🚀 go-pugleaf

CJT <abujlehc@prodigy.net> writes:
> How many 360/67's were ever built?  We had one at U. Mich. (running
> MTS), but I had the impression at the time that it was not a common
> machine.

original posting:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2004c.html#46 IBM 360 memory

i don't know the exact number ... i would guess on the order of 100(?)
maybe more. most of them were originally sold as tss/360 machines to
universities and places like ford & gm. possibly only a dozen
continued to run tss for some time (i think there was something about
a dozen or so members of the share tss/360 group around 1970), the
rest either a) just used them in straight 360/65 mode with standard
os/360, b) ran mts, or c) ran cp/67. 

the cp/67 time-sharing services then bought some number of them:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#timeshare
as well as misc. businesses that decided they needed cms for one
reason or another (like cms\apl with large workspaces).

there were misc. like the boeing huntsville 360/67 multiprocessor
... which ran a modified version os/mvt13 in virtual memory mode with
no paging; aka the system supported a lot of long-running 2250
applications ... and mvt had a problem with memory fragmentation of
long running applications. virtual memory was used to provide
contiguous appearing memory locations. there was also the
one-of-a-kind 3-way 360/67 multiprocessor at lockheed that was part of
the manned orbital lab project (with a lot of redundancy & recovery
features added to it).

quite a few were deployed inside IBM for generic (CMS) online access
... including the original HONE system
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#hone

there were a number used for 370 testing before 370 hardware was
available ... a specially modified version of CP/67 was created that
emulated all the new 370 instructions and any other differences
between 360 and 370 (TOD clock, etc). These were used for testing for
testing operating systems for vanilla 370 (original 370 w/o virtual
memory) as well as later testing for emerging changes for virtual
memory support.

when 370 machines with virtual memory support first started appearing
(long before customer ship and other operating system support), a
further modification to cp/67 kernel was made to support the 370
virtual memory architecture (there were a number differences between
360/67 and 370 virtual memory definition).

several past postings on the cp/67 "l", "h", and "i" kernels:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001b.html#23 Linux IA-64 interrupts [was Re: Itanium benchmarks ...]
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002h.html#50 crossreferenced program code listings
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002i.html#55 wrt code first, document later
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002j.html#0 HONE was .. Hercules and System/390 - do we need it?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002j.html#70 hone acronym (cross post)
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003d.html#72 cp/67 35th anniversary
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003l.html#30 Secure OS Thoughts
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2004b.html#31 determining memory size

i've made some observations that there was nearly as many 360/67
systems as total multics systems (over a span of different machine
generations).  cp/67 (as well as follow-on vm/370 before moving out to
burlington mall) and multics were done at 545tech sq ... so there was
some naturual tendancy for some comparison. recent science center
posting:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2004c.html#11 40yrs, science center, feb. 1964
and lots more observations:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#545tech

in the vm/370 time-frame, i've commented that it wasn't really fair to
compare the total number of vm/370 customer installations to the total
number of multics installations ... or even to compare the number of
internal corporate vm/370 installations to the total number of multics
installations. At about the time the internet number of nodes exceeded
the number of nodes on the internal network (mid '85), most of the
internal network nodes were multi-user vm/370 (time-sharing) nodes,
while an increasing number of internet nodes were workstations and
PCs. misc. refs:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/network.htm

in any case, at one time I was building custom, highly modified vm/370
systems and shipping off distribution tapes to internal operations. at
one time, the number of the systems that I was directly supporting at
one time was about the same as the total number of multics systems
... so that was a more compareable comparison than either the total
number of vm/370 installations or even the total number of internal
corporate installations.

later when I got to release the resource manager ... I was responsible
for all education and documentation as well as 1st, 2nd, and 3rd level
support for the first six months after product release. I was told
that within a couple months after first release, the number of
resource manager licenses had gone over 1000. a couplre recent
postings on resource manager
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2004c.html#15 If there had been no MS-DOS
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2004c.html#35 Computer-oriented license plates

misc. other postings mentioning internal network size and the internet
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/97.html#2 IBM 1130 (was Re: IBM 7090--used for business or science?)
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/97.html#26 IA64 Self Virtualizable?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/98.html#16 S/360 operating systems geneaology
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2000b.html#72 Microsoft boss warns breakup could worsen virus problem
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2000e.html#13 internet preceeds Gore in office.
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2000g.html#14 IBM's mess (was: Re: What the hell is an MSX?)
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2000g.html#24 A question for you old guys -- IBM 1130 information
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2000g.html#39 Could CDR-coding be on the way back?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2000g.html#50 Egghead cracked, MS IIS again
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001b.html#71 Z/90, S/390, 370/ESA (slightly off topic)
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001c.html#4 what makes a cpu fast
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001e.html#12 Blame it all on Microsoft
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001e.html#16 Pre ARPAnet email?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001j.html#28 Title Inflation
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001j.html#29 Title Inflation
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001j.html#50 Title Inflation
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001k.html#56 E-mail 30 years old this autumn
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001l.html#34 Processor Modes
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001l.html#35 Processor Modes
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001l.html#45 Processor Modes
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002.html#32 Buffer overflow
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002b.html#53 Computer Naming Conventions
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002e.html#47 Multics_Security
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002g.html#35 Why did OSI fail compared with TCP-IP?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002g.html#71 Coulda, Woulda, Shoudda moments?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002h.html#11 Why did OSI fail compared with TCP-IP?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002h.html#48 Why did OSI fail compared with TCP-IP?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002j.html#64 vm marketing (cross post)
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002k.html#18 Unbelievable
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002k.html#19 Vnet : Unbelievable
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002o.html#17 PLX
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002q.html#4 Vector display systems
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003.html#10 Mainframe System Programmer/Administrator market demand?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003.html#68 3745 & NCP Withdrawl?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003b.html#46 internal network drift (was filesystem structure)
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003c.html#47 diffence between itanium and alpha
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003f.html#0 early vnet & exploit
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003g.html#18 Multiple layers of virtual address translation
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003g.html#44 Rewrite TCP/IP
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003h.html#16 Why did TCP become popular ?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003h.html#17 Why did TCP become popular ?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003i.html#18 MVS 3.8
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003i.html#27 instant messaging
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003i.html#62 Wireless security
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003j.html#1 FAST - Shame On You Caltech!!!
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003k.html#50 Slashdot: O'Reilly On The Importance Of The Mainframe Heritage
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003l.html#0 One big box vs. many little boxes
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003m.html#25 Microsoft Internet Patch
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003o.html#68 History of Computer Network Industry
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003p.html#38 Mainframe Emulation Solutions
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2004.html#44 OT The First Mouse
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2004b.html#20 ARPAnet guest accounts, and longtime email addresses
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2004b.html#58 Oldest running code
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2004c.html#6 If the x86 ISA could be redone
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2004c.html#34 Playing games in mainframe


-- 
Anne & Lynn Wheeler | http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/