🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <35a107a3.0@nnrp1.news.uk.psi.net>,
crossposted to hell and back for the reading pleasure of a huge
international market, 
 "Booga" <andy@genetics.co.uk> writes:

|> Anyone want a job.

|> These recruitment agencies keep sending donkeys round for jobs ;)

That's because they send all the good candidates to the good companies.

|> We need people who are really dedicated to writing cool stuff, and who can
|> really do the stuff.

How wonderfully articulate.
 
|>  Must be really into sound in general. (eg: talented, or show talent, in
|> this area)

I really, really love the sound my espresso machine makes, especially
first thing in the morning. The sound my NT box makes when it begins to
thrash for no apparant reason is somewhat amusing, too.

|>  DirectSound/Music experience not needed, but we will go that way. So be
|> prepared to learn.

Try using complete sentences. To give the impression of intelligence.

|> 25+k after 3 months no problem, if you're good that is :)

25+k what? Rubles? Lira? Yen? Cans of SPAM[tm]?

|> We're based in Oxford so living nearby would be cool, but not that
|> important.

Cool. So commuting from, say, Buenos Aires is okay?
 
|>  We're making a funky little (actually it's enormous) game called
|> Gene-Nation.

Ah... another enormous game for the X86 platform -- just what the world
needs!

|>  We've been running as a company for 18 months now.

Sounds wonderfully stable to me....

|>  We're aiming to complete the title for Q1/Q2 99.

I'm starting a betting pool. 

|>  We're seven chilled guys, who just love to make games.
|>  We'd like to work 9-5 but we can't.

Well, one day you might be able to get a job.
 

I am also tired of people boasting..Get to the real world.It takes REAL PPL
AND REAL EFFORT to build something REAL. Be REAL AND JUST THINK WHO PLAYS
X86 BASED games??????President Nixon???I still doubt it...

Billy Chambless <billy@cast.msstate.edu> wrote in article
<6nrb7v$2bh$1@nntp.msstate.edu>...
> In article <35a107a3.0@nnrp1.news.uk.psi.net>,
> crossposted to hell and back for the reading pleasure of a huge
> international market, 
>  "Booga" <andy@genetics.co.uk> writes:
> 
> |> Anyone want a job.
> 
> |> These recruitment agencies keep sending donkeys round for jobs ;)
> 
> That's because they send all the good candidates to the good companies.
> 
> |> We need people who are really dedicated to writing cool stuff, and who
can
> |> really do the stuff.
> 
> How wonderfully articulate.
>  
> |>  Must be really into sound in general. (eg: talented, or show talent,
in
> |> this area)
> 
> I really, really love the sound my espresso machine makes, especially
> first thing in the morning. The sound my NT box makes when it begins to
> thrash for no apparant reason is somewhat amusing, too.
> 
> |>  DirectSound/Music experience not needed, but we will go that way. So
be
> |> prepared to learn.
> 
> Try using complete sentences. To give the impression of intelligence.
> 
> |> 25+k after 3 months no problem, if you're good that is :)
> 
> 25+k what? Rubles? Lira? Yen? Cans of SPAM[tm]?
> 
> |> We're based in Oxford so living nearby would be cool, but not that
> |> important.
> 
> Cool. So commuting from, say, Buenos Aires is okay?
>  
> |>  We're making a funky little (actually it's enormous) game called
> |> Gene-Nation.
> 
> Ah... another enormous game for the X86 platform -- just what the world
> needs!
> 
> |>  We've been running as a company for 18 months now.
> 
> Sounds wonderfully stable to me....
> 
> |>  We're aiming to complete the title for Q1/Q2 99.
> 
> I'm starting a betting pool. 
> 
> |>  We're seven chilled guys, who just love to make games.
> |>  We'd like to work 9-5 but we can't.
> 
> Well, one day you might be able to get a job.
>  
> 

Aamer Nazir wrote:
> 
> I am also tired of people boasting..Get to the real world.It takes REAL PPL
> AND REAL EFFORT to build something REAL. Be REAL AND JUST THINK WHO PLAYS
> X86 BASED games??????President Nixon???I still doubt it...

