🚀 go-pugleaf

RetroBBS NetNews Server

Inspired by RockSolid Light RIP Retro Guy

Thread View: comp.sys.dec.micro
2 messages
2 total messages Started by George A. Theall Sat, 20 Apr 1991 04:21
Rainbow EchoMail Digest
#1007
Author: George A. Theall
Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1991 04:21
127 lines
4400 bytes
Rainbow EchoMail Digest					    Apr 19, 1991

In this issue:
  RE: FLOPPY INFO           
  RE: MS-DOS 3.10 OR LATER  
  RE: FREE STUFF ACT FAST        (2 messages)
  WARNER WANTS TO KNOW      


  Articles posted to either INFO-DEC-MICRO or comp.sys.dec.micro are
currently gatewayed to the Rainbow Echo on FidoNet. You do not need
to take special action to respond to articles in these digests.

  Please send reports of problems or suggestions for improvement of
this digest to GTHEALL@PENNDRLS.UPENN.EDU (Internet).
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:     14 Apr 91  20:00 -0500
From:     FRANK MALLORY 
To:       GEORGE THEALL 
Subject:  RE: FLOPPY INFO 

 GT> I have used the DEC pre-formatted RX50K and the Maxell MD1DD-RX50 
 GT> pre-formatted diskettes on the DECmate II extensively.  The Maxell 
 GT> disks are *clearly* superior to DEC's offering.  This is seemingly 
 GT> contrary to other's reports, but there is a proper explanation:

The Maxell diskettes I have trouble with are the MD2-D, which is their
regular DSDD diskette designed for use on 360KB PC drives.


- --- msged 1.99L MSC
 * Origin: Silver Bullet - Silver Spring, Md. - 301-622-2247 (1:109/417)

------------------------------

Date:     15 Apr 91  12:46 -0500
From:     ALAN RASKIND 
To:       AMER NELSON 
Subject:  RE: MS-DOS 3.10 OR LATER 

Thank you for the info.  If anyone knows where locally (in the Los
Angeles area) I can get a bug free copy of DOS 3.10b for the
Rainbow please let me know.  Also any info on what version of
Code Blue needs to be use with it?  Thanks, Alan


- --- QM v1.00
 * Origin: Beach Cities RB (1:102/139.0)

------------------------------

Date:     15 Apr 91  14:17 -0500
From:     BILL ROGERS 
To:       GEORGE THEALL 
Subject:  RE: FREE STUFF ACT FAST 

I'll take anything left over.  Just mail it COD to;
 
                Bill Rogers
                8412 Steilacoom Blvd #15
                Tacoma  WA 98498
 
I especially need a copy of the DOS!
                                Thanx
                                Bill


- --- Opus-CBCS 1.12
 * Origin: Glacier Peak Rainbow, Bellevue, WA - 206/644-8431 (1:343/3.0)

------------------------------

Date:     15 Apr 91  14:21 -0500
From:     BILL ROGERS 
To:       GEORGE THEALL 
Subject:  RE: FREE STUFF ACT FAST 

If you have already gotten rid of most of the stuff, then I need the
DOS & CP/M disks most.  I could also use a keyboard.
 
                                Thanx again.
 


- --- Opus-CBCS 1.12
 * Origin: Glacier Peak Rainbow, Bellevue, WA - 206/644-8431 (1:343/3.0)

------------------------------

Date:     18 Apr 91  21:08 -0500
From:     FRANK MALLORY 
To:       GEORGE THEALL 
Subject:  WARNER WANTS TO KNOW 

 GT> From: ccjason@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu  (Jason Gabler) Organization: 
 GT> University of California, Davis
 GT> 
 GT> In article <1991Apr16.162010.24517#Solbourne.COM> imp@Solbourne.COM
 GT>  (Warner Losh) writes:
 GT> >
 GT> >P.S.  Does anybody know what it means when you turn on your Rainbow
 GT> >and NOTHING happens?  No screen, no fan, no disks spin up?  No, it
 GT> >isn't upplugged... :-)
 GT> >--
 GT> >Warner Loshimp@Solbourne.COM
 GT> 
 GT> it means: 1) Some one at DEC forgot about UL standards 2) You don't 
 GT> have an IBM PC

I had this happen on an IBM PC once, and it almost drove me crazy until
I discovered that an aluminized write protect tab had fallen
off a floppy and was shorting out the drive electronics. I
don't use aluminized write protect tabs any more (if any).

