🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <2246@lee.SEAS.UCLA.EDU> plinio@turing.seas.ucla.edu (Plinio Barbeito) writes:
>how you want), you throw them away.  An example of this kind of
>program: a utility that prints the date.  Typing "date -debug" is not
>something most people would be inclined to do.

obviously -debug is more useful as program complexity increases.
but, let's look at date(1) for a second. there is more going on
behind the scenes than you may think (in a "propper" implementation).
date sets the time, too. and there is the issue of GMT vs local time.
and then there is the issue of converting unix epoch time to atari
format for Settime and friends. i can think of at least a couple of
things with date which would be useful for USERS not only the
developer. the option for access to information is NEVER a bad one,
no matter how voluminous it may get.

>>not all commands can be typed without args. stdin is usually inferred
>>as source of input.
>True, but as you probably know, there is also the '-' convention. 
>Type 'command', and you get help.  Type 'command - < file' and you
>are sending that file to the stdin.

NO NO NO NO!!! do NOT change the way we currently do things with unix.
i don't want to have to type "ls -^D" or whatever. add, do not change.
that is the whole purpose of standards. and so far, for us cmdline
types, unix IS our standard. if you propose to change the way the ST
can look like unix, you will get lots of angry hate mail, i suspect,
or else be ignored. however, i you want to propose an entirely new
user interface, have at it. you may come up with something truly good.
afterall, unix is not perfect.

>The trouble with this is that the 
>original convention (a la 'cat') of 'command < file' is more elegant
>in its simplicity.

bingo...

>doesn't mean that the programmer couldn't have his own separate
>version, for debugging purposes.  I didn't mean to imply that 
>programmers wouldn't be deprived of their debugging facilities (if 
>that is what you are implying that I implied).  

of course the developer is not deprived. but why deprive the USER
or (implied) developer? he may help you ferret out bugs. not everyone
is going to recompile an application. and not all the stuff posted
here is perfect. if it were, it would be sold, not given away.

ok, i suppose -debug can go, reluctantly. but i was thinking more
globally in scope here. like a certain set of rules guaranteed to
be available for these types of applications. i was hoping for more
ideas from the community to help me write better applications which
can be used by more people than seasoned experts. things that are
intuitive with little or no knowledge. telling someone "if all else
fails, type 'help'" or "if all else fails when u try to execute
'cmd', type 'cmd -help'" is the sort of thing alot of people could
benefit from. maybe not gurus, but most all <= guru level.

ok, i've had enuf of this. move along...

-bill
rosenkra@convex.com

--
Bill Rosenkranz            |UUCP: {uunet,texsun}!convex!c1yankee!rosenkra
Convex Computer Corp.      |ARPA: rosenkra%c1yankee@convex.com