I do. And I enjoy myself immensly at a good game of "StarCraft"
or "Forsaken" at home after a full day of REAL work. "Hexen2"
will have to wait till I get my new 3D acceleration card, though.
But I'll be buying "Baldurs Gate" the very second they put it in
the shelf. Same goes for "Diablo II".

An for topicality: there's probably a lot of standard C code in
the engines of those games. I wonder if there are any game
programmers present here in c.l.c.

Stephan
(initiator of the campaign against grumpiness in c.l.c)

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Booga wrote:

> Anyone want a job..

...
if I "REALLY know the stuff"  I would'nt work for 25K
hell, I wouldn't work for 40k

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--------------737445930A5834C309357A4B--

Jay Walsh wrote in message <35A2659C.6239EB5E@earthling.net>...
>
>
>Booga wrote:
>
>> Anyone want a job..
>
>...
>if I "REALLY know the stuff"  I would'nt work for 25K
>hell, I wouldn't work for 40k
>

This has always puzzled me.  It seems like programmers in the UK get paid
peanuts, but they're kinda smug about it.  I assume the 25K here is 25,000
UKP.  Which is like 40,000 USD.  Which is less than somebody fresh out of
college can expect to make.  For a 9-5 job.  While they're being paid to go
to night school to get a Master's and make even more money.

--
Mike Smith.  No, the other one.

On 7 Jul 1998, Aamer Nazir wrote:

> I am also tired of people boasting..Get to the real world.It takes REAL PPL
> AND REAL EFFORT to build something REAL. Be REAL AND JUST THINK WHO PLAYS
> X86 BASED games??????President Nixon???I still doubt it...

As President Nixon is, sadly enough, deceased, I think he would find it
quite difficult to play "X86 BASED games."

-- 
(initiator of the campaign for grumpiness where grumpiness is due in c.l.c)

This article is copyright 1998 by firewind. It is licensed under the
OpenContent license (http://www.opencontent.org/opl.txt).

On Tue, 7 Jul 1998, Stephan Wilms wrote:

> An for topicality: there's probably a lot of standard C code in
> the engines of those games. 

Don't count on it. Ever checked out the Doom code? I couldn't stop shuddering.

-- 
(initiator of the campaign for grumpiness where grumpiness is due in c.l.c)

This article is copyright 1998 by firewind. It is licensed under the
OpenContent license (http://www.opencontent.org/opl.txt).

Stephan Wilms wrote:

> Aamer Nazir wrote:
> >
> > I am also tired of people boasting..Get to the real world.It takes REAL PPL
> > AND REAL EFFORT to build something REAL. Be REAL AND JUST THINK WHO PLAYS
> > X86 BASED games??????President Nixon???I still doubt it...
>
> I do. And I enjoy myself immensly at a good game of "StarCraft"
> or "Forsaken" at home after a full day of REAL work. "Hexen2"
> will have to wait till I get my new 3D acceleration card, though.
> But I'll be buying "Baldurs Gate" the very second they put it in
> the shelf. Same goes for "Diablo II".

me too.. forsaken rules!

> An for topicality: there's probably a lot of standard C code in
> the engines of those games. I wonder if there are any game
> programmers present here in c.l.c.
>
> Stephan
> (initiator of the campaign against grumpiness in c.l.c)



--
"For every complex problem there is a solution that is concise, clear, simple,
and wrong."

(H. L. Mencken)

>This has always puzzled me.  It seems like programmers in the UK get paid
>peanuts, but they're kinda smug about it.  I assume the 25K here is 25,000
>UKP.  Which is like 40,000 USD.  Which is less than somebody fresh out of
>college can expect to make.  For a 9-5 job.  While they're being paid to go
>to night school to get a Master's and make even more money.


You'll get *maximum* 18K (USD) in my country (russia) for the job he is
proposing.

regards,
alexander.

firewind wrote:
> 
> Don't count on it. Ever checked out the Doom code? I couldn't stop shuddering.

