🚀 go-pugleaf

I have been "lurking" (what a sinister-sounding term) on SLART-L for a
while, and I do enjoy a good fight, whether I'm in it or not.  I should warn
you that I'm not an academic in linguistics or any other subjects; just a
guy who spent his life learning languages (for use), and is now trying to
share some of what he thinks he's learned.  Anyone curious is welcome to
vist the Platiquemos website (url below).

I "joined" SLART-L at the suggestion of Ron Sheen; while I have never met
Ron I have enjoyed and agreed with his contributions to FLTEACH for some
time, have shared a few personal exchanges with him, and respect both his
knowledge and his skepticism about the contributions of "research" to the
learning of foreign languages by Americans (and Canadians and Brits, too, I
guess).  The only somewhat substantive comment I have refers back to a
thread that went on about a month ago, and probably only tangentially at
that.  I have had the fortune to "acquire" or "learn" (actually a bit of
both) five languages at the "3" (US Govt scale) level or better as an adult,
three Germanic, one Romance, and one Fenno-ugric.  Based solely on my own
experience, I do believe that there is something to the idea that we can
learn to learn languages, by that I mean that each language learned becomes
easier.  Whether that has to do with the confidence of having had a success
or two, or some deeper process I'll leave to the experts.  If I had to bet a
month's pay on one of two people starting to learn, say, Mongolian, both as
absolute beginners but one of whom had successfully learned a couple of
other totally unrelated languages, I wouldn't have to think a minute about
where to put my money--without knowing anything else about the two, their
IQ's, educational level, etc.

Anyway, the purpose of this message is really about some of the nasty
personal stuff I've seen directed at Ron--who can be very acerbic, even
perhaps cutting, in his arguments.  One member of SLART-L gently pointed
this out to Ron recently, and I think he [Ron] very graciously apologized to
any one who may have felt personally hurt by any of his comments.  I'm still
waiting to see an apology from Andrew Lian for calling Ron a racist [how he
drew
that out of any of Ron's comments totally escapes me, but that is, of
course, the ultimate put-down in certain quarters]; likewise from the person
whose name I don't know who posted the ridiculous and insulting
"psychoanalysis" of Ron; connecting Ron to Chomsky is perhaps the unkindest
cut of all.

I have nothing personal against people personally attacking me.  I have read
with great pleasure some of the vicious personal attacks directed by
supposedly highly civilized and civil Brits (including my hero Winston
Churchill) against their intellectual opponents.  One of the reasons we're
in the mess we're in is, in my opinion, our fear of calling a spade a spade
(or a f-----g shovel, as someone once accused me of).

Finally, a question for you language experts.  I've seen "here, here!" as an
expression of agreement in several messages.  Shouldn't it be "hear, hear!";
or am I just further exposing my ignorance?


Don Casteel (who has been told many times that you "can attract more flies
with honey than with vinegar"; and who has sometimes retorted that, if
attracting flies is your thing, good old b.s. beats 'em both)
Spanish for adults in the U.S. and abroad:
http://www.Platiquemos-LetsTalk.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Ronald Sheen <Ronald_Sheen@UQTR.UQUEBEC.CA>
To: SLART-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU <SLART-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Date: Thursday, April 22, 1999 4:59 AM
Subject: Re: nettiquette


>Nat quite rightly points out that Ron Sheen
>is by far the best example of this, having a way of phrasing his
>ideas so that they could be interpreted as personal attacks.
>
>Mea culpa. I apologise to anyone who may have felt so attacked.
>
>Ron Sheen  U of Quebec in Trois Rivieres, Canada.