🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <vvrq998d9m6550@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland 
<beerman@yahoo.com> writes

>True, but the most popular size of SUV is the Toyota 4Runner and Ford
>Explorer and those of that ilk. The Suburban-sized models are not nearly as
>popular as the smaller sized models, and the smaller SUVs get comparable
>mileage as any minivan or even a Full Size car model, like a Crown Victoria
>or Cadillac deVille.

Not however as low as a Nissan Micra or other small car.  Just how big 
is your lunch pail ?


>Your penchant for lumping all SUVs under a single umbrella is problematic
>for me to get onboard with your complaints about them. You lump all SUVs
>from the miserly Honda CRV and Toyota Rav4 to the behemoth Suburban and
>Excursion into the same group, or at least you fail to distinguish between
>the miserly models and the guzzlers.

There will be some distribution of specs for sure.


>You have no idea what that SUV that you are complaining about right now was
>carrying around yesterday, or even an hour ago,

No, but if most of the time it's carrying one man and his lunch box, it 
does beg the question, 'could the other stuff be delivered some more 
efficient way' ?


> You are clueless about what the needs are of the families
>that drive SUVs, any SUV.

Much the same as families the same size with less palatial vehicles I 
guess.


> You see a woman driving one to the nail salon, and
>call it wasteful, but you have no idea that she just dropped two kids off at
>the elementary school, another at the middle school, and one at the high
>school. You don't know what the family needs that vehicle for when you are
>not looking at it with disgust. You think that because YOU don't need an
>SUV, then nobody needs them.

Not really.  We used to have a Nissan Prairie a vehicle of fairly 
moderate weight and fairly cavernous proportions.  That was quite handy 
for shifting five people with a load of stuff, but we generally use a 
smaller car, sometimes running on LPG with lesser loads, not that the 
Prairie was too bad on fuel.  Interesting to not that although the 1.6 
Prairie engine sounded as if it should have lower fuel consumption than 
the 1.8, the 1.8 was measurably better as well as offering more 
contingency.


> You blame the consumer for having needs, you
>blame the automakers for meeting those needs.

No -  I blame people for sizing their vehicles on the basis of very 
occasional peak loads, then using them for solo commuter trips.


> What you ignore is that you
>created the SUV market place by shutting down the stationwagons of the '60s
>and '70s. You (environmentalists in genreal, not you in particular) shut
>down a vehicle market that caused polution and was decried as being
>behemoth. The polution issues needed to be addressed, and this effort on
>your part was a worthy one. But, a byproduct of that was to shift car buyers
>over into the truck market where the pollution efforts were not applied. You
>effectively shot yourself in the foot, and complain today that you need
>crutches to walk. Now, you want to start over again to force people into a
>market place that does not suit them, and they will seek a new market that
>will not suit you. The cycle will repeat itself again and again.

This sort of thing can always bite you.  I'm not too sure for example 
that catalytic converters have really had much net benefit in the UK for 
example.


>The lesson here is to find a way to give buyers the products they want and
>still reduce the harm to the environment. We don't want Geo Metros, they
>simply do not meet our needs. We want the SUVs and the new crossover models
>that you haven't hit yet, but I am sure that is just an oversight ou your
>part.

Actually the Prairie might have been just one such.


> since we want this size of vehicle, then we need to work on a power
>source that will be appropriate. Fuel Cells are expected to work well here,
>and Hybrids should do farely well too. Both of these technologies are more
>enviro friendly and are not very far over the horizon, perhaps 3 ~ 5 years
>at best, maybe as long as 12 ~ 15.

Let's hope, though if the fuel cells are still 'burning' petrol, they 
may not solve that many problems.


Cheers, J/.
-- 
John Beardmore