🚀 go-pugleaf

is this serious?
"Alf" <alf21@interia.pl> wrote in message
news:47da921c.0207311827.26f9012@posting.google.com...
> I am a Polish National looking to selling my kidney. I am 21. I dont
> smoke,dont do drugs. I have type 0+ blood. Please send your bids to
> alf21@interia.pl

Doesn't matter. It is illegal in the United States. There was some
jokester trying to put an organ on eBay at one time. Of course it was a
prank but it pointed out to everyone in the U.S. that it is illegal to
sell organs here.

its crazy. If you want to donate a kidney its one thing but selling one is
crazy. I'm glad its illegal.
"deuce" <deuce.10@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:3D48B4B3.6088BFDC@attbi.com...
> Doesn't matter. It is illegal in the United States. There was some
> jokester trying to put an organ on eBay at one time. Of course it was a
> prank but it pointed out to everyone in the U.S. that it is illegal to
> sell organs here.
>

"nadia" <nsalem5@worldnet.att.net> wrote:

>is this serious?

Do a web search on the word "troll."

Meanwhile, I bid $1.  Cash on delivery.  FedEx or UPS preferred.

nadia <nsalem5@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:tl129.17443$Kl6.1088147@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> is this serious?

Of course not. Everyone in Europe smokes.




> "Alf" <alf21@interia.pl> wrote in message
> news:47da921c.0207311827.26f9012@posting.google.com...
> > I am a Polish National looking to selling my kidney. I am 21. I dont
> > smoke,dont do drugs. I have type 0+ blood. Please send your bids to
> > alf21@interia.pl
>
>

"deuce" <deuce.10@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:3D48B4B3.6088BFDC@attbi.com...
> Doesn't matter. It is illegal in the United States. There was some

This newsgroup extends outside the US, and indeed organ trade in Eastern
Europe is common.  American nationals often travel to EE for
transplantation.

Dollar is too much and I would demand on removing it myself..  C.O.D.


"Carey Gregory" <antispam8@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:qnhhku0bifbu26tie45ld0i369pb3alsls@4ax.com...
> "nadia" <nsalem5@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
> >is this serious?
>
> Do a web search on the word "troll."
>
> Meanwhile, I bid $1.  Cash on delivery.  FedEx or UPS preferred.
>

"nadia" <nsalem5@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message news:<tl129.17443$Kl6.1088147@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>...
> is this serious?
> "Alf" <alf21@interia.pl> wrote in message
> news:47da921c.0207311827.26f9012@posting.google.com...
> > I am a Polish National looking to selling my kidney. I am 21. I dont
> > smoke,dont do drugs. I have type 0+ blood. Please send your bids to
> > alf21@interia.pl

I would sell mine too.... would save a live and help me out
financially.  It sucks being broke and I'm sure it sucks being on
dialysis - win/win!

Dave

"nadia" <nsalem5@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message news:<zA229.17621$Kl6.1099510@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>...
> its crazy. If you want to donate a kidney its one thing but selling one is
> crazy. I'm glad its illegal.
> "deuce" <deuce.10@attbi.com> wrote in message
> news:3D48B4B3.6088BFDC@attbi.com...
> > Doesn't matter. It is illegal in the United States. There was some
> > jokester trying to put an organ on eBay at one time. Of course it was a
> > prank but it pointed out to everyone in the U.S. that it is illegal to
> > sell organs here.
> >

It's because of thinking like this that there are over 50,000 people
on a waiting list.  You're glad it's illegal while there are this many
people on dialysis that could otherwise be remedied.  Think about it. 
If it were legal, the supply would exceed the demand for the
transplants, therefore making it less expensive than what people are
paying for the years that they are spending on dialysis.

If it saves a life and the seller/donor benefits, what do you care?

I am not in the position where I or one of my family members need a
kidney transplant, but you can bet your bottom dollar that I would
gladly pay whatever was necessary to avoid dialysis and live a normal
life. Legal or not.

And yes, as you may have guessed, I would be willing to sell one of my
perfectly healthy kidneys for the right price (I would just do it
outside of the US where it is legal). (A neg) in case anyone is
interested.

But would I donate one to someone that I don't know for nothing... NO
WAY.

Dave

In article <qnhhku0bifbu26tie45ld0i369pb3alsls@4ax.com>, Carey Gregory 
<antispam8@attbi.com> wrote:
>"nadia" <nsalem5@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
>>is this serious?
>
>Do a web search on the word "troll."
>
>Meanwhile, I bid $1.  Cash on delivery.  FedEx or UPS preferred.
>


Great!    Should I bring the chianti and the fava beans?!?!?!


