🚀 go-pugleaf

"IT3 Stuart Blake Tener, USNR-R" wrote:

> Dear Sir or Ma'am:
>
>     I am an olde HP-3000 System Manager, and would like to be able to run
> MPE on my PC. There are of course two choices (a) emulating the HP-3000
> Classic (if it has not been written as yet, and if not, I plan to start a
> mailing list for it) or (b) getting a PA-RISC emulator (preferred, again if
> non existant, lets write one) to allow the boot of HP-3000 PA-RISC code.
>
>     Anyone aware of any of these existing?
>
>     I currently have an emulator which emulates the S/390
> (www.conmicro.cx/hercules), so there must be a way to emulate the 3000 if
> the IBM Mainframe can be emulated sufficiently to boot up CURRENT versions
> of OS/390, VSE/ESA, and VM/ESA (z/vm, z/os, z/vse!), as well as things as
> olde as VM/370, MVS 3.8, and other free OSes.
>
>     I (when I was in college, circa 1983 to 1988), was a VERY well
> accomplished HP-3000 person. I had gotten to the point of having written
> software to traverse sl.pub.sys and replace library calls (it was a research
> project of mine to write a replacement system call to allow DBDELETEs of
> Master Records along with all details in Image).
>
> Stuart
> Beverly Hills, CA, USA

First thought, when boxes are so cheap, why expend the effort.
second thought, if you get an Itanium processor, it does pa-risc.  There would
still be some boot stuff to sort out, but executing the code would be fast.

"Don Clapp" <dlclapp@ind.tds.net> wrote in message
news:3B92E09F.6CE23ECB@ind.tds.net...
>
>
> "IT3 Stuart Blake Tener, USNR-R" wrote:
>
> > Dear Sir or Ma'am:
> >
> >     I am an olde HP-3000 System Manager, and would like to be able to
run
> > MPE on my PC. There are of course two choices (a) emulating the HP-3000
> > Classic (if it has not been written as yet, and if not, I plan to start
a
> > mailing list for it) or (b) getting a PA-RISC emulator (preferred, again
if
> > non existant, lets write one) to allow the boot of HP-3000 PA-RISC code.
> >
> >     Anyone aware of any of these existing?
> >
> >     I currently have an emulator which emulates the S/390
> > (www.conmicro.cx/hercules), so there must be a way to emulate the 3000
if
> > the IBM Mainframe can be emulated sufficiently to boot up CURRENT
versions
> > of OS/390, VSE/ESA, and VM/ESA (z/vm, z/os, z/vse!), as well as things
as
> > olde as VM/370, MVS 3.8, and other free OSes.
> >
> >     I (when I was in college, circa 1983 to 1988), was a VERY well
> > accomplished HP-3000 person. I had gotten to the point of having written
> > software to traverse sl.pub.sys and replace library calls (it was a
research
> > project of mine to write a replacement system call to allow DBDELETEs of
> > Master Records along with all details in Image).
> >
> > Stuart
> > Beverly Hills, CA, USA
>
> First thought, when boxes are so cheap, why expend the effort.
> second thought, if you get an Itanium processor, it does pa-risc.  There
would
> still be some boot stuff to sort out, but executing the code would be
fast.
>

A very good question, well deserving of an even better answer! First off
perhaps I am desirous of running HP-3000 classic software in native mode? An
emulator would provide that capability, as well, if written (with complete
portability in mind, as Hercules was for an example), HP-3000 classicware
would run on any machine Linux runs on! By using Linux as the development
platform the HP-3000 could be brought to run on any machine, PC, Mac, Alhpa
or otherwise.

Secondly there is no guarentee HP will not "modify" the Itanium (or its
BIOS) to sufficiently prevent native MPE PA-RISC HP-3000 code from running
on that box absent purchase from them. As well, I would like to think
virtualization presents other options. Such as the fun of doing it, and the
posibility of running multiple "HP-3000"s (on the same linux box) and
testing communication between them? All sorts of reasons, but mainly, cause
we can!

I presume you will not be interested in participating, but do invite those
whom are to post to this message thread, and all will be informed (whom post
here to this thread) when a more formal organization for plotting a course
has been developed.

Thank you all for your time and consideration.

Stuart

"Don Clapp" <dlclapp@ind.tds.net> wrote in message
news:3B92E09F.6CE23ECB@ind.tds.net...
>
>
> "IT3 Stuart Blake Tener, USNR-R" wrote:
>
> > Dear Sir or Ma'am:
> >
> >     I am an olde HP-3000 System Manager, and would like to be able to
run
> > MPE on my PC. There are of course two choices (a) emulating the HP-3000
> > Classic (if it has not been written as yet, and if not, I plan to start
a
> > mailing list for it) or (b) getting a PA-RISC emulator (preferred, again
if
> > non existant, lets write one) to allow the boot of HP-3000 PA-RISC code.
> >
> >     Anyone aware of any of these existing?
> >
> >     I currently have an emulator which emulates the S/390
> > (www.conmicro.cx/hercules), so there must be a way to emulate the 3000
if
> > the IBM Mainframe can be emulated sufficiently to boot up CURRENT
versions
> > of OS/390, VSE/ESA, and VM/ESA (z/vm, z/os, z/vse!), as well as things
as
> > olde as VM/370, MVS 3.8, and other free OSes.
> >
> >     I (when I was in college, circa 1983 to 1988), was a VERY well
> > accomplished HP-3000 person. I had gotten to the point of having written
> > software to traverse sl.pub.sys and replace library calls (it was a
research
> > project of mine to write a replacement system call to allow DBDELETEs of
> > Master Records along with all details in Image).
> >
> > Stuart
> > Beverly Hills, CA, USA
>
> First thought, when boxes are so cheap, why expend the effort.
> second thought, if you get an Itanium processor, it does pa-risc.  There
would
> still be some boot stuff to sort out, but executing the code would be
fast.
>

