🚀 go-pugleaf

Oliver Fels wrote:
> 
>  Peter Routsis wrote in comp.sys.amiga.networking
> 
> 
> > So JAVA is allmost a" god given gift", and I am wondering why it is
> > neglected by AT. I do not say that they have to do it by themselves, but
> > they should support this project with all their force. And nowone can
> > tell me that they could not coordinate PowerAmiga and JAVA, and can only
> > concentrate on either- as many people responded...AT should do the
> > marketing and coordinate the various projects done by good people...is
> > this that difficult to do ?
> 
> The more I work with it the more I get the impression that JAVA might be a god
> given gift but for the amiga.

I wouldn't term it as a god-given gift, rather as a means to now include 
the Amiga in those environments that are focused on intranet 
applications.  With JAVA, we would never have to worry about selling the 
Amiga in those kind of business environments.  If the Amiga doesn't get 
Java, then we would get left out of those areas that use it.  From what I 
see as a web developer, JAVA is a given.  If you don't support it some 
manner, eventually other platforms will be the preferred.  I don't 
personally buy into internet terminals as a large-scale solution, merely 
a specialized means of connection.  The Amiga can become a great selling 
point; AT could talk the low cost paradigm of the internet terminal while 
also saying to the user that they don't give up a hard drive and other 
aspects that most internet terminals give up...  JAVA should be a 
priority in the community.  I believe it would be to the benefit if AT 
could foster its implementation in an expeditious manner.  This does not 
mean AT needs to be the ones to do it...

> It is far away from being complete, at the moment rather unsecure in some terms
> and it is awfully slow.

It depends on what it is trying to do.  But you're right performance 
seems to be a problem, which will undoubtedly improve.

> JAVA is at the moment a small app only language, rather complex, of course, but
> not finished yet. If you ever used the JDK on the Shapshifter with a 030 and 6
> MB free Mac RAM, you´ll know what I mean. That´s what i´m expecting from the
> amiga implementation, too, and thats not much.
> Even on the SGI Indigo Impact i am using it runs rather slow and won´t change
> much as it´s interpreted.
> So we´ll have to wait for those announced pico machines which run the byte code
> on hardware basis and hope someone won´t forget to put one in an amiga case as a
> sub board.

Exactly!  This would be of great benefit.  AT (or preferably some third 
party so that we have competition) could make an add-on board with either 
the pico or Shboom chip from Patriot and the Java code in silicon.  
Performance goes up and the Amiga looks really attractive.  Especially if 
the Amiga was the first one to incorporate it on a board vice using a 
built in interpreter.

> That´s what I am expecting of JAVA.
> Great concept, but still to wait for.
> 
> Oliver
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------
>     Oliver Fels
> Fels@zebra.fh-weingarten.de
> of@neurotec.de

Overall, I see that the Amiga could become a dominate factor in the Web 
arena, but it can't be just the client.  The community needs alot of 
cohesive elements in place.  Better networking, more drag and drop HTML 
editors, more web server options (Mike Meyer's is the only one I know 
about), a JAVA development environment, a SQL or object-oriented 
database connectivity, and the like; all at low prices...  We already 
have the creative side licked for price/performance, we just need to do 
the same for the web stuff.  The Amiga is a natural content development 
platform, a decent client platform, and would make an excellent server 
platform (especially since it comes with REXX as a scripting language for 
CGI stuff).  It just needs some focus.  AT can't and shouldn't do it all, 
but it could provide the vision.  What I had intended for this thread to 
start was a conversation to help AT define that vision, to tell them what 
role we see the Amiga playing in the Web arena.  So here goes a first 
cut: 

The Amiga should be positioned to be the all around low cost web 
alternative.  Your competition is on two fronts: LINUX/Intel clones using 
freeware and Macs.

Here are some advantages:
Datatypes - by using these a browser can support alot more than the 
average GIFs/GIF animations and JPEGs.  Amiga-based browsers could go to 
sites that have IFFs, anims, 8vsx, BMP, etc. on them.  All that needs to 
happen is for AT to collect the best of these datatypes and distribute 
them.  The software developers should consider this the best approach for 
including features in their web browsers.  Think of it as an easier way 
to have Netscape-like plug-ins.
REXX - every Amiga has a natural, easy-to-use scripting language for CGI 
bins.
Creative Software - the Amiga is a great platform (and there is alot 
available) for creating visually appealing content; certainly a 
requirement.

Major disadvantages -
No major player recognition yet.
Few available Web server choices and none with security features such as 
S-HTTP or SSL.
No significant database packages for back-end data repositories.
JAVA is being ported, but not yet available (thanks to the P'Jami team).

What could AT do? I see a five step process.
1.  Begin talking publicly about a strategy to make the Amiga the heart 
of the web applications.  Get to some of these networking and internet 
conferences just to show the Amiga off doing browsing, serving etc. with 
what it has now and what developments are ongoing in the community.  
Encourage more web-oriented developments in the current software 
community.  For example, save-to-HTML features for word processors or 
save-to-VRML for 3-D animation packages and possibly including a low-end 
freeware browser when an Amiga is purchased (but not that it would 
displace a user's desire to upgrade to the one in the Surfer Pack).

2.  Find out how they can help the P'Jami team, web server, and database 
server developers and provide as much assistance as possible.  Don't 
neglect security issues...

3.  Ensure that AT or a set of the development community gets members on 
the standards committees to help drive things in an Amiga-friendly manner 
and to be in touch with these early.

4.  Continue with development of the Power Amiga, since undoubtedly the 
Amiga will need the extra CPU power.  Ensure network connectivity options 
are thought of upfront and that the OS has web-friendly features built 
in.

5.  Team with or encourage someone to get a JAVA option put in silicon by 
mid-year 97 or so - this is a tall order.  (Any later and it may not be a 
competitive advantage.)

The Amiga is not bad off via hardware currently for web stuff.  The 
development community needs encouragement and some direction.  I 
understand that AT does not have the funds or the breadth to do all of 
this (nor would it be wise for them to do so even if they did).  I 
believe that with the right kind of support and marketing, perhaps 
through a coalition of AT with its developers, the Amiga could beat the 
Mac out of the low-cost web solution seat.

That is all for now...

Paul Boos