------------------------------
"A discussion is an exchange of knowledge, as opposed to an argument which is an exchange of ignorance."

I find it ironic that the physicians and hospitals performing the transplants
get paid big time, and the donors get nothing.  I am not saying I am for or
against anything.  I just find it ironic.

Earle Horton
http://members.aol.com/earlerhorton

"nadia" <nsalem5@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:zA229.17621$Kl6.1099510@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> its crazy. If you want to donate a kidney its one thing but selling one is
> crazy. I'm glad its illegal.
> "deuce" <deuce.10@attbi.com> wrote in message
> news:3D48B4B3.6088BFDC@attbi.com...
> > Doesn't matter. It is illegal in the United States. There was some
> > jokester trying to put an organ on eBay at one time. Of course it was a
> > prank but it pointed out to everyone in the U.S. that it is illegal to
> > sell organs here.
> >
>
>

"Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote in message news:<aibtho$12oln3$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de>...
> I find it ironic that the physicians and hospitals performing the transplants
> get paid big time, and the donors get nothing.  I am not saying I am for or
> against anything.  I just find it ironic.
> 
Ironic is definitely putting it lightly... more like conspiracy.  

Keep'em on dialysis as long as possible... and still get the fee for
transplanting later down the road.  Besides, we can charge more in 2
years for a transplant.  We don't want to cure them all at once!

This is extreme, I know, and not directed at anyone in particular. 
But, when you have the technology, the willing participants, and the
resources.. what is the average person supposed to think?

Just the way I see things.

Dave

a-neg-kidney@kweeky.com (David) wrote:

>"Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote in message news:<aibtho$12oln3$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de>...
>> I find it ironic that the physicians and hospitals performing the transplants
>> get paid big time, and the donors get nothing.  I am not saying I am for or
>> against anything.  I just find it ironic.
>> 
>Ironic is definitely putting it lightly... more like conspiracy.  

Are you volunteering to become a surgeon and do transplants for free?
Of course, if you don't want to spend 12 years in training, you could
volunteer your time as a nurse, lab tech, janitor, administrator....

>Keep'em on dialysis as long as possible... and still get the fee for
>transplanting later down the road.  Besides, we can charge more in 2
>years for a transplant.  We don't want to cure them all at once!

I was unaware that kidneys were readily available and patients were
being forced to wait unnecessarily.

a-neg-kidney@kweeky.com (David) wrote in message news:<d3416548.0208010401.1793d109@posting.google.com>...
> "nadia" <nsalem5@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message news:<zA229.17621$Kl6.1099510@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>...
> > its crazy. If you want to donate a kidney its one thing but selling one is
> > crazy. I'm glad its illegal.
> > "deuce" <deuce.10@attbi.com> wrote in message
> > news:3D48B4B3.6088BFDC@attbi.com...
> > > Doesn't matter. It is illegal in the United States. There was some
> > > jokester trying to put an organ on eBay at one time. Of course it was a
> > > prank but it pointed out to everyone in the U.S. that it is illegal to
> > > sell organs here.
> > >
> 
> It's because of thinking like this that there are over 50,000 people
> on a waiting list.  You're glad it's illegal while there are this many
> people on dialysis that could otherwise be remedied.  Think about it. 
> If it were legal, the supply would exceed the demand for the
> transplants, therefore making it less expensive than what people are
> paying for the years that they are spending on dialysis.
> 
> If it saves a life and the seller/donor benefits, what do you care?

I care because lifesaving surgery should not simply go to the highest
bidder. One of the most shameful features of our health care "system"
is that benefits
are much better for those who have more money. Let's not fuel this
inequity.

Which is not to say that not paying for organs is the answer to our
health care system problems, merely to say that paying for them would
enhance the worst features of our current health care system.



> I am not in the position where I or one of my family members need a
> kidney transplant, but you can bet your bottom dollar that I would
> gladly pay whatever was necessary to avoid dialysis and live a normal
> life. Legal or not.
> 
> And yes, as you may have guessed, I would be willing to sell one of my
> perfectly healthy kidneys for the right price (I would just do it
> outside of the US where it is legal). (A neg) in case anyone is
> interested.
> 
> But would I donate one to someone that I don't know for nothing... NO
> WAY.
> 
> Dave

Teresa from Oregon wrote:


> > It's because of thinking like this that there are over 50,000 people
> > on a waiting list.  You're glad it's illegal while there are this many
> > people on dialysis that could otherwise be remedied.  Think about it.
> > If it were legal, the supply would exceed the demand for the
> > transplants, therefore making it less expensive than what people are
> > paying for the years that they are spending on dialysis.
> >
> > If it saves a life and the seller/donor benefits, what do you care?
>
> I care because lifesaving surgery should not simply go to the highest
> bidder. One of the most shameful features of our health care "system"
> is that benefits
> are much better for those who have more money. Let's not fuel this
> inequity.