Why?

Markus

>me too.. forsaken rules!
>
We're very pleased that you like it.

firewind wrote in message ...
>On Tue, 7 Jul 1998, Stephan Wilms wrote:
>
>> An for topicality: there's probably a lot of standard C code in
>> the engines of those games.
>
>Don't count on it. Ever checked out the Doom code? I couldn't stop
shuddering.

Ever worked with the Doom code? I couldn't stop crying.

On Wed, 08 Jul 1998 12:03:46 +0200, Markus Becker
<becker@zess.uni-siegen.de> wrote:
>> Don't count on it. Ever checked out the Doom code? I couldn't stop shuddering.
>Why?
From what I remember poking around it and the Wolfenstein 3D code, it
is very spaghetti-esque and commenting is not very useful. Of course,
I believe iD once said that both of these were early versions, perhaps
before they got it in gear.

Duggan wrote:
> ...
> From what I remember poking around it and the Wolfenstein 3D code, it
> is very spaghetti-esque and commenting is not very useful. Of course,
> I believe iD once said that both of these were early versions, perhaps
> before they got it in gear.

I have my doubts.  In the 20 odd years that I've been programming or
looking at source code (in all sorts of languages), rarely have I seen
what appears to be an effort to "clean up" code.  If anything, the
opposite is true.  The only time you see "cleaning" is when someone goes
in and rewrites it completely.

If you think about it, it goes a long way in explaining the phrase you
see often "every program has bugs".  I'm not saying it's the sole reason
but I definitely think it doesn't help.

Booga (andy@genetics.co.uk) wrote:
: Anyone want a job..

<snip>

: We have vacancies for 2 people.

: First off. 9-5'ers don't even bother replying!  They're not cushy little
: numbers.
: We need people who are really dedicated to writing cool stuff, and who can
: really do the stuff.

: Good salaries all round.
: 25+k after 3 months no problem, if you're good that is :)
: Even more if your better than just plain old good =)
: P45 if your not :(

Okay so the deal is long hours for 25k pound.  Fat chance, I spend that much
on lunches in a year :-).  If you want decent people, you better ante up.

: Andy Mucho
: Genetics Ltd.
: andy@genetics.co.uk

AC

On Wed, 8 Jul 1998 11:49:42 +0400, "Alexander Pankratov"
<pankratov@geocities.com.spamless> wrote:


>
>You'll get *maximum* 18K (USD) in my country (russia) for the job he is
>proposing.
>
>regards,
>alexander.
>

Well, the general wages in russia tend to be lower then in other
countries.  Although it's changing so fast, you'll never know what
will be in five years.

> >I am also tired of people boasting..Get to the real world.It takes REAL PPL
> >AND REAL EFFORT to build something REAL. Be REAL AND JUST THINK WHO PLAYS
> >X86 BASED games??????President Nixon???I still doubt it...

Who plays X86 games?   I've heard of a few that were somewhat popular...  What
were they called again?  Oh yeah...  Doom2, Quake1, Quake2, Unreal, Diablo,
Forsaken, etc...

--

Warren Marshall
"Taskmaster"

Level designer for Wheel of Time
www.wheeloftime.com

> > From what I remember poking around it and the Wolfenstein 3D code, it
> > is very spaghetti-esque and commenting is not very useful. Of course,
> > I believe iD once said that both of these were early versions, perhaps
> > before they got it in gear.

Bear mind mind too that game programmers live in a somewhat different world
than application programmers. ... once the game is done, they move on.
Cleaning up the code is really a worthless effort for them since they're
never going to see it again.

And while they're writing that game, they're staring at it all day
everyday.  There's not going to be a maintenance programmer 3 years from
now.  When it's done, it's done.  It gets shelved and they move on to the
next project.

Kind of a different story than a large application that has to have new
versions made of it and stuff...  I'm not defending sloppy code, but I think
that this is where some of it stems from.

--

Warren Marshall
"Taskmaster"

Level designer for Wheel of Time
www.wheeloftime.com