🚀 go-pugleaf

Rich Farr (rfarr@Novell.com) wrote:
: New Services On the Internet:

: Described below are some of the services we've just
: completed making available.  Please send comments on these services
: (once you've seen them) to 'webmaster@novell.com'

: 1.  Technical Information Database.
...
: 2.  Novell Products Buyers Guide
...
: 3.  Technical support via Internet (UNIXWARE ONLY)
...
: 4.  Product Information via Internet
...

All the above is great news and will be greater as the signal-to-noise
ratio of UnixWare-to-NetWare increases.

...
: 3.  Click on the area you want to visit.  Services available via our
: web sites include: FTP and Gopher interfaces (to ftp.novell.com and
: ftp.novell.de), On-line databases (see above), on-line buyer's guides
...

don't have a graphic interface to the Net yet, so i used Lynx 2.0.12.
finally got to novell.com archive (not novell.de) and the unixware
dir was empty!

got out and re-entered via anon. ftp.  cd'd to /pub/unixware and there
were only the (hidden) cap and cache files.

guess i was a little premature?

jeff
-- 
   R.J. "jeff" Sanders, Co-Parent, F.R.E.E. Assoc. Director of Stuff
       Ask me about F.R.E.E. (Father's Rights and Equality Exchange)
        Anonymous ftp files available: ftp.vix.com:/pub/free
    "I live the life I love and love the life I live" - Willie Dixon

In article <sandersCGy4so.DEu@netcom.com> sanders@netcom.com (hawkeye in Gaza) writes:
>Rich Farr (rfarr@Novell.com) wrote:
>: New Services On the Internet:
>
>finally got to novell.com archive (not novell.de) and the unixware
>dir was empty!
>
>got out and re-entered via anon. ftp.  cd'd to /pub/unixware and there
>were only the (hidden) cap and cache files.
>
>guess i was a little premature?
>

	The US site ftp.novell.com has been empty for quite some time.
Don't know why either.  Try the European site,  ftp.novell.de.  It
has a lot more things to offer.

	It seems to me that the UnixWare European team is more interested
in its customers than the American team.

First off, I'm posting my comments to the net because of my continued policy
that I feel that Novell should respond to the net.  

Second, the following questions are not to flame. I'm just asking.

In article <CGx5t9.DBv@Provo.Novell.COM> rfarr@Novell.com (Rich Farr) writes:
>1.  Technical Information Database.

Is this simply the NSE disk?
What about access to the general support database?
How often is the database updated?
Who is in charge of updating it?
Can users post FAQ's or other documents to the database?
Will this continue to be an open access database or will you require we
switch to the NSE when the UNE programs are in full swing?

>2.  Novell Products Buyers Guide
>
>The Buyer's guide is also on-line (and searchable).  The buyer's guide
>is a publication which describes all of Novell's products, and gives
>information such as hardware requirements, compatibility, parts numbers,
>etc.

Why not post it or allow others to post it?

>3.  Technical support via Internet (UNIXWARE ONLY)

Will you answer all questions or will you turn the IF and other users away
still?

What is the turnaround time we can expect?
Will we receive assigned problem numbers in the response or will that be
autoreplied and assigned at that time? 

>However, we ask that you be specific in your questions and that you
>include all pertinent information (i.e. updates installed, controllers,
>peripherals, RAM, Video, SoftWare used, versions, detailed problem
>descriptions, etc. etc.).  

You forgot to remind the users there are utilities they can use to 'dump' the
system configuration and information.  Perhaps you need to make a script that
will prompt the user for all the information you need, dump the rest from the
system, and e-mail it all in one shot.  This will save you the hastle and
delays of getting the user to reply to "So what type of controller do you
have?" type of questions.  

BTW: Send me a copy of the form that is on the X window and I'll write the
script myself. Ain't I a nice guy.... ;)


>4.  Product Information via Internet

Will you be releasing 'future' supported product info?
Again, how often is this updated?

>ACCESS via the World Wide Web
>
>Please let us know if you find these services useful.

The WWW thing doesn't work for me. I'm on a terminal. Calling up via UUCP is
for the birds (especially if I have to call Long Distance).  The best
solution is a terminal interface that one can telnet into and/or a shell
script a user can run from their main system that will send for information,
send bug reports (with full docs on system configuration, etc), pull files
accross as necessary, etc.   This would be somewhat easy to build.  However,
since I do not know the format of your database and on how it can load the
information from a flat file, I may be completely wrong on my ideas.

Lastly, you need to post technical notes on a regular basis. Perhaps a
comp.unix.unixware.technotes would be in order.  This will cut down on
resources used by WWW and the other things.  It will provide an online
accessability to the users (Hey! You could make it Flib'able!). Etc.

Give it some thought...reply here....

Thanks.

-- 
      Harry Skelton - 1848 Beaver Dam Lane - Marietta, Georgia - 30062
		  404-590-7100 Work -- 404-578-8085 Home
"Strange women laying in raised floors, distributing passwords, is no basis
			for Systems Admnistration!"

	    hic iacet deus ex machina magnum opus - Dell Unix

In article <CGx5t9.DBv@Provo.Novell.COM> rfarr@Novell.com (Rich Farr) writes:

> New Services On the Internet:
> 
> Described below are some of the services we've just
> completed making available.  Please send comments on these services
> (once you've seen them) to 'webmaster@novell.com'
> 
> 1.  Technical Information Database.

I tried out your support database, and I found it to be *excellent*.
Being a support person myself, I was wondering how you implement the 
searching, and if/how this accomodates multiple keywords.  If you 
specify multiple keywords, do you show documents that match ANY
keyword, or only those that match ALL keywords?  IMO, with how large
your database is, you should limit this to those that match ALL
keywords.