   Let's not fuel the inequity further by saying that
   the "health" care system gives *better* health care
   to the dumb, fat, rich,  marathon runners,
   or even to the neo-thrill-a-day, dip-shit psychologists,
   who pretty much establish what the prices are.

Wake up call............A TRANSPLANT IS NOT A CURE!!!!!!!!  It's just
another form of treatment.

If you sell an organ and it fails are you going to refund their money.  The
legal problems this could cause are boundless.   Not to mention it's just
wrong!

Celeste
--
Kidney 96
****************************************************************************
***********************
In the average time it takes an American to drive to work 45 minutes.
At least 1 person dies! waiting for a life saving transplant.

Get your organ donor card today! at the ~~~~  Transplant Resource Page ~~~~
http://www.TransplantResourcePage.com
****************************************************************************
***********************
85 scrapbook pages done in 2002
"David" <a-neg-kidney@kweeky.com> wrote in message
news:d3416548.0208010401.1793d109@posting.google.com...
| "nadia" <nsalem5@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:<zA229.17621$Kl6.1099510@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>...
| > its crazy. If you want to donate a kidney its one thing but selling one
is
| > crazy. I'm glad its illegal.
| > "deuce" <deuce.10@attbi.com> wrote in message
| > news:3D48B4B3.6088BFDC@attbi.com...
| > > Doesn't matter. It is illegal in the United States. There was some
| > > jokester trying to put an organ on eBay at one time. Of course it was
a
| > > prank but it pointed out to everyone in the U.S. that it is illegal to
| > > sell organs here.
| > >
|
| It's because of thinking like this that there are over 50,000 people
| on a waiting list.  You're glad it's illegal while there are this many
| people on dialysis that could otherwise be remedied.  Think about it.
| If it were legal, the supply would exceed the demand for the
| transplants, therefore making it less expensive than what people are
| paying for the years that they are spending on dialysis.
|
| If it saves a life and the seller/donor benefits, what do you care?
|
| I am not in the position where I or one of my family members need a
| kidney transplant, but you can bet your bottom dollar that I would
| gladly pay whatever was necessary to avoid dialysis and live a normal
| life. Legal or not.
|
| And yes, as you may have guessed, I would be willing to sell one of my
| perfectly healthy kidneys for the right price (I would just do it
| outside of the US where it is legal). (A neg) in case anyone is
| interested.
|
| But would I donate one to someone that I don't know for nothing... NO
| WAY.
|
| Dave

"Doodlebug" <Doodlebug@attbi.com> wrote:

>If you sell an organ and it fails are you going to refund their money.  

Well, you could just give them the other one.....

On Sat, 03 Aug 2002 22:36:42 GMT, Carey Gregory <antispam8@attbi.com>
wrote:

>"Doodlebug" <Doodlebug@attbi.com> wrote:
>
>>If you sell an organ and it fails are you going to refund their money.  
>
>Well, you could just give them the other one.....

I'll back that plan myself.  Where do I sign?

> legal problems this could cause are boundless.   Not to mention it's just
> wrong!
Why?

The facet of this dilemma that no one has mentioned is that selling
organs to the highest bidder turns the donor into a sort of human meat
market. Placing a human being in the position of marketing his/her
parts to the highest bidder is dehumanizing. The poor would be
compelled by "market forces" to sell their organs, while the rich
would get more transplants.  A nightmarish vision of "health care" (I
use the term loosely because only one socioeconomic group's health is
being cared for in this scenario) if ever there was one.

In article <6fa04e22.0208050601.12071e22@posting.google.com>, ttg@attbi.com 
(Teresa from Oregon) wrote:
>The facet of this dilemma that no one has mentioned is that selling
>organs to the highest bidder turns the donor into a sort of human meat
>market. Placing a human being in the position of marketing his/her
>parts to the highest bidder is dehumanizing. The poor would be
>compelled by "market forces" to sell their organs, while the rich
>would get more transplants.  A nightmarish vision of "health care" (I
>use the term loosely because only one socioeconomic group's health is
>being cared for in this scenario) if ever there was one.
        Why is selling the organ any more dehumanizing than selling other 
things in short supply.. your time for instance? 
        If all you are worried about is the class warfare BS, then set it up 
to allow the people that do it now to offer the money for the organ, but they 
still get to decide who gets it based on their current formula. 
        Personally, it is a person's kidney. If they want to part with it, I 
don't see why the government needs to get involved in the transaction part at 
all. 

