🚀 go-pugleaf

Submitted-by: peter@world.std.com (Peter Salus)

In article <17525@cs.utexas.edu> std-unix-request@uunet.uu.net writes:
>Submitted-by: std-unix-request@uunet.uu.net (John S. Quarterman)
>
>Since the end of October 1990, there has been no funding for moderation
>of the newsgroup comp.std.unix and its associated mailing list
>std-unix@uunet.uu.net.  Since that time, I have sought such funding
>from several user groups, the IEEE Computer Society (IEEE/CS), the
>IEEE/CS Technical Committee on Operating Systems Standards Subcommittee
>(TCOS-SS), and various private companies.  No funding is forthcoming.
>As I remarked three months ago, I cannot afford to moderate the newsgroup
>as a volunteer.  I have solicited volunteers, but no one has thus far
>come forward.
>
>So, this is a final call for a volunteer moderator, responses to be
>received at std-unix-request@uunet.uu.net by 15 February 1991.
>

As .stc.c and .std.internat are unmoderated and have not 
gone berzerk, could someone (perhaps jsq) explain why .std.unix
needs to be moderated?

Peter

-- 
The difference between practice and theory in practice is always
greater than the difference between practice and theory in theory. 

Volume-Number: Volume 22, Number 104

Submitted-by: std-unix-request@uunet.uu.net (John S. Quarterman)

The most numerous kind of response so far to my call for a volunteer
moderator has been from people saying they might volunteer if they
knew more.  Sorry, that's not what I asked for.  I asked for volunteers,
not potential volunteers.  I did not say I would train a new moderator.
Nor did I offer to explain how USENET works.  Nonetheless, the last one
to volunteer by the deadline gets to handle voting according to USENET
rules as to who (if anyone) becomes the moderator.  If you don't know
what the rules are, it would be good to find out before volunteering
(I don't know the details myself, so it won't do any good to ask me.)

To do a reasonable job of moderation for this newsgroup has taken me a
measured average of about 10 hours a month.  It might take you more or
less hours.

I have appended below a copy of the editorial policy statement that
appeared at the beginning of the current volume of comp.std.unix.
However, I can make no recommendations as to what the editorial policies
of any new moderator should be.

Once again, volunteers should send a message to std-unix-request@uunet.uu.net
by 15 February 1991.  The order such messages are *received* at that address
determines who (the last one to volunteer) gets to run the vote if there is
more than one volunteer.  Only messages that say that the sender definitely
volunteers to be moderator count for this ordering.


From: jsq@usenix.org (John S. Quarterman)
Newsgroups: comp.std.unix
Subject: comp.std.unix Policy
Reply-To: std-unix@uunet.uu.net

This is a policy statement for comp.std.unix.

This is Volume 22 of comp.std.unix.
These volumes are purely for administrative convenience.
Feel free to continue any previous discussion or to start new ones.

Topic.

The USENET newsgroup comp.std.unix, also known as the mailing list
std-unix@uunet.uu.net, is for discussions of standards related to
the UNIX operating system, particularly of IEEE P1003, or POSIX,
including IEEE 1003.1, 1003.2, etc.

Other related standards bodies and subjects include but are not limited to
	IEEE 1201 and IEEE 1238,
	ISO/IEC JTC1 SC22 WG15 (the ISO and IEC version of POSIX),
	the U.S. and other Technical Advisory Groups (TAGs) to WG15,
	the X3.159 Programming Language C Standard by the ANSI X3J11 committee,
	ISO/IEC JTC1 SC22 WG14 (the ISO and IEC version of X3.159),
	ANSI X3J16 on the C++ programming language,
	ANSI X3B11.1 on WORM File Systems,
	the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST),
	and their Federal Information Processing Standards (FIPS),
	X/Open and their X/Open Portability Guide (XPG),
	the Open Software Foundation (OSF),
	UNIX International (UI),
	the UniForum Technical Committee,
	the AFUU Working Groups,
	PortSoft,
	AT&T System V Interface Definition (SVID),
	System V Release 3, System V Release 4,
	4.2BSD, 4.3BSD, 4.4BSD,
	Tenth Edition UNIX, Plan 9 from Bell Labs,
	Mach, Chorus, Amoeba,
	and the USENIX Standards Watchdog Committee.

