🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <886414956.15186.0.nnrp-05.9e986860@news.demon.co.uk>
           gary@cherokee.demon.co.uk "Gary Burkey" writes:

"I'm new to this newsgroup so apologies if I'm in the wrong place.

    I think you are on topic.

"I have been using Kermit on my PC to remotely access our mainframe. I have
"recently upgraded my PC to a HP Vetctra VL (P166MMX) with 47M Ram.  The
"system has a sound card as well as a CD-ROM Drive, running Win 95.  When I
"enter Kermit from the DOS prompt I instantly get a 'divide overflow'
"message.

    When you say "using Kermit", do you mean the genuine original
 implementation of Kermit for the IBM-PC (Version 3.13 or something)
 from Columbia, or another implementation, or a "Kermit-protocol"
 insert into some other comms package?  Kermit, although now
 pretty dated, was a brilliant high-reliability solution to the
 problems of remote access between differing computers; but it was
 both a file-transfer protocol and a pretty complete communications
 shell.  (There were at least 500 implementations on various
 computers; I personally wrote 3.5 or them.)  Many of the "Kermit
 inserts" in other packages were of low quality.

    There is a very easy way to get a divide overflow, and this is
 by using some sort of processing-speed test designed for a slower
 m/c.  Typically this does some piece of computation and times how
 long it took.  If it forgets to check for zero time (ie no
 clock-tick taking place) before dividing to get the speed, then
 it will eventually fail as speeds get faster.  MS-K 3.13 gives no
 trouble on my Cyrix P133+; but that's some way behind what you
 have now got.

    Assuming that you are using Gianone's genuine MS-Kermit (or
 something closely similar), and working from a genuine DOS boot
 (not a DOS-prompt in Win95), then I would suggest you play around
 with the Comms settings (Set Baud etc) in the CUSTOM.INI file.
 Also LOG SESSION, and see whether it writes anything at all to the
 file.  And take note of whether it does anything at all before
 failing; there should be about 6 lines of information output before
 the "MS-Kermit>" prompt comes up.

"Two of my colleagues have identical systems excluding the MMX chip and
"manage to run Kermit okay.  A third colleague has a Vectra VL (P166MMX)
"minus the sound card and CD-ROM and also gets a 'divide overflow' message.

    Are they on the same Win95, calling Kermit in the same way?

"From this I conclude that it probably is the MMX chip causing the problem
"(maybe Kermit cannot handle the increased processing speed).  I have not
"found anyway of slowing the processor down.

    Could be.  See above.  But knowing the quality of U of
 Columbia code, I doubt if it is a program-design inadequacy or bug.

    If you really wanted me to, I could probably dig out the
 Kermit source (which is in 'C') and see whether it measures the
 speed in the way I described; but I wouldn't offer to recompile
 for you .....

    You might even try referring the problem to Columbia.  As of
 1992, the Columbia University Centre for Computing Activities was
 still in full flow; by now they are probably on the web.  There
 are also a couple of NGs "comp.protocols.kermit.???" which might
 be of help.  And an "au.kermit.???".

"Is there anyway that I can get around this problem?

    Let's hope so.  I still use Kermit for all initial testing of
 modems.

                                Chris K.
-- 
Chris Kennington (newshound)                        01491 574065
  You can mail me with suitable modifications to header-addresses,
   or to "chris <at> inf-eden.demon.co.uk", replacing the <at>.

In article <886424243snz@inf-eden.demon.co.ux>,
Chris Kennington - newshound <Newz@inf-eden.demon.co.uk.snip> wrote:
: In article <886414956.15186.0.nnrp-05.9e986860@news.demon.co.uk>
:  gary@cherokee.demon.co.uk "Gary Burkey" writes:
: "I have been using Kermit on my PC to remotely access our mainframe. I have
: "recently upgraded my PC to a HP Vetctra VL (P166MMX) with 47M Ram.  The
: "system has a sound card as well as a CD-ROM Drive, running Win 95.  When I
: "enter Kermit from the DOS prompt I instantly get a 'divide overflow'
: "message.
: 
This is an FAQ on the Kermit newsgroup, which Chris K kindly pulled in to
this thread.