-----------------------------------
"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late
to work within the system, but too early to shoot
the bastards."-- Claire Wolfe

Working for hourly wages or salary, a form of involuntary servitude, is just
as dehumanizing as what you are describing.  "Placing a human being in the
position of marketing his/her time to the highest bidder is dehumanizing,
etc, etc"  I for one would rather have sold a kidney than gone to college,
gone to graduate school, learned to program computers, a job that truly
sucks, and sold my soul to Microsoft for six long years to earn enough money
to retire.  I am sure that if you had worked and suffered that long at a
thankless job you would now feel the same way.

Earle Horton
http://members.aol.com/earlerhorton

Teresa from Oregon <ttg@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:6fa04e22.0208050601.12071e22@posting.google.com...
> The facet of this dilemma that no one has mentioned is that selling
> organs to the highest bidder turns the donor into a sort of human meat
> market. Placing a human being in the position of marketing his/her
> parts to the highest bidder is dehumanizing. The poor would be
> compelled by "market forces" to sell their organs, while the rich
> would get more transplants.  A nightmarish vision of "health care" (I
> use the term loosely because only one socioeconomic group's health is
> being cared for in this scenario) if ever there was one.

"Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote:


>sold my soul to Microsoft for six long years to earn enough money
>to retire.  I am sure that if you had worked and suffered that long at a
>thankless job you would now feel the same way.

Six whole years, huh?  And you earned enough to retire?  Gosh, you've
had it really rough.  

In article <v4gtkush4qkj8cmvsqkun7htrk03nl1j0n@4ax.com>, Carey Gregory 
<antispam8@attbi.com> wrote:
>"Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
>>sold my soul to Microsoft for six long years to earn enough money
>>to retire.  I am sure that if you had worked and suffered that long at a
>>thankless job you would now feel the same way.
>
>Six whole years, huh?  And you earned enough to retire?  Gosh, you've
>had it really rough.  
>

        I was thinking the same thing.Over the years,  I think I have been out 
on light duty related to OTJ injuries longer than Earle has worked... 

-----------------------------------
"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late
to work within the system, but too early to shoot
the bastards."-- Claire Wolfe

Kurt Ullman <kurtullman@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:JCz39.14938$cI.1151196@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> In article <v4gtkush4qkj8cmvsqkun7htrk03nl1j0n@4ax.com>, Carey Gregory
> <antispam8@attbi.com> wrote:
> >"Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>sold my soul to Microsoft for six long years to earn enough money
> >>to retire.  I am sure that if you had worked and suffered that long at a
> >>thankless job you would now feel the same way.
> >
> >Six whole years, huh?  And you earned enough to retire?  Gosh, you've
> >had it really rough.
> >
>
>         I was thinking the same thing.Over the years,  I think I have been
out
> on light duty related to OTJ injuries longer than Earle has worked...
>

Relatively speaking, perhaps you all have suffered more than I, but the
point I was making is that you shouldn't have to sell a second of your time
to benefit another, by the argument made by the original poster.  "Selling
an organ is dehumanizing."  It might be, but going to work, or going to
school so you can eventually work at a good job, is equally dehumanizing.
People should be free, like wild animals, right?  That particular argument
against selling organs just doesn't fly.

By the way, I have had other jobs, for example worked on a farm in my youth
and suffered as a ski bum for three or four years after retirement.  I
assume also that you haven't written production software code for a large
corporation like Microsoft.  I can assure you that that occupation is a lot
more dehumanizing than nursing.

Earle

> -----------------------------------
> "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late
> to work within the system, but too early to shoot
> the bastards."-- Claire Wolfe

"Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote:

>Relatively speaking, perhaps you all have suffered more than I, but the
>point I was making is that you shouldn't have to sell a second of your time
>to benefit another, by the argument made by the original poster.  "Selling
>an organ is dehumanizing."  

Well, unless you're born into wealth or incredibly lucky, the reality
of the world is that you will either be selling your time to benefit
others, or leaching off those who do.  That's just the way it is.

My objections to selling organs aren't so much that it's dehumanizing.
What I see is a huge, ugly mass of legal, ethical, and social effects
that are harmful to the donor individuals and society at large.

>It might be, but going to work, or going to school so you can eventually 
>work at a good job, is equally dehumanizing.

I disagree that working to better your lot in life is dehumanizing.
Frankly, I think that's a very naive, immature viewpoint.

>By the way, I have had other jobs, for example worked on a farm in my youth
>and suffered as a ski bum for three or four years after retirement.  I
>assume also that you haven't written production software code for a large
>corporation like Microsoft.  I can assure you that that occupation is a lot
>more dehumanizing than nursing.

