🚀 go-pugleaf

----------- Original message below forwarded by NETTRAIN moderator ------------

Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1993 14:12:16 EST
From: Kathleen Turner <turner@shrsys.hslc.org>

THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!!!
I strongly suspect that I am not the *only* NETTRAIN subscribe who is
subscribed to more than one list, and each and every one of the lists I
follow, through individual subscription or through a local bulletin board
service, is inundated monthly with Michael Hart's missives.  I could tolerate
an occasional message to the effect that new Gutenberg texts or newsletters
are available at xxxxxx address, but any more is excessive.  Thank you
for giving my delete key a break!

Kathleen Turner
Reference Librarian
Eastern Pa. Psychiatric Inst.
Philadelphia, PA
turner@shrsys.hslc.org


----------- Original message below forwarded by NETTRAIN moderator ------------

Date: 01 Feb 1993 13:19:42 -0600 (CST)
From: JWILLIS@Jetson.UH.EDU

Although it is difficult to separate personalities, styles of interaction,
and differences in the way individuals approach conflicts and disagreements,
from the value of a message or series of messages, I think that is very
important in this case.  While I won't defend Michael Hart's approach to
the conflict he has with Jim Milles and I won't defend Jim Milles response
either, the more important question is whether the Gutenberg Newsletter
material is valuable to people who follow this list.  For me, that material
is valuable and I would like to see it included.  It is so easy to delete
messages that I don't have a problem with material that may not be useful
to every subscriber.  Few things are.  However, I am not advocating a
completely open list where everything sent is transmitted.  I think list
owners who screen material do us all a very valuable service for which they
are rarely, if ever, adequately rewarded.  In the case of the Gutenberg
Newsletter, however, I would like to respond to the request of the listowner
by saying I find it worthwhile and would like to see it continue on this
list.

Jerry Willis
Director, Center for Information Technology in Education
University of Houston
jwillis@jetson.uh.edu


----------- Original message below forwarded by NETTRAIN moderator ------------

Date: Mon, 1 Feb 93 14:27:55 GMT-0500
From: Sue Davidsen <davidsen@vienna.hh.lib.umich.edu>

I heartily support Jim's position on Michael Hart's postings. It's
not that Project Gutenberg isn't an important net resource -- it is,
but Mr. Hart is just too verbose and based on evidence from his
participation in other listservs, often introduces elements that are
not germaine to the topic at hand.


My feeling is that those who would like to receive information from
the Gutenberg project have other means to do so and we shouldn't be
subjected to very lengthy messages that are repeated on every
listserv we belong to or access.

I know that Mr. Hart is a big fan of the delete key and I have
certainly become one since getting a workstation, HOWEVER, the larger
percentage of listserv subscribers will not have the luxury of a
delete key and some subscribers PAY for how much mail space they're
using up.


Mr. Hart and I have had words with each other before over much the
same matter. I do, however, appreciate the work he has put into
Project Gutenberg, I access his newsletters and read them, and I
point to Gutenberg's electronic reference sources in my gopher. I do
not want NETTRAIN to become another place for the distribution of
this material. It is one of the few listservs I still subscribe to
rather than read on usenet because Jim does such a good job of
keeping discussions on track.


Sue Davidsen
Reference and Information Technology Librarian
The M-Link Project
The University of Michigan Library
davidsen@umich.edu


----------- Original message below forwarded by NETTRAIN moderator ------------

Date: Mon, 1 Feb 1993 11:51:08 -0800
From: cjg@stubbs.ucop.edu (Czeslaw Jan Grycz, UC Office of the President)

One of the factors involved with the new networked medium is that it has
rules and conventions that differ from voice and print.  Michael Hart is
among the handful of network correspondents who have not -- in my opinion
-- learned to be sensitive to these differences.

The moment I see a posting from "Hart" or "Gutenberg", I have to admit to a
similar impulse to depress the "delete" key.  I regret this very much, and
express this reaction here in what I hope is a positive and useful sense.

There are numerous instances of useful insight and even inspiration in
Michael Hart's postings.  The fact that he seems to have compromised his
ability to effectively communicate on the net appears to be a result of his
aggressive cross-postings, redundancies, and garrulousness.  These are
attributes that can be modified on the basis of learning the kinds of
reactions people have to them.  I would be pleased if he -- and others --
did recognize the ways in which they unthinkingly offend and distance
people from themselves.

I would prefer not to see Michael's newsletters and extended musings posted
to NETTRAIN, and instead have his cogent and insightful remarks aimed at
specific issues and points that come up.

Chet


----------- Original message below forwarded by NETTRAIN moderator ------------

Date: 01 Feb 93 13:49:13 CST
From: AP160102@ACCDVM.ACCD.EDU

I already get Mr. Hart's postings on PACS-L and VITRUAL as well as NETTRAIN,
consequently, I recently elected to sign-off the GUTENBERG list. Although
I certain his project is useful and he is entitled to his opinions, I find
that 3 or 4 copies of the same extremely long postings discourages me from
reading his postings. You're the moderator Jim, and as such it is your right
and responsibility to limit postings to NETTRAIN (which I believe was
instituted at the request of NETTRAIN subscribers). If Mr. Hart doesn't like
it, he isn't obligated to make postings to NETTRAIN.


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| Associate Professor                  Telephone: (210) 733-2116        |
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----------- Original message below forwarded by NETTRAIN moderator ------------

Date: Mon, 1 Feb 1993 15:28 EDT
From: Kate Kiernan - Vermont State Colleges
 <KATE%VSCNET.BITNET@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu>

Count me a subscriber to this list that does NOT want to deal with more
of Dr.Hart's rambling 400-line "newsletters".

As we all know, there are umpteen zillion sources of information on the
Internet, and Project Gutenburg is only one of them.  We do not need to
receive long-winded electronic "newsletters" to update us on the latest
files they have available.  What if every ftp site did that!

These newsletters are very close to the electronic version of junk mail,
and he posts them on several lists already.  Enough is enough!

Kate Kiernan
Vermont State Colleges
KATE@VSCNET.BITNET


----------- Original message below forwarded by NETTRAIN moderator ------------

Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1993 15:52:15 EST
From: "Andrew Brennan, LRC Manager" <brennan@hal.hahnemann.edu>

      While I do find Gutenberg interesting and the etexts a very
   flexible way to read classics, I do not consider it to be one
   of the primary sources for Internet training texts.  Sure, any
   Internet manual that is released for peer review will (in all
   likelihood) find it's way into Gutenberg - but by the time it
   has reached the archives, anyone interested in it has already
   acquired the file from any number of other sources.  The list
   of etexts that Gutenberg has isn't exactly very short ...
   perhaps a possible solution for NETTRAIN would be to post the
   'diff' of the last two newsletters?  :^)

      andrew.  (brennan@hal.hahnemann.edu)