:  When you say "using Kermit", do you mean the genuine original
:  implementation of Kermit for the IBM-PC (Version 3.13 or something)
:  from Columbia, or another implementation, or a "Kermit-protocol"
:  insert into some other comms package?  Kermit, although now
:  pretty dated...
:
Harrumph!  Them's fighting words.  The Kermit Project is more active than
ever, the software is updated continually, and it is being put to more uses
in the modern world than some people might think, due to:

 (a) its portability across hundreds of platforms;
 (b) its media independence (serial port, modem, TCP/IP, X.25, etc);
 (c) its automation features.

:  ... was a brilliant high-reliability solution to the
:  problems of remote access between differing computers; but it was
:  both a file-transfer protocol and a pretty complete communications
:  shell.  (There were at least 500 implementations on various
:  computers; I personally wrote 3.5 or them.)
:
Indeed you did!

:  Many of the "Kermit inserts" in other packages were of low quality.
: 
And remain so.

:  There is a very easy way to get a divide overflow, and this is by
:  using some sort of processing-speed test designed for a slower m/c...
:
That's more or less it, but it's been corrected for some time now.

However, readers of demon.tech.pc should also be aware that there is a new
32-bit native Kermit program for Windows 95 and NT (and OS/2) -- Kermit 95:

  http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/k95.html

This one understands long filenames, is a Winsock client, does Telnet and
Rlogin (and LAT and CTERM, etc) as well as serial ports and modems, and it
is also a TAPI client, emulates 35 different terminals, and on and on.

: "Two of my colleagues have identical systems excluding the MMX chip and
: "manage to run Kermit okay.  A third colleague has a Vectra VL (P166MMX)
: "minus the sound card and CD-ROM and also gets a 'divide overflow' message.
: 
:     Are they on the same Win95, calling Kermit in the same way?
: 
The current version of MS-DOS Kermit for DOS and Windows 3.x is 3.15:

  http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/mskermit.html

It does not get divide overflow errors.

:  If you really wanted me to, I could probably dig out the
:  Kermit source (which is in 'C')...
:
MS-DOS Kermit is in assembler, but with the TCP/IP stack coded in C.

:  You might even try referring the problem to Columbia.  As of 1992, the
:  Columbia University Centre for Computing Activities was still in full
:  flow; by now they are probably on the web.
:
We are indeed:

  http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/

:  There are also a couple of NGs "comp.protocols.kermit.???" which might be
:  of help.  And an "au.kermit.???".

  comp.protocols.kermit.misc       Unmoderated (and quite active)
  comp.protocols.kermit.announce   Moderated (for announcements)

I'm not sure about the au.kermit and fj.kermit groups -- we can't see them
from here, but maybe they are active.

: "Is there anyway that I can get around this problem?
:  Let's hope so.  I still use Kermit for all initial testing of modems.
: 
: Chris Kennington (newshound)                        01491 574065
:   You can mail me with suitable modifications to header-addresses,
:    or to "chris <at> inf-eden.demon.co.uk", replacing the <at>.

Good to hear from you again.  It's been a while!

- Frank

In article <886414956.15186.0.nnrp-05.9e986860@news.demon.co.uk>, Gary
Burkey <gary@cherokee.demon.co.uk> writes
>
>From this I conclude that it probably is the MMX chip causing the problem
>(maybe Kermit cannot handle the increased processing speed).  I have not
>found anyway of slowing the processor down.

Maybe a silly question, but which Kermit are you using? There seem to be
several around; maybe a newer one would be okay?
-- 
Mark Rogers (Software Engineer)       -o-      mark@controlware.demon.co.uk
2M_ControlWare, Yaxley, Peterborough, ENGLAND.

Gary Burkey wrote:

> When I [run Kermit I] get a 'divide overflow' message.
> 
> Two of my colleagues have identical systems excluding the MMX chip and
> manage to run Kermit okay.  A third colleague has a Vectra VL (P166MMX)
> minus the sound card and CD-ROM and also gets a 'divide overflow' message.
> 
> From this I conclude that it probably is the MMX chip causing the problem
> (maybe Kermit cannot handle the increased processing speed).  I have not
> found any way of slowing the processor down.