On the Rainbow, tho, I think it is more likely to be the on/off switch.
It's pretty easy to substitute a new fan assembly with on/off
switch to check it out.


- --- msged 1.99L MSC
 * Origin: Silver Bullet - Silver Spring, Md. - 301-622-2247 (1:109/417)

------------------------------

End of Rainbow EchoMail Digest
******************************
Re: Rainbow EchoMail Digest
#1008
Author: Charles Lasner
Date: Sun, 21 Apr 1991 19:15
49 lines
3731 bytes
I was the one quoted here again, so I'll reply about the Maxell diskettes.

Anytime you use hub-ringed diskettes in a 96 tpi drive, you are taking a
high-risk chance with your data.  The condition of the drive (dirt, age) as
well as the condition of the diskette, as well as its manufacture, dictate
your (slim) chances of long-term reliability of the data.

The problem is that those diskettes were designed to deal with the problems
of the widespread DD-type drives used on a million poor xt clones.  Many of
these crappy drives chew up the hub areas of the diskettes.  Any of you out
there remember what RX01s do to the 8" diskettes?  Any of you remember the
third-party add-on user-installable hub-rings?

The 48 TPI 40 track drives used with those DD disks have "non-thin-film"
heads, to coin a retroactive phrase.  This means that each track, which owns
1/48 " uses about 50% of this space for data recording.  The rest is guard
zone and tunnel erase zone.  This is also why you can read the DD disks in the
HD drives so easily; basically you can't miss :-)

The 96 TPI disks, like the RX50, use thin-film heads.  Not as snazzy as the
HD disk drives like TEAC FD-55GFR, as used in good AT-clones, but 96 TPI
none the less.  This of course means that each track owns 1/2 of what the
corresponding track owns in the 48 TPI drive, but it doesn't end there.

The thin-film heads use a shorter magnetic gap, which translates into far less
use of the media than would otherwise be predicted, about 1/5 as much.  So,
this means that 96 TPI drives record their data on about 1/10 of the media as
do 48 TPI drives.  The chances that the media's hub-rings can be grabbed 
differently each time now greatly increases chances of data errors.  Each time
the diskette is passed through a hub-chewing drive, the greater the likelihood
that a 96 TPI drive can't reliably use that diskette.  Further, some vendors,
possibly Maxell, will use somewhat thicker hubrings, in an attempt to produce
better results with the intended use on DD drives, which only worsens prospects
for use on 96 TPI drives.

I myself have had problems using 3M diskettes intended for DD usage.  The DSDD
media were formatted on HD 96 TPI drives in DD format for possible reading
on DD drives (360K).  They were unreliable on other HD drives due to the
slight wear on the hub-rings.  Registration errors were high because the HD
drive couldn't reliably grab the media in the same place.  We resorted to
pulling the media out and reseating it a lot to retrieve the data with many
retries.  If the same media were reformatted on the target drive, and not
removed and reseated, it read back fine.  Removing and reseating the diskette
made it flakey even on the drive that formatted and wrote it moments ago.
These same diskettes worked fine on TEAC FD55B drives (DD 360K), because the
hub-rings are not really that worn, just beyond the tolerance limit for 96 TPI
mis-use.

cjl (Charles Lasner) (lasner@watsun.cc.columbia.edu)
Thread Navigation

This is a paginated view of messages in the thread with full content displayed inline.

Messages are displayed in chronological order, with the original post highlighted in green.

Use pagination controls to navigate through all messages in large threads.

Back to All Threads