Bad assumption.  Yes, I've written software for companies like
Microsoft (including Microsoft, btw), and I've been doing it for about
25 years now.  In my teens and college years, I worked at some jobs
that taught me which jobs I *didn't* want to do.  Until you've washed
dishes, driven a cab, or worked on factory assembly lines, you have no
idea what a dehumanizing job is.  Ever wiped poop from someone's butt
at Microsoft?  How about suctioning vomit out of their throat?  Nah,
didn't think so.  Think about what nurses do before you complain about
Microsoft.  Writing software is sheer bliss compared to many jobs out
there.

Carey Gregory <antispam8@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:guqtkuosphv0cib2mompjo9qg14446i9v2@4ax.com...
> "Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >Relatively speaking, perhaps you all have suffered more than I, but the
> >point I was making is that you shouldn't have to sell a second of your
time
> >to benefit another, by the argument made by the original poster.
"Selling
> >an organ is dehumanizing."
>
> Well, unless you're born into wealth or incredibly lucky, the reality
> of the world is that you will either be selling your time to benefit
> others, or leaching off those who do.  That's just the way it is.
>
> My objections to selling organs aren't so much that it's dehumanizing.
> What I see is a huge, ugly mass of legal, ethical, and social effects
> that are harmful to the donor individuals and society at large.

It looks as if your objection to selling organs is that it is a complicated
process with effects that are likely to be harmful.  I agree with this, but
that never stopped our civilization from doing anything before.

>
> >It might be, but going to work, or going to school so you can eventually
> >work at a good job, is equally dehumanizing.
>
> I disagree that working to better your lot in life is dehumanizing.
> Frankly, I think that's a very naive, immature viewpoint.

You equate material success with bettering one's lot in life.  Frankly, I
think that's a very naive, immature viewpoint.  I would much rather have
spent my time studying obscure medieval Latin texts, mediating in Nepal, or
becoming an expert skier, any of which would have "bettered my lot in life"
but not my material situation.  I intentionally chose the path of material
success because I dislike the feeling of hunger.  Again, I do not feel that
this decision has necessarily bettered my lot in life, according to things
that matter.

>
> >By the way, I have had other jobs, for example worked on a farm in my
youth
> >and suffered as a ski bum for three or four years after retirement.  I
> >assume also that you haven't written production software code for a large
> >corporation like Microsoft.  I can assure you that that occupation is a
lot
> >more dehumanizing than nursing.
>
> Bad assumption.  Yes, I've written software for companies like
> Microsoft (including Microsoft, btw), and I've been doing it for about
> 25 years now.  In my teens and college years, I worked at some jobs
> that taught me which jobs I *didn't* want to do.  Until you've washed
> dishes, driven a cab, or worked on factory assembly lines, you have no
> idea what a dehumanizing job is.  Ever wiped poop from someone's butt
> at Microsoft?  How about suctioning vomit out of their throat?  Nah,
> didn't think so.  Think about what nurses do before you complain about
> Microsoft.  Writing software is sheer bliss compared to many jobs out
> there.
>

I have done all of these things.  Coding sucks.  The only thing good about
it is the money.  If it is so great, what are you doing hanging around here?

Earle
http://members.aol.com/earlerhorton

"Six long years to earn enough money to retire." ??? Hey I'm not stupid, but
6 years seems rather short for retirement!
Are you partially responsible for illogical program called "Windows" (Or by
some "Windoze")?? Is so, you didn't earn retirement. You stole it!
Personally, I believe the best OS to date (not perfect, but best) is the
Amiga.  Too bad Billy boy and company managed to tromp it into the ground.
As of OS 2.1 there were three system bugs of any consequence. One could have
been fixed only at the expense of making all previously save floppies
unreadable. The other two were in AMIGABasic (c) Microsoft! No one ever even
attempted to fix them.

 Seriously though, I agree that refusal to allow organ sales is an extreme
position. There must be some middle ground. Perhaps if those with an organ
to sell were permitted to sell it to a common group (UNOS as an example)
from which it would be sent to the next suitable recipient on the list, that
would cover the "Rich get better care" aspect of things.
John
Awaiting liver tx.

"Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote in message
news:aimbfd$1580g8$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> Working for hourly wages or salary, a form of involuntary servitude, is
just
> as dehumanizing as what you are describing.  "Placing a human being in the
> position of marketing his/her time to the highest bidder is dehumanizing,
> etc, etc"  I for one would rather have sold a kidney than gone to college,
> gone to graduate school, learned to program computers, a job that truly
> sucks, and sold my soul to Microsoft for six long years to earn enough
money
> to retire.  I am sure that if you had worked and suffered that long at a
> thankless job you would now feel the same way.
>
> Earle Horton
> http://members.aol.com/earlerhorton
>
> Teresa from Oregon <ttg@attbi.com> wrote in message
> news:6fa04e22.0208050601.12071e22@posting.google.com...
> > The facet of this dilemma that no one has mentioned is that selling
> > organs to the highest bidder turns the donor into a sort of human meat
> > market. Placing a human being in the position of marketing his/her
> > parts to the highest bidder is dehumanizing. The poor would be
> > compelled by "market forces" to sell their organs, while the rich
> > would get more transplants.  A nightmarish vision of "health care" (I
> > use the term loosely because only one socioeconomic group's health is
> > being cared for in this scenario) if ever there was one.
>
>
>

"six long years to earn enough to retire"? My heart bleeds for you.


"Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote in message
news:aimbfd$1580g8$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> Working for hourly wages or salary, a form of involuntary servitude, is
just
> as dehumanizing as what you are describing.  "Placing a human being in the
> position of marketing his/her time to the highest bidder is dehumanizing,
> etc, etc"  I for one would rather have sold a kidney than gone to college,
> gone to graduate school, learned to program computers, a job that truly
> sucks, and sold my soul to Microsoft for six long years to earn enough
money
> to retire.  I am sure that if you had worked and suffered that long at a
> thankless job you would now feel the same way.
>
> Earle Horton
> http://members.aol.com/earlerhorton
>
> Teresa from Oregon <ttg@attbi.com> wrote in message
> news:6fa04e22.0208050601.12071e22@posting.google.com...
> > The facet of this dilemma that no one has mentioned is that selling
> > organs to the highest bidder turns the donor into a sort of human meat
> > market. Placing a human being in the position of marketing his/her
> > parts to the highest bidder is dehumanizing. The poor would be
> > compelled by "market forces" to sell their organs, while the rich
> > would get more transplants.  A nightmarish vision of "health care" (I
> > use the term loosely because only one socioeconomic group's health is
> > being cared for in this scenario) if ever there was one.
>
>
>

"Ronald Austin" <ronaustin1@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:nhO79.10514$I6.891960@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> "six long years to earn enough to retire"? My heart bleeds for you.
>
Well thanks, it now looks as if at least someone appreciates the Hell I went
through.

Earle
>
> "Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:aimbfd$1580g8$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> > Working for hourly wages or salary, a form of involuntary servitude, is
> just
> > as dehumanizing as what you are describing.  "Placing a human being in
the
> > position of marketing his/her time to the highest bidder is
dehumanizing,
> > etc, etc"  I for one would rather have sold a kidney than gone to
college,
> > gone to graduate school, learned to program computers, a job that truly
> > sucks, and sold my soul to Microsoft for six long years to earn enough
> money
> > to retire.  I am sure that if you had worked and suffered that long at a
> > thankless job you would now feel the same way.
> >
> > Earle Horton
> > http://members.aol.com/earlerhorton
> >
> > Teresa from Oregon <ttg@attbi.com> wrote in message
> > news:6fa04e22.0208050601.12071e22@posting.google.com...
> > > The facet of this dilemma that no one has mentioned is that selling
> > > organs to the highest bidder turns the donor into a sort of human meat
> > > market. Placing a human being in the position of marketing his/her
> > > parts to the highest bidder is dehumanizing. The poor would be
> > > compelled by "market forces" to sell their organs, while the rich
> > > would get more transplants.  A nightmarish vision of "health care" (I
> > > use the term loosely because only one socioeconomic group's health is
> > > being cared for in this scenario) if ever there was one.
> >
> >
> >
>
>

Ummm...I thought that was sarcasm. ;-)