Moderator.

The newsgroup comp.std.unix and the mailing list std-unix@uunet.uu.net
is moderated.  The moderator is John S. Quarterman.

Disclaimer.

Postings by any committee member (especially including me) in this
newsgroup do not represent any position (including any draft, proposed
or actual, of a standard) of the committee as a whole or of any
subcommittee unless explicitly stated otherwise in such remarks.

* UNIX is a Registered Trademark of AT&T.
** IEEE is a Trademark of the Institute for Electrical and Electronics
	Engineers, Inc.
*** POSIX is not a trademark.
Various other names mentioned above may be trademarks.
I hope their owners will not object if I do not list them all here.


Postings.

Submissions for posting to the newsgroup and comments about the newsgroup
(including requests to subscribe or unsubscribe to the mailing list)
should go to two different addresses:

		DNS address			UUCP source route
Submissions	std-unix@uunet.uu.net		uunet!std-unix
Comments	std-unix-request@uunet.uu.net	uunet!std-unix-request

The hostname cs.utexas.edu may be used in place of uunet.uu.net or uunet.
Permission to post to the newsgroup is assumed for mail to std-unix.
Permission to post is not assumed for mail to std-unix-request,
unless explicitly granted in the mail.  Mail to my personal addresses
will be treated like mail to std-unix-request if it obviously refers
to the newsgroup.

The mailing list is distributed on the Internet, UUCP, and elsewhere.
There is a redistribution list on BITNET for BITNET, EARN, and NetNorth.
Please send submissions from those networks to std-unix@uunet.uu.net
nonetheless, because messages sent to the BITNET LISTSERV will not reach
the whole list.

If you have access to USENET, it is better (more efficient, cheaper,
less effort for me to manage) to subscribe to the newsgroup comp.std.unix
than to the mailing list.  Submissions should still go to the above
addresses, although many (perhaps most) USENET hosts will forward
attempts to post directly to the newsgroup to the moderator.

Posted articles may originate from uunet.uu.net, longway.tic.com, tic.com,
cs.utexas.edu, or usenix.org.  There are also occasional guest moderators,
who may post from still other machines.  Guest moderators are announced
in advance by the regular moderator.

Archives.

Archives for comp.std.unix or std-unix@uunet.uu.net may be found on UUNET.
Most of them are compressed, so if you don't have compress, get it first
(it's in the comp.sources.unix archives).

The comp.std.unix archives may be retrieved by anonymous FTP over the Internet.
Connect to uunet.uu.net with FTP and log in as user anonymous with password
guest.

The current volume is in the file
        ~ftp/comp.std.unix/archive
or
        ~ftp/comp.std.unix/volume.22
The previous volume may be retrieved as 
        ~ftp/comp.std.unix/volume.21.Z
and so forth for more ancient volumes.

For hosts with direct UUCP connections to UUNET, UUCP transfer from
host uunet should work with, for example,
        uucp uunet!'~ftp/comp.std.unix/archive' archive
You will have to put a backslash before the ! (i.e., \!)
if you're using the C shell.

The output of "cd ~ftp/comp.std.unix; ls -l" is in
        ~ftp/comp.std.unix/list
and the output of "cd ~ftp/comp.std.unix; ls -l *" is in
        ~ftp/comp.std.unix/longlist

For further details, retrieve the file
        ~ftp/comp.std.unix/README


General submission acceptance policy.

Submissions are never ignored (although they might be overlooked).
If you don't see your article posted and you don't get a mailed
response from the moderator, your submission probably didn't arrive.
However, travel schedules and other business sometimes intervene
(and for that matter it can take many hours for a submission to
get to the moderator and the posted message to get back to the poster),
so you may sometimes not see anything for a few days.  If you wait
and still don't see anything, try sending again.

