Thread View: borland.public.csharpbuilder.language.csharp
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Started by Andrew Clark
Fri, 10 Nov 2006 22:00
C# for Win32?
Author: Andrew Clark
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 22:00
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 22:00
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Has there been any discussion about the creation of a native Win32 version of the C# compiler? I've been looking for a solution that allows the creation of 'standard' executables but could also work under .NET. There are still huge performance advantages to a 'real' .exe, not to mention the memory requirements required by the .NET runtime. I've used C++ Builder, Java and C# for years, but I've started using Delphi because of its ability to generate a native .exe and .NET code from the same code base (the only language that I know that can do that). I really think that C# is the best language available right now, but the fact that it can only generate .NET code makes it an unacceptable solution for some of the projects that we work on. It seems like Borland is in a unique position to be able to generate Win32 and .NET code from the same code base, since it already has a compiler (Delphi) that does just that. Delphi seems like a good language, but it doesn't have anywhere close to the level of support in the development community that C# does. The three 'big' languages right now (C++/C#/Java) all are very similar in their structure and layout, and trivial to move between and learn for developers. Delphi is different enough that it requires some rethinking and restructuring (why is there a semi-colon between parameter declarations, why do I have to declare a method twice in each unit, oops I put the function return type before the function instead of after it). I would pay (hundreds of dollars) extra for a C# compiler that generates Win32 code and I'm sure that there are other people that feel the same way. Doesn't the C# compiler generate intermediate code that is compatible with the same Delphi back-end that generates .NET code? Couldn't it be modified to generate assembly the same way that the Delphi back end does for Win32 code? I'm sure that I'm oversimplifying things (delegates, Object vs. TObject, auto-boxing come to mind), but it would be great! It would be the ultimate solution for Windows (and Linux/Kylix?) - there would be tremendous reason for developers to stop using Visual Studio and start using Borland solutions, where there might not have been reason in the past.
Re: C# for Win32?
Author: Marc Rohloff TeamB
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 23:32
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 23:32
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On Fri, 10 Nov 2006 16:00:23 -0600, Andrew Clark wrote: > Has there been any discussion about the creation of a native Win32 version > of the C# compiler? No -- Marc Rohloff [TeamB] marc rohloff -at- myrealbox -dot- com
Re: C# for Win32?
Author: Joanna Carter [TeamB]
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 07:55
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 07:55
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"Andrew Clark" <andrewclark@verizon.net> a �crit dans le message de news: 4554f674$1@newsgroups.borland.com... | There are still huge performance advantages to a 'real' .exe Well designed .NET 2.0 code performs very favourably compared with "native" apps; mainly because, after JITting the progam *is* native code and can sometimes even be faster. Certainly programs that abuse reflection will seem sluggish but there are common-sense techniques that can avoid these "speed traps". | not to mention the memory requirements required by the .NET runtime Compared with the memory requirements of the Win32 runtime, AKA the Windows APIs ? The biggest problems with trying to achieve single codebase apps in Delphi include: the difference in memory management and the difference in interface handling including management of object and interface refcounting, something that is no problem in a GCed environment. Joanna -- Joanna Carter [TeamB] Consultant Software Engineer
Re: C# for Win32?
Author: Francois PIETTE [ICS - MidWare]
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 11:18
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 11:18
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> I've started using Delphi because of its ability to generate a native .exe > and .NET code from the same code base Right ! > Delphi seems like a good language, but it doesn't have anywhere close to > the level of support in the development community that C# does. I don't agree with that. You probably missed something in your search. The Delphi community is really large, alive and excellent quality. You can find almost anything you need. There are thousands of websites, blogs, component repositories, open source projects, mailing lists, newsgroups,... -- francois.piette@overbyte.be The author for the freeware multi-tier middleware MidWare The author of the freeware Internet Component Suite (ICS) http://www.overbyte.be
Re: C# for Win32?
Author: OD
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 15:26
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 15:26
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Francois PIETTE [ICS - MidWare] a �crit : > I don't agree with that. You probably missed something in your search. The > Delphi community is really large, alive and excellent quality. You can find > almost anything you need. There are thousands of websites, blogs, component > repositories, open source projects, mailing lists, newsgroups,... C# community is far wider now than the delphi one has never been... You have to look forward and not behind you... I'm not sure old "tips and tricks" you can find on the web can be a serious reason to go on with delphi in the future... Delphi resources on the web are old now... What can be the value of Torry's or DSP little VCL components face to the future that will use XAML, what can be the value of dbExpress or IBX tricks when the future is ADO.NET, how a Websnap paper can help you when the future is ASP.NET ? You have to face the truth : world has changed, has it did when we switched from DOS to Windows. And all oldies are now belonging to the past, unfortunately it seems Delphi/vcl too... -- OD
Re: C# for Win32?
Author: Francois PIETTE [ICS - MidWare]
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 20:17
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 20:17
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> Francois PIETTE [ICS - MidWare] a �crit : >> I don't agree with that. You probably missed something in your search. >> The Delphi community is really large, alive and excellent quality. You >> can find almost anything you need. There are thousands of websites, >> blogs, component repositories, open source projects, mailing lists, >> newsgroups,... > > C# community is far wider now than the delphi one has never been... You > have to look forward and not behind you... You are simply wrong. But this is not the place to discuss this topic. And by the way, it would be much better to post using your real name: Olivier Dahan. -- francois.piette@overbyte.be The author for the freeware multi-tier middleware MidWare The author of the freeware Internet Component Suite (ICS) http://www.overbyte.be
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