Too-fast speed problems are quite common with older software. There are 
some TSR programs around that are supposed to slow down a processor; the 
ones I have seen were to allow PC games to run on a fast 8MHz AT, and had 
names like ATSLOW.ARC. I don't know if they'd help.

The only proper solution is to get upgraded software. With Kermit I'd 
expect this has been done. You could get the source code and do it 
yourself.

In extremis, you could disassemble and patch the executable software 
(Kermit) directly. You have to identify and redesign timing loops (with 
appropriate calibration). Not something you'll do in an evening...

Best wishes,
-- 
Michael Salem (email: use "Reply" command, or mgs at michaels.demon.co.uk)
RFC 1855: Quote less than you contribute; keep sig down to 4 lines

Gary Burkey (gary@cherokee.demon.co.uk) wrote:

: I'm new to this newsgroup so apologies if I'm in the wrong place.

No better place ;-)

: I have been using Kermit on my PC to remotely access our mainframe. I have
: recently upgraded my PC to a HP Vetctra VL (P166MMX) with 47M Ram.  The
: system has a sound card as well as a CD-ROM Drive, running Win 95.  When I
: enter Kermit from the DOS prompt I instantly get a 'divide overflow'
: message.

Is this just coincidence that another poster got Divide Overflow?

K-95 is the real fix for you.  A substitute, less fully featured, but okay
for serial connections under Win95, is MSKermit 3.15.
MSKermit is free for download from Columbia University.
K-95 is available for sale, most easily via mail order, also via Columbia.

http://www.columbia.edu/kermit


I don't remember when the Divide Overflow error first popped up, but it
was fixed for me a few rev's ago.  Current MSKermit is 3.15, you don't
mention which version you have.

-- 
---
Clarence A Dold - dold@network.rahul.net
                - Pope Valley & Napa CA.

In article <886424243snz@inf-eden.demon.co.ux>, Chris Kennington -
newshound <Newz@inf-eden.demon.co.ux> writes
>
>    There is a very easy way to get a divide overflow, and this is
> by using some sort of processing-speed test designed for a slower
> m/c.  Typically this does some piece of computation and times how
> long it took.  If it forgets to check for zero time (ie no
> clock-tick taking place) before dividing to get the speed, then
> it will eventually fail as speeds get faster.  MS-K 3.13 gives no
> trouble on my Cyrix P133+; but that's some way behind what you
> have now got.

One of the problems is (ISTR) that the standard Borland libraries suffer
from a bug of this kind. (It may well be that similar MS libraries do
to.) The result of which is that these bugs are quite common.

Still, it's better than the old way of using a fixed timing loop
(expecting to see a reply in 200 loops, for example); software such as
that (and there's a lot of it) fell over a long time ago.

-- 
Mark Rogers (Software Engineer)       -o-      mark@controlware.demon.co.uk
2M_ControlWare, Yaxley, Peterborough, ENGLAND.

Re the divide overflow in Kermit:

    Some but not all of the postings in this demon.tech.pc thread
 are also appearing in the U of Columbia kermit thread (and vice
 versa).  The crucial one does not seem to have appeared here
 (yet - could be Demon's news backlog); so I append it:-

                                        Chris K.

        -------------  cut cut cut  -------------

From: fdc@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Frank da Cruz)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.kermit.misc
Subject: Re: Divide Overflow with 3.12
Date: 1 Feb 1998 14:46:51 GMT
Organization: Columbia University
Message-ID: <6b21sr$ss5$1@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>
References: <34D40FDC.64AB@uc.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: watsun.cc.columbia.edu
Lines: 22
Xref: news.demon.co.uk comp.protocols.kermit.misc:5968

In article <34D40FDC.64AB@uc.edu>,
Charles Hart Enzer, M.D. <charles.enzer@uc.edu> wrote:
: I am using kermit version 3.12 for my tcp/ip connection.
:    
: When I  install and run this version of kermit in a pc-computer whose
: cpu is MMX I get the message:
: 
: 	DIVIDE OVERFLOW . 
: 
: What is the problem?
: 
If you are using DOS or Windows 3.1 (as I expect you must be, since you
mention TCP/IP), you need to install the current version of MS-DOS Kermit,
which is 3.15:

  http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/mskermit.html

If you are using Windows 95 or NT, you should switch to Kermit 95:

  http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/k95.html

 - Frank

        -------------  cut cut cut  -------------

    I gather that the files are also available as:-

      ftp://kermit.columbia.edu/kermit/.......