A very good question, well deserving of an even better answer! First off
perhaps I am desirous of running HP-3000 classic software in native mode? An
emulator would provide that capability, as well, if written (with complete
portability in mind, as Hercules was for an example), HP-3000 classicware
would run on any machine Linux runs on! By using Linux as the development
platform the HP-3000 could be brought to run on any machine, PC, Mac, Alhpa
or otherwise.

Secondly there is no guarentee HP will not "modify" the Itanium (or its
BIOS) to sufficiently prevent native MPE PA-RISC HP-3000 code from running
on that box absent purchase from them. As well, I would like to think
virtualization presents other options. Such as the fun of doing it, and the
posibility of running multiple "HP-3000"s (on the same linux box) and
testing communication between them? All sorts of reasons, but mainly, cause
we can!

I presume you will not be interested in participating, but do invite those
whom are to post to this message thread, and all will be informed (whom post
here to this thread) when a more formal organization for plotting a course
has been developed.

Thanks for the commentary, but with or without your participation we will
proceed.

Thank you all for your time and consideration.

Stuart

Mr. Koenig:

Well perhaps, but this does not allow people to run Classic stuff on any
machine that can run Linux, something I would like to see happen.

Stuart


"Michael Koenig" <mikoenig@web.de> wrote in message
news:PM00038D08AA027578@wintermute.unknown.dom...
> Don Clapp wrote:
> > second thought, if you get an Itanium processor, it does pa-risc.
>
> Actually PA-RISC was planned for IA-64 but was dropped after some time.
> The only thing remaining in hardware is an additional IA-32.
> PA-RISC compatibility is ensured by a binary translator (emulator geeks
> will call this a dynamic recompiler nowadays) called Aries.
>
> --
> M.I.K.e
> (The crownless again shall be King.)
> Deutsche BeOS FAQ: http://www.be-faq.de/

Don Clapp wrote:
> second thought, if you get an Itanium processor, it does pa-risc.

Actually PA-RISC was planned for IA-64 but was dropped after some time.
The only thing remaining in hardware is an additional IA-32.
PA-RISC compatibility is ensured by a binary translator (emulator geeks
will call this a dynamic recompiler nowadays) called Aries.

-- 
M.I.K.e
(The crownless again shall be King.)
Deutsche BeOS FAQ: http://www.be-faq.de/

IT3 Stuart Blake Tener, USNR-R wrote:
> Well perhaps, but this does not allow people to run Classic stuff on
> any machine that can run Linux, something I would like to see happen.

If you intend to run different OSes for the PA-RISC architecture then
Aries won't help you since it's just designed to get applications
running, at least as far as I understood it.
I only wanted to correct the myth that IA-64 was PA-RISC compatible by
itself.

-- 
M.I.K.e
(The crownless again shall be King.)
Deutsche BeOS FAQ: http://www.be-faq.de/

Mr. Koenig:

Thats great you wanted to correct a myth, but it has nothing to do with the
subject matter of this thread.

Thanks,

Stuart



"Michael Koenig" <mikoenig@web.de> wrote in message
news:PM00038D08E320020C@wintermute.unknown.dom...
> IT3 Stuart Blake Tener, USNR-R wrote:
> > Well perhaps, but this does not allow people to run Classic stuff on
> > any machine that can run Linux, something I would like to see happen.
>
> If you intend to run different OSes for the PA-RISC architecture then
> Aries won't help you since it's just designed to get applications
> running, at least as far as I understood it.
> I only wanted to correct the myth that IA-64 was PA-RISC compatible by
> itself.
>
> --
> M.I.K.e
> (The crownless again shall be King.)
> Deutsche BeOS FAQ: http://www.be-faq.de/

IT3 Stuart Blake Tener, USNR-R wrote:
> Thats great you wanted to correct a myth, but it has nothing to do
> with the subject matter of this thread.

It *has* to do with the subject matter since you now know that IA-64 is
*not* the answer to your question.

-- 
M.I.K.e
(The crownless again shall be King.)
Deutsche BeOS FAQ: http://www.be-faq.de/

Mr. Koenig:

    Well perhaps you are correct with regard to relavency, however, I never
stated that I thought the IA-64 was answer to my question. I am interested
in building an emulator for the Classic, and eventually the PA-RISC.

    I never remember asking about the IA-64, but your point is taken under
advisement.

Stuart



"Michael Koenig" <mikoenig@web.de> wrote in message
news:PM00038D1CFAA78F47@wintermute.unknown.dom...
> IT3 Stuart Blake Tener, USNR-R wrote:
> > Thats great you wanted to correct a myth, but it has nothing to do
> > with the subject matter of this thread.
>
> It *has* to do with the subject matter since you now know that IA-64 is
> *not* the answer to your question.
>
> --
> M.I.K.e
> (The crownless again shall be King.)
> Deutsche BeOS FAQ: http://www.be-faq.de/