I usually post about 90% of all submissions.  However, as moderator,
I retain the right to reject submissions.  If a submission does not
appear relevant to comp.std.unix, it is sent back to the submittor with
a note saying why it is not appropriate.  Usually this is because it
just doesn't fit the topic of the newsgroup, in which case I suggest
another newsgroup.  Sometimes it is because someone else has already
given the same answer to a question, in which case I ask if the
submittor really wants it posted.  Occasionally I suggest editing that
would make an article more appropriate to the newsgroup.

Very occasionally I reject an article outright:  this is almost always
because it contains ad hominem attacks, which are never permitted
in this technical newsgroup.  There are many other potential reasons
for rejection, however, such as inclusion of copyrighted material.
Fortunately, most such problems have not come up.

Note that while technical postings on technical subjects are encouraged,
postings about the politics of standardization are also appropriate,
since it is impossible to separate politics from standards.

Crosspostings are discouraged.  Submissions such as ``how do I find
xyz piece of software'' or ``is the x implementation better than the
y implementation'' that come in for multiple newsgroups usually get
sent back to the submittor with a suggestion to resubmit without
comp.std.unix in the Newsgroups: line.  Sometimes I'll crosspost if
there's clear relevance to comp.std.unix, but I always add a
Followup-To: line in an attempt to direct further discussion to a
single newsgroup, usually comp.std.unix.  This policy is useful because
crossposting often produces verbose traffic of little relevance to
comp.std.unix.



Editorial policy.

When posting a submission, I sometimes make changes to it.  These
are of three types:  headers and trailers; comments; and typographical.

Headers and trailers

Header changes include:
+ Cleaning up typos, particularly in Subject: lines.
+ Rationalizing From: lines to contain only one address syntax,
	either hosta!hostb!host!user or, preferably, user@domain.
+ Adding a Reply-To: line.  This usually points to the newsgroup
	submission address in the mailing list, but to the submitter
	in the newsgroup, for reasons too messy to detail here.
+ Adding the Approved: line.
+ Deleting any Distribution: line, as detailed in the next paragraph.

The only distribution used in comp.std.unix is no distribution, i.e.,
worldwide.  If it's not of worldwide interest, it doesn't belong in
comp.std.unix.  Anything pertaining to the IEEE/CS TCOS standards
or committees (e.g., IEEE 1003, IEEE 1201), the ANSI X3.159 Programming
Language C Standard (X3J11), or the ISO 9945 POSIX work (ISO/IEC JTC1
SC22 WG15) is of worldwide interest.  If a submission arrives with a
Distribution:  line, such as na or us, I delete that line.

Every article has a trailing line of the form
>	Volume-Number: Volume 22, Number 42
This allows the reader to notice articles lost in transmission and
permits the moderator to more easily catalog articles in the archives.
Volumes usually change after about 100 articles, but are purely for
administrative convenience; discussions begun in one volume should
be continued into the next volume.

Also, signatures that are excessively long may be truncated.



Comments

Comments by the moderator are sometimes added to clarify obscure
issues.  These are always enclosed in square brackets with the
closing mark ``-mod,'' [ like this -mod ].  Sometimes entire articles
appear that are written by the moderator:  these always end with
a signature that includes the words ``moderator, comp.std.unix.''

Comments by the editor of the USENIX Standards Watchdog Reports
sometimes appear in those reports.  Such comments are always
enclosed in square brackets and begin with the word ``Editor:''
[ Editor: like this ].

Comments by the publisher of the USENIX Standards Watchdog Reports
sometimes appear in those reports.  Such comments are always
enclosed in square brackets and end with the mark ``-pub,''
[ like this -pub ].

Entire articles may appear by the editor or publisher of the
Watchdog Reports, and those are always identified by the signature.

Typographical

People submitting articles sometimes enclose parenthetical comments
in brackets [] instead of parentheses ().  I usually change these
to parentheses to avoid confusion with the above conventions for
comments by the moderator, editor, or publisher.

Obvious misspellings, such as ``it's'' for the possesive or
``its'' as a contraction of ``it is'' are corrected.