Daniel Granot
+-------------------------------------------+
Director - Team GORP
Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
+-------------------------------------------+
"Earle Horton" <earleh@iname.com> wrote in message
news:ajoeo0$1d9pta$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> "Ronald Austin" <ronaustin1@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:nhO79.10514$I6.891960@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> > "six long years to earn enough to retire"? My heart bleeds for you.
> >
> Well thanks, it now looks as if at least someone appreciates the Hell I
went
> through.
>
> Earle
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote in message
> > news:aimbfd$1580g8$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> > > Working for hourly wages or salary, a form of involuntary servitude,
is
> > just
> > > as dehumanizing as what you are describing.  "Placing a human being in
> the
> > > position of marketing his/her time to the highest bidder is
> dehumanizing,
> > > etc, etc"  I for one would rather have sold a kidney than gone to
> college,
> > > gone to graduate school, learned to program computers, a job that
truly
> > > sucks, and sold my soul to Microsoft for six long years to earn enough
> > money
> > > to retire.  I am sure that if you had worked and suffered that long at
a
> > > thankless job you would now feel the same way.
> > >
> > > Earle Horton
> > > http://members.aol.com/earlerhorton
> > >
> > > Teresa from Oregon <ttg@attbi.com> wrote in message
> > > news:6fa04e22.0208050601.12071e22@posting.google.com...
> > > > The facet of this dilemma that no one has mentioned is that selling
> > > > organs to the highest bidder turns the donor into a sort of human
meat
> > > > market. Placing a human being in the position of marketing his/her
> > > > parts to the highest bidder is dehumanizing. The poor would be
> > > > compelled by "market forces" to sell their organs, while the rich
> > > > would get more transplants.  A nightmarish vision of "health care"
(I
> > > > use the term loosely because only one socioeconomic group's health
is
> > > > being cared for in this scenario) if ever there was one.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

"Daniel Granot" <dgranot@bigpond.net.au> wrote:

>Ummm...I thought that was sarcasm. ;-)

One would like to hope so, but I think he's quiite serious....

"Carey Gregory" <antispam8@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:nqn0muoi4qebaj4ivf7mpe6cfglvv1ps6t@4ax.com...
> "Daniel Granot" <dgranot@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
>
> >Ummm...I thought that was sarcasm. ;-)
>
> One would like to hope so, but I think he's quiite serious....
>
The best sarcasm has a little reality in it.  I imagine that many of the
grumbling nurses in this newsgroup would be begging to get their hospital
jobs back, if someone would only let them write production computer code for
a month or two.  I know you like it, Carey, but I have no idea why.  Most
people never know what the other guy is feeling.

Earle
http://earleh.tripod.com
Satan's Gardener@AOL.com

Grow up Earle!
The world does NOT owe you a living for doing nothing!  You don't like
computer programming? Then do a job you DO like. But quit bellyaching
because the rest of us don't care to support you wile you make no
contribution to society!
You sound to me like an overgrown spoiled brat!


"Earle Horton" <earleh@iname.com> wrote in message
news:ajpp7s$1d58kp$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> "Carey Gregory" <antispam8@attbi.com> wrote in message
> news:nqn0muoi4qebaj4ivf7mpe6cfglvv1ps6t@4ax.com...
> > "Daniel Granot" <dgranot@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
> >
> > >Ummm...I thought that was sarcasm. ;-)
> >
> > One would like to hope so, but I think he's quiite serious....
> >
> The best sarcasm has a little reality in it.  I imagine that many of the
> grumbling nurses in this newsgroup would be begging to get their hospital
> jobs back, if someone would only let them write production computer code
for
> a month or two.  I know you like it, Carey, but I have no idea why.  Most
> people never know what the other guy is feeling.
>
> Earle
> http://earleh.tripod.com
> Satan's Gardener@AOL.com
>
>
>

"John Scheib" <scheibs@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:sH989.12768$I6.1089753@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> Grow up Earle!
> The world does NOT owe you a living for doing nothing!  You don't like
> computer programming? Then do a job you DO like. But quit bellyaching
> because the rest of us don't care to support you wile you make no
> contribution to society!

I don't know where this comes from.  For your information I have been a ski
bum for four years, a volunteer EMT for three, and I am currently in nursing
school.  Just who are you to belittle ANYONE else's contribution to society?

If you don't want to continue to support my supposedly non-existent
contribution to society, you should immediately stop buying food, office
supplies, software, tobacco, automobile parts, medical equipment,
munitions...  Oh heck, just go live on a mining claim and live off the land,
but don't pay taxes because I get a cut of that, too.

Earle

> You sound to me like an overgrown spoiled brat!
>
>
> "Earle Horton" <earleh@iname.com> wrote in message
> news:ajpp7s$1d58kp$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> > "Carey Gregory" <antispam8@attbi.com> wrote in message
> > news:nqn0muoi4qebaj4ivf7mpe6cfglvv1ps6t@4ax.com...
> > > "Daniel Granot" <dgranot@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
> > >
> > > >Ummm...I thought that was sarcasm. ;-)
> > >
> > > One would like to hope so, but I think he's quiite serious....
> > >
> > The best sarcasm has a little reality in it.  I imagine that many of the
> > grumbling nurses in this newsgroup would be begging to get their
hospital
> > jobs back, if someone would only let them write production computer code
> for
> > a month or two.  I know you like it, Carey, but I have no idea why.
Most
> > people never know what the other guy is feeling.
> >
> > Earle
> > http://earleh.tripod.com
> > Satan's Gardener@AOL.com
> >
> >
> >
>
>

