........

I'd love to be able to run a BBS again, but the Internet destroyed
that. Heck would you go here telnet://yccafe.org ? (not mine) and
spend any amount of time? It has WoF...

Coffee's every month to meet whoever wanted to be :) Fresbie games on
demand, it was a good time


-- 

http://wannabepoet.net/img/0001/Mexican.jpg

 Pennywise@DerryMaine.Gov wrote:

> Heck would you go here telnet://yccafe.org

I just noticed that it's a Cnet BBS, this is what I used to run, it's
on an AmigA.
-- 

http://wannabepoet.net/img/0001/Mexican.jpg

On Aug 13, 6:11 pm, kony <s...@spam.com> wrote:

> The answer is no, it can't.  Plain old twisted pair bell
> wire cannot retain the analog signal at the sufficiently
> high frequencies necessary to come anywhere near ISDN, ADSL,
> let alone *cable* broadband speeds.

Why can't telephone wires carry those high frequencies?