🚀 go-pugleaf

> The trials were indeed constitutional, as the stated portion of the
> constitution applies to crime committed in the states. The charges these two
> were tried for occured on federal property and come under the jurisdiciton of
> the second part of the quote. Federal property, such as military bases, have
> long been held to be seperate from state jurisdiction. The same holds true
> for other federal lands, Indian lands and foreign territory associated with
> diplomatic enclaves. The ruling allowing the trial of McVeigh & Nichols, on
> the charges relating to the deaths of the federal law enforcement agents was
> deemed to be constitutional.

Regarding congressional powers The U.S. Contitution Article I, Section 8, 
Clause 17 states "to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by 
the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, 
for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other 
needful Buildings".

The Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building was a "needful building".

The trials were still unconstitutional even if all of the crimes for 
which McVeigh and Nichols were tried, had taken place on the grounds of 
the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building. Both the facts of these crimes and 
the charges on which McVeigh and Nichols were tried indicate that several 
of these crimes were committed outside of federal property and none in 
Colorado. The federal indictment of McVeigh and Nichols which initiated 
in Oklahoma, was tried in Colorado. The eleven counts in the indictment 
consist of four types of crimes:

Count 1 - Conspiracy to Use a Weapon of Mass Destruction
According to the indictment the conspiracy was committed in the states of 
Oklahoma, Kansas, Arizona, and Arkansas. Nowhere in this count is it 
asserted that a conspiracy took place in or on the property of the 
federal government nor would the law support such conclusions. Please pay 
special attention to Paragraph 1 were the indictment uses the phrase 
"against property" which should not be misconstrued to mean "on 
property". Paragraph 10 states more clearly "..McVeigh placed it 
outside the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building.." In fact the van 
containing the bomb was parked on a state road that ran beside 
the Murrah building.

Count 2 - Use of a Weapon of Mass Destruction
As in the first count, this count does not assert a crime committed on 
federal property nor would the facts or law support such a charge. The 
bomb was placed and detonated on state property. 

Count 3 - Destruction by Explosive
The facts show that the bomb was placed and detonated on state property 
but the damage charged in this count was on federal property. The 
constitution uses the phrase "where the said Crimes shall have been 
committed". United States Code, Title 18, Section 844 (f) 
states "Whoever maliciously damages or destroys, or attempts to damage or 
destroy, by means of fire or an explosive, any building, vehicle, or 
other personal or real property in whole or in part owned, possessed, or 
used by, or leased to, the United States..." This statute deals with the 
destruction of federal property and the facts along with the nature of 
this crime show that the federal property so destroyed was in or on the 
grounds of the Murrah building and therefore within federal jurisdiction.

Counts 4-11 - First Degree Murder
As in count three, we must look to the law to establish where the crime 
was committed. The deaths occurred on federal property and should be 
considered to be within federal jurisdiction.

The trials of McVeigh and Nichols are still unconstitutional, the fact 
that counts 3-11 are within federal jurisdiction not withstanding. The 
jury in the trials consisted entirely of residents of Colorado who are of 
course not residents of Oklahoma nor of the Federal Western District of 
Oklahoma. The Sixth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution (see below) does 
not allow for this jury no matter were the jurisdiction lies.

Article VI 
In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a 
speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district 
wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have 
been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and 
cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; 
to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to 
have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.

We should heed the The U.S. Constitution or we have no more respect for 
the United States than Terry Nichols and Timothy McVeigh. 

Riddle