I was not belittling anyone's contributions to society, only the lack
thereof! As for continuing to support you, I did not say we wouldn't, (the
law forces us to!) I said we didn't care to. (In other words didn't want
to!)
As for the unpleasantness you found at Microsloth, I guess appearances can
be deceiving. On the surface it LOOKS like you'd be suited to each other
based on your demonstrated level of intelligence, and Ms's demonstrated
level of intelligence. I'd say you were a semi-genius! After all, according
to Webster, 'semi' means half. And genius is described ad "wit, intelligence
.... etc."!
If you wish to spend all your time feeling sorry for yourself, I politely
request that you do so somewhere else!
Meanwhile, please take your attitude and put it where only your proctologist
has to deal with it.

"Earle Horton" <earleh@iname.com> wrote in message
news:ajrkhq$1dhb86$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> "John Scheib" <scheibs@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:sH989.12768$I6.1089753@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> > Grow up Earle!
> > The world does NOT owe you a living for doing nothing!  You don't like
> > computer programming? Then do a job you DO like. But quit bellyaching
> > because the rest of us don't care to support you wile you make no
> > contribution to society!
>
> I don't know where this comes from.  For your information I have been a
ski
> bum for four years, a volunteer EMT for three, and I am currently in
nursing
> school.  Just who are you to belittle ANYONE else's contribution to
society?
>
> If you don't want to continue to support my supposedly non-existent
> contribution to society, you should immediately stop buying food, office
> supplies, software, tobacco, automobile parts, medical equipment,
> munitions...  Oh heck, just go live on a mining claim and live off the
land,
> but don't pay taxes because I get a cut of that, too.
>
> Earle
>
> > You sound to me like an overgrown spoiled brat!
> >
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <earleh@iname.com> wrote in message
> > news:ajpp7s$1d58kp$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> > > "Carey Gregory" <antispam8@attbi.com> wrote in message
> > > news:nqn0muoi4qebaj4ivf7mpe6cfglvv1ps6t@4ax.com...
> > > > "Daniel Granot" <dgranot@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >Ummm...I thought that was sarcasm. ;-)
> > > >
> > > > One would like to hope so, but I think he's quiite serious....
> > > >
> > > The best sarcasm has a little reality in it.  I imagine that many of
the
> > > grumbling nurses in this newsgroup would be begging to get their
> hospital
> > > jobs back, if someone would only let them write production computer
code
> > for
> > > a month or two.  I know you like it, Carey, but I have no idea why.
> Most
> > > people never know what the other guy is feeling.
> > >
> > > Earle
> > > http://earleh.tripod.com
> > > Satan's Gardener@AOL.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>

Earlw,
I guess you don't recognize sarcasm when you see it, huh?
b
"Earle Horton" <earleh@iname.com> wrote in message
news:ajoeo0$1d9pta$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> "Ronald Austin" <ronaustin1@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:nhO79.10514$I6.891960@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> > "six long years to earn enough to retire"? My heart bleeds for you.
> >
> Well thanks, it now looks as if at least someone appreciates the Hell I
went
> through.
>
> Earle
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <Satan_Nutz@aol.com> wrote in message
> > news:aimbfd$1580g8$1@ID-147790.news.dfncis.de...
> > > Working for hourly wages or salary, a form of involuntary servitude,
is
> > just
> > > as dehumanizing as what you are describing.  "Placing a human being in
> the
> > > position of marketing his/her time to the highest bidder is
> dehumanizing,
> > > etc, etc"  I for one would rather have sold a kidney than gone to
> college,
> > > gone to graduate school, learned to program computers, a job that
truly
> > > sucks, and sold my soul to Microsoft for six long years to earn enough
> > money
> > > to retire.  I am sure that if you had worked and suffered that long at
a
> > > thankless job you would now feel the same way.
> > >
> > > Earle Horton
> > > http://members.aol.com/earlerhorton
> > >
> > > Teresa from Oregon <ttg@attbi.com> wrote in message
> > > news:6fa04e22.0208050601.12071e22@posting.google.com...
> > > > The facet of this dilemma that no one has mentioned is that selling
> > > > organs to the highest bidder turns the donor into a sort of human
meat
> > > > market. Placing a human being in the position of marketing his/her
> > > > parts to the highest bidder is dehumanizing. The poor would be
> > > > compelled by "market forces" to sell their organs, while the rich
> > > > would get more transplants.  A nightmarish vision of "health care"
(I
> > > > use the term loosely because only one socioeconomic group's health
is
> > > > being cared for in this scenario) if ever there was one.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>