🚀 go-pugleaf

In <273@cjg2.win-uk.net>, alan@cjg2.win-uk.net (Alan Talbot) writes:
>We look after several networks, mostly novell. My boss's approach to
>applying patches and fixes is "If it works, dont fix it", and he
>doesn't believe in applying any unless they are to cure specific
>problems with a particular network.

That *used* to be Novell's position also. About a year or year and a half
ago, they changed to "you should always have the latest patches and updates
installed".

>His argument is that the patches
>can introduce further problems and you risk screwing up a working
>network by altering it.

He's got a point, and I don't totally disagree with it, but do you want to
wait until you have a problem before fixing it? I don't.

>I'm not entirely convinced by this argument and I would be
>interested to hear what others think.

If you call Novell support, their first question will be "do you have the
latest patches and updates installed?", if you don't, that will be what
they tell you to do.

Personally, I'd rather have the fix installed for a known problem *before*
it bites me.


======================================================================

    The packet goes out the card, into the copper, out the router,
    onto the fiber, across the world, thru the copper............
    NOTHING BUT NET.

David Gersic                                           dgersic@niu.edu
Systems Programmer                        Northern Illinois University

alan@cjg2.win-uk.net (Alan Talbot) wrote:

>We look after several networks, mostly novell. My boss's approach to
>applying patches and fixes is "If it works, dont fix it", and he
>doesn't believe in applying any unless they are to cure specific
>problems with a particular network. His argument is that the patches
>can introduce further problems and you risk screwing up a working
>network by altering it.

Hi Alan.    Yes, that argument is common and is a good one in many
cases, but I justify (at least to myself) keeping on top of the
trickle of upgrades to our servers as follows - - -

1.  I presume that each patch is the product of many reports from the
field, followed by much research by Novell (who I also presume do not
ENJOY announcing a patch).  So I have no hesitation in learning from
the experience of others, probably a lot like myself.

2.  If Novell thinks I **MIGHT** suffer some errors by NOT upgrading,
and if they DON'T take any money from me for the upgrade - then I'm
delighted to bow to their superior knowledge and experience.   The
documentation with the patch might tell me if it does NOT apply to my
scenario, but unless it is clearly not relevant to my site, Novell
usually recommends applying it.

3.  Stories of problems CAUSED by upgrades are very rare.   So rare I
can't recall the details of any, although I do recall hearing of a
"fixed" patch.

4.  If I do suffer some error and have to call for help, then the
first question Novell (or any other support agent) will ask is "have
you installed the latest patches/upgrades ???      The idea of finding
and applying ALL relevant patches BEFORE starting to fault-find sends
shivers up my back.   Better to apply them in sequence, during some
quiet time when you aren't also struggling with some UN-anticipated
bug.

In spite of all that,  patches are a low-priority item for me and
usually get postponed for some quiet period !!!   But I don't pretend
that I'm immune from the bugs that caused Novell to release them.

Good luck to you and your boss !,    Colin.
--
Colin Pearson   CNA-4
cspea@tcp.co.uk

In <273@cjg2.win-uk.net>, alan@cjg2.win-uk.net (Alan Talbot) writes:
>We look after several networks, mostly novell. My boss's approach to
>applying patches and fixes is "If it works, dont fix it", and he
>doesn't believe in applying any unless they are to cure specific
>problems with a particular network. His argument is that the patches
>can introduce further problems and you risk screwing up a working
>network by altering it.
>
>I'm not entirely convinced by this argument and I would be
>interested to hear what others think. 
>
>regards,
>
>Alan.
>
>Alan Talbot,  Support Engineer          Phone +44 (0)171 371 8889
>CJG Consultants Ltd.,                   Fax   +44 (0)171 371 9998
>Phoenix House,  Fulham High Street      home  +44 {0}171 221 6738     
>London SW6 3LF                          
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 It's true that a patch can cause problems .This is a reason for not being the first 
to try a patch (let it age a little while before trying it unless you have a specific
problem) .However , a patch is not always to fix an existing problem.It may be 
to avoid a future problem or just to provide better service such as support
for more cdroms in the case of CDROM.NLM.

 You should realize that if you have a problem requiring a call to Novell support
the first question they'll ask after you explain the problem is "Have you applied
the latest patches? NO?? Call us back when you have. Have a good day now!
BYE!" . Keeping your patches up to date will help avoid this situation.