Excess white space is deleted.

Lines longer than 80 characters are reformatted.

Redundant quoted headers are often omitted.

Very long quotations of previous articles are sometimes shortened.



Common kinds of postings.

There are several sets of postings that reoccur in comp.std.unix
at more or less regular intervals.  Here are three of the most common.

Calendar of UNIX-Related Events

Susanne W. Smith <sws@calvin.wa.com> of Windsound Consulting of Edmonds,
Washington and John S. Quarterman <jsq@tic.com> of Texas Internet Consulting
(TIC) of Austin, Texas publish a combined calendar of planned conferences,
workshops, or standards meetings related to the UNIX operating system.
These appear about every other month in four articles with these titles:
	Calendar of UNIX-related Events
	Access to UNIX User Groups
	Access to UNIX-Related Publications
	Access to UNIX-Related Standards
The first three are posted to
	comp.std.unix,comp.unix.questions,comp.org.usenix
The one about standards is posted only to comp.std.unix.

These calendar postings are a private project of Windsound and TIC,
although they are coordinated with various groups such as USENIX, EUUG,
AUUG, JUS, UniForum, and IEEE TCOS.  Smith and Quarterman encourage
others to reuse this information, but ask for proper acknowledgment.

USENIX Standards Watchdog Reports

The USENIX Association sponsors a set of reports after each quarterly
meeting of the IEEE 1003 and IEEE 1201 standards committees.  These
reports are written by volunteers who are already attending committee
meetings and are edited by the Watchdog Report Editor, who is Jeffrey
S. Haemer <jsh@usenix.org>.  Reports on other committees, such as X3J11,
are also included when available.  These reports are published in
comp.std.unix/std-unix@uunet.uu.net and ;login:  The Newsletter of the
USENIX Association.  They are also available for publication elsewhere.

EUUG/USENIX ISO Monitor Project

The European UNIX systems Users Group (EUUG) and the USENIX Association
jointly sponsor an observer to the ISO/IEC JTC1 SC22 WG15 (ISO POSIX)
standards committee.  This observer, Dominic Dunlop <domo@tsa.co.uk>,
writes a report after each WG15 meeting, of which there are usually
two a year.  These reports are published in the EUUG Newsletter
(EUUGN), :login;, and comp.std.unix.  They are also available for
publication elsewhere.

Archives of the EUUG/USENIX ISO Monitor Reports, the USENIX Standards
Watchdog Reports, and the Windsound/TIC Calendar of UNIX-Related Events
may be found on uunet.uu.net.  Retrieve ~ftp/comp.std.unix/README for
details.

John S. Quarterman, moderator, comp.std.unix and std-unix@uunet.uu.net.


Volume-Number: Volume 22, Number 109

Submitted-by: domo@tsa.co.uk (Dominic Dunlop)

Could we please have a brief update on the status of the search for a
new moderator for this newsgroup?  Thank you.
-- 
Dominic Dunlop

Volume-Number: Volume 22, Number 131

Submitted-by: karish@mindcraft.com (Chuck Karish)

After withdrawals from candidacy by all the other volunteers,
Sean Eric Fagan (seanf@sco.com) is the provisional replacement
moderator for com.std.unix.

If there's any objection to simply accepting him as the new moderator
by acclamation, please speak up now, either by posting or by E-mail to
me (karish@mindcraft.com).  If I don't hear anything within a week of
the time I see this posting come back from John, I'll send an
announcement to news.announce.newgroups that the reins have been
shifted.

One of the other volunteers has expressed concern about perceptions of
possible conflict of interest, in that Sean is an employee of a major
UNIX vendor.

I have several answers to this concern.

First, the idea that anyone can be truly objective about anything is a
polite fiction at best.  We all try to be fair, and a good-faith effort
in this direction is all we can hope for.  If anyone thinks the
moderator is showing bias, USENET offers plenty of channels to express
dissatisfaction, both public and private.

