🚀 go-pugleaf

[Martin Taylor 950214 11:10]
>Bill Leach 950213.20:45 EST(EDT)

On ethics and reorganization:

>Implicit in what you have presented is that there is some goal; "stable
>society" or whatever.

If you think that was implicit, let me make EXplicit that there is no goal.
The phenomenon is what has sometimes been called the "autumn leaf" effect.
Leaves get blown around, without a goal, but nevertheless they wind up in
big piles after a gale.  Why? Because in some places the wind is relatively
calm, and leaves stay there if they get there, whereas in other places
they are blown away by the wind.  There's no "goal" to reorganization.
Systems just stay the way they are when reorganization is not happening
much, and that is when perceptual control is generally good.  That's true
within the individual, and therefore true within social structure composed
of individuals.

>Again, given that and the not otherwise oft
>mentioned point concerning individual perception of what is necessary for
>the goal (that you did bring up) then PCT should help to analyze what
>will happen as the individuals in the society interact.

Again, there need be no goal to have a stable society.  The goals are those
that are represented in the reference signals of each individual's hierarchy.
If those reference signals are such that the individuals interact in a
way that allows them a reasonable degree of control, they won't be doing
much reorganization and the social structures won't change much.  Among
the parts of the hierarchy that won't change much are the highest levels,
principles in particular.  When the related perceptions differ from the
reference levels, the result is action to restore the perceptions--enforcement
of ethics, either in respect of oneself or as an attempt to control someone
else.

By the way, to hark back to one of your earlier postings, a stable oscillator
is a possible mode for a stable system under the autumn leaf effect.
Stability doesn't necessarily mean that things are static.  Even a chaotic
system can be stable.

Martin