 (decides to wait a while before downloading, then it will be in
 the Demon cache and will arrive much faster .....)

                                            Chris
-- 
Chris Kennington (newshound)                        01491 574065
  You can mail me with suitable modifications to header-addresses,
   or to "chris <at> inf-eden.demon.co.uk", replacing the <at>.

In article <6b5c1s$j0d$1@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>
           fdc@watsun.cc.columbia.edu "Frank da Cruz" writes:

"In article <886424243snz@inf-eden.demon.co.ux>,
"Chris Kennington - newshound <Newz@inf-eden.demon.co.uk.snip> wrote:
[snip most of my own original ....]

"This is an FAQ on the Kermit newsgroup, which Chris K kindly pulled in to
"this thread.
"
":  ........  Kermit, although now
":  pretty dated...
":
"Harrumph!  Them's fighting words.  The Kermit Project is more active than
"ever, the software is updated continually, and it is being put to more uses
"in the modern world than some people might think, due to:

    Oh dear, Frank, can't say how sorry.  Perhaps, in extenuation,
 I should explain that I retired from the mainframe-etc world
 rather a long time ago .....  Once you get into a "PC Rules OK"
 environment, with the occasional MAC-interrupt, you tend to
 forget that there actually are a lot of PC-non-compatibles out
 there .......

[mega snip]

"MS-DOS Kermit is in assembler, but with the TCP/IP stack coded in C.

    True.  I forgot that it did not actually derive from
 "portable Kermit".  And I don't know that I could still read the
 360K floppies that my copy of the old source is on .....

"  comp.protocols.kermit.misc       Unmoderated (and quite active)
"  comp.protocols.kermit.announce   Moderated (for announcements)

    Started taking them very soon after my original post.  Quite
 like old times.

"Good to hear from you again.  It's been a while!

    And very glad to know that this NG (d.t.pc) has made it across
 the pond.  More power to your respective elbows!

                                            Chris K.
-- 
Chris Kennington (newshound)                        01491 574065
  You can mail me with suitable modifications to header-addresses,
   or to "chris <at> inf-eden.demon.co.uk", replacing the <at>.

In article <886414956.15186.0.nnrp-05.9e986860@news.demon.co.uk>,
Gary Burkey <gary@cherokee.demon.co.uk> wrote:
: I have been using Kermit on my PC to remotely access our mainframe. I have
: recently upgraded my PC to a HP Vetctra VL (P166MMX) with 47M Ram.  The
: system has a sound card as well as a CD-ROM Drive, running Win 95.  When I
: enter Kermit from the DOS prompt I instantly get a 'divide overflow'
: message.
: 
This query showed up a whole day after the answer.  I trust you have seen it
by now.  If not, please review recent postings, or see the Kermit FAQ:

  http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/faq.html
  ftp://kermit.columbia.edu/kermit/faq.txt

Item 37.

- Frank

In article <886629986snz@inf-eden.demon.co.ux>,
Chris Kennington - newshound <Newz@inf-eden.demon.co.uk.snip> wrote:
:  ...
:  I should explain that I retired from the mainframe-etc world
:  rather a long time ago .....  Once you get into a "PC Rules OK"
:  environment, with the occasional MAC-interrupt, you tend to
:  forget that there actually are a lot of PC-non-compatibles out
:  there .......
: 
Well, this is definitely a trend, but I hope not an irreversible one.
Non-PCs continue to serve a purpose in the world -- such as in those
little nooks and crannies where dependability and/or automation are
required.  We're doing our best to keep the world safe for many kinds
of computers and diverse operating systems :-)

- Frank