Second, all of us have our own axes to grind, as users, as vendors, or
as service providers.  The fact that a particular axe may be sharpened
by the thought of commercial advantage doesn't make it any more or less
legitimate than one that comes from a different set of preferences.  I
suggest that we use the approach that the POSIX committees use:  Every
participant is assumed to speak for her/himself.  It's assumed that ALL
participants have something at stake, or they wouldn't bother to do all
that work.

Third, Sean has agreed to post some sort of disclaimer cooked up with
the help of his employer's legal staff.  I hope I don't have to page
past it too many times; I don't really think it's necessary.

	Chuck Karish		karish@mindcraft.com
	Mindcraft, Inc.		(415) 323-9000

Volume-Number: Volume 22, Number 132

Submitted-by: jsq@tic.com (John S. Quarterman)

The first article in the newsgroup comp.std.unix (then known as mod.std.unix)
was posted 25 June 1985.  Members of the IEEE P1003 standards committee
(there was only one such committee back then) had requested that the new
newsgroup be moderated to avoid the noise level seen on other newsgroups.
To date there has been only one moderator, me.  However, I would like to
thank all those who have served from time to time as guest moderators,
particularly John B. Chambers and Fletcher Mattox.

As noted in previous postings, I have decided to retire as moderator.
Subsequent to my posting of 31 January 1991 calling for volunteers to
be moderator, six people came forward by the deadline of 15 February
(and a couple of others said they would volunteer if nobody else
did).  The last to definitely volunteer by the deadline was Chuck
Karish, who, by the rules I had stated, then proceeded to determine
which of the volunteers was to become moderator.  He chose to do this
by discussions among the volunteers for the position.

I have been informed by both Chuck and by Sean Eric Fagan that Sean was
chosen by the withdrawals from candidacy of all the other volunteers.
Chuck announced this result in his posting to the newsgroup of 26 February.
He also announced

	If I don't hear anything within a week of the time I see this
	posting come back from John, I'll send an announcement to
	news.announce.newgroups that the reins have been shifted.

While I have deliberately given no advice as to who should be moderator
or how the new moderator should run the newsgroup, and I deliberately
did not participate in the decision process by which Sean was chosen
from among the six candidates, I would nonetheless like to assert that
the procedure outlined above was as I had requested.

I have seen no objections to Sean Eric Fagan being the new moderator of
comp.std.unix.  Unless I see some or Chuck Karish <karish@mindcraft.com>
informs me that he has seen some, I will post the final article in
comp.std.unix Volume 22 before midnight CST Wednesday 6 March 1991.
Sean Eric Fagan will take over Thursday as moderator of comp.std.unix.
He is already in the aliases std-unix@uunet.uu.net (postings) and
std-unix-request@uunet.uu.net (comments), and has apparently decided to
keep those aliases, so there should be no lost submissions.

The outgoing moderator hopes the new moderator has a successful newsgroup.

John S. Quarterman
jsq@tic.com
+1-512-320-9031
fax: +1-512-320-5821
Texas Internet Consulting
701 Brazos Suite 500
Austin, Texas  78701

Volume-Number: Volume 22, Number 136

Submitted-by: pdb@batserver.cs.uq.oz.au (Peter Barnes)

John S. Quarterman writes:
> The first article in the newsgroup comp.std.unix (then known as mod.std.unix)
> was posted 25 June 1985. [...]
> To date there has been only one moderator, me.  However, I would like to
> thank all those who have served from time to time as guest moderators,
> particularly John B. Chambers and Fletcher Mattox.
> As noted in previous postings, I have decided to retire as moderator.

I, and I expect many others on the net, would like to express my thanks to
John for the work he has done over nearly six years in this newsgroup.

In that time the group has been valuable in raising public awareness in the
standards process, providing wide, easy and rapid access to pertinent 
information, and providing a forum for much valuable discussion of standards
issues.

Many people have made contributions to the group, but John has held it
together.

Thank you!

Peter
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Peter Barnes  pdb@uqcspe.cs.uq.oz.au
Secretary, AUUG Inc.

Volume-Number: Volume 22, Number 139