Article View: comp.sys.dec
Article #4381"Are DSP Chips Obsolete?" (was re: Alpha fft performance)
From: Joe Buck
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1993 20:22
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1993 20:22
59 lines
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3818 bytes
In article <1993Jan5.134034.22043@ircam.fr> fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) writes: >For some more information on signal processing on Alpha, see our technical >report "Are DSP Chips Obsolete?" [disponible chez nous]. I have read this report. I am not impressed. In fact, if it were turned in as a term paper for a computer architecture class, I'd give it a B minus. If it were turned into a digital signal processing class, I'd give it a D. Why? Because it suffers from "all the world's a Unix workstation" disease. (On the other hand, many CS grad students also suffer from this disease, so if the grader knew nothing about the digital signal processing marketplace your report might fool him or her). Your paper is correct in the narrow sense that DSPs are not the best devices to use for raw, open-loop number crunching with no timing requirements (or timing requirements loose enough so that one second more or less does not matter). But DSPs are not being used in such applications to any significant degree. The authors did no market research. Your paper reveals total ignorance about just what DSP chips are being used for in industry. Most of these applications are in the telephone industry. The authors know what a modem is because you use one to dial into their workstation, but because they do not understand the algorithms involved, they are unaware that high-speed modems do echo cancellation and channel equalization, and these algorithms require precise timing and have tight feedback loops. You can't just buffer up a second's worth of signal at a time as this paper implies. When you make a long distance call that goes through a satellite link, your voice is being processed in real time by an echo cancellation algorithm, which works by adaptive filtering. Again, real-time is essential. The key is that the most demanding DSP algorithms have feedback: what happens this millisecond depends on what the world did a millisecond ago. The paper ignores the issue of cost, power consumption, and weight. Cellular phones are going digital. These require real time speech compression algorithms in a unit small enough to be hand-held and run for hours on battery power. For that reason, the future of the DSP industry is going in the direction of "DSP cores" -- the DSP is only part of the chip, and the customer can add whatever other logic is needed. The goal is NOT to get the maximum number-crunching power; it is to have just enough performance to fit the application and its memory on one chip and have it run in real time. This means that the engineer has a hardware/software codesign problem: produce a combined solution that gets the job done quickly and for low cost. Sorry, I don't think that Alpha chips are going to be the answer to the problems the DSP industry currently faces, though I expect that it will make a very nice workstation CPU. The distinction between DSPs and conventional processors is not how fast they do a multiply. It is their memory bandwidth. Modern DSPs have multiple memory banks and typically do three I/O operations per cycle. They are best used in embedded systems, systems with small amounts of memory and very tight timing requirements. -- Joe Buck jbuck@ohm.berkeley.edu
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Path: arc1-ca.pugleaf.net!sparky!uunet!europa.asd.contel.com!gatech!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!agate!forney.berkeley.edu!jbuck From: jbuck@forney.berkeley.edu (Joe Buck) Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec,comp.dsp Subject: "Are DSP Chips Obsolete?" (was re: Alpha fft performance) Date: 8 Jan 1993 20:22:30 GMT Organization: U. C. Berkeley Lines: 59 Message-ID: <1iknq6$6vt@agate.berkeley.edu> References: <1992Dec31.164221.27734@aplcen.apl.jhu.edu> <1993Jan5.134034.22043@ircam.fr> NNTP-Posting-Host: forney.berkeley.edu