-eric
eric@centerline.com
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Williams                                  CenterLine Software, Inc
Technical Support Engineer                            10 Fawcett Street
                                                   Cambridge, MA  02138
(800) 669-9165
(617) 498-3100
(617) 868-6655 fax                               support@centerline.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

In article <zorbaCGy6ww.1I4@netcom.com>, zorba@netcom.com (Harry Skelton) writes:
 
|> In article <CGx5t9.DBv@Provo.Novell.COM> rfarr@Novell.com (Rich Farr) writes:
|> >1.  Technical Information Database.
|> 
|> Is this simply the NSE disk?

Not exactly, but it is a very close subset.  The FYI documents which
are available in the on-line database are the same as those in the
NSE.  (For those not familiar with the NSE, the FYI's are the
troubleshooting documents)

|> What about access to the general support database?

Not sure what you mean.  The on-line database is for ALL Novell
products.  I will be breaking it into subsets so you can search
on just a particular product line (This is already done for UnixWare).
Buth the general support database is already there.

|> How often is the database updated?

Right now it is just a snapshot.  I'm working on automating procedures
to update it daily (at least) or even real time (as soon as the technician
writes a doc, it will get put in -- Not sure on this one yet).

|> Who is in charge of updating it?

I guess I am.

|> Can users post FAQ's or other documents to the database?

Not Yet.  We hope to add the possibility of doing group annotations.
Again, this one is down the road a little.

|> Will this continue to be an open access database or will you require we
|> switch to the NSE when the UNE programs are in full swing?

I'm not management, but my understanding is this will continue to be
open access.

|> >2.  Novell Products Buyers Guide
|> >
|> >The Buyer's guide is also on-line (and searchable).  The buyer's guide
|> >is a publication which describes all of Novell's products, and gives
|> >information such as hardware requirements, compatibility, parts numbers,
|> >etc.
|> 
|> Why not post it or allow others to post it?

I'll look into it.  I know it's available via FAX.  I'll see if it is
possible to post it or at least put it on-line somewhere.

|> >3.  Technical support via Internet (UNIXWARE ONLY)
|> 
|> Will you answer all questions or will you turn the IF and other users away
|> still?

I'm not sure what the policy is on support for OEM partners.

|> 
|> What is the turnaround time we can expect?

So far it's same-day (of course mail-routing sometimes can have
glitches, but we have techs whose primary responsibility is to 
answer e-mail even before taking phone calls.  Since this is 
a new service, it isn't being used all that much yet.  However, as
usage increases, we'll make sure response time is still fast.

|> Will we receive assigned problem numbers in the response or will that be
|> autoreplied and assigned at that time? 

If the reply is something that may not be a cut-and-dried solution, you 
will receive a problem number and the name of the technician handling
the issue.

|> 
|> >However, we ask that you be specific in your questions and that you
|> >include all pertinent information (i.e. updates installed, controllers,
|> >peripherals, RAM, Video, SoftWare used, versions, detailed problem
|> >descriptions, etc. etc.).  
|> 
|> You forgot to remind the users there are utilities they can use to 'dump' the
|> system configuration and information.  Perhaps you need to make a script that
|> will prompt the user for all the information you need, dump the rest from the
|> system, and e-mail it all in one shot.  This will save you the hastle and
|> delays of getting the user to reply to "So what type of controller do you
|> have?" type of questions.  
|> 
|> BTW: Send me a copy of the form that is on the X window and I'll write the
|> script myself. Ain't I a nice guy.... ;)

Thanks.   Here is what the e-mail looks like when it comes to us from the
web forms.  For now, regular e-mail doesn't have to have any specific
form, but it helps us if it's pretty similar to this:

Subject: Supportrequest UnixWare
To: Novell.COM!unixware (Multiple recipients of list unixware)
Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1993 11:24:16 -0700 (MST)
From: bantu.Provo.Novell.COM!From=Margulies


Fullname= <Full Name>
From= <e-mail address>
TelNo= <telephone number>
FaxNo= <Fax Number>
Region= <North America | Europe | Latin America | Australasia> (This is a list>
Product= <Product Name> (This is a list>
Computer= <Make of computer>
Memory= <Amt. of RAM>
Graphics= <graphics controller>
HDController= <Disk controller>
HDSizeType= <Disk size>
Network= <Network board>
Other= <Other hardware>
Update3=Installed (Radio button)
BNUupdate=Installed (Radio button)
Severity= <System Down | Somewhat Usable | Operation Not affected>
Version= <product version>
Reseller= <Where did you buy the system>
Problemdescription= <Description of problem.
FaxNo=(408)765-5521
Region=North America
Product=Application Server
Computer=intel 486-50 Xpress
Memory=32MB

4.  Product Information via Internet
|> 
|> Will you be releasing 'future' supported product info?

As soon as the information is announced publicly, yes.

|> Again, how often is this updated?

As soon as the docs are published, they'll also go on-line.

|> 
|> >ACCESS via the World Wide Web
|> >
|> >Please let us know if you find these services useful.
|> 
|> The WWW thing doesn't work for me. I'm on a terminal. Calling up via UUCP is
|> for the birds (especially if I have to call Long Distance).  The best
|> solution is a terminal interface that one can telnet into and/or a shell
|> script a user can run from their main system that will send for information,
|> send bug reports (with full docs on system configuration, etc), pull files
|> accross as necessary, etc.   This would be somewhat easy to build.  However,
|> since I do not know the format of your database and on how it can load the
|> information from a flat file, I may be completely wrong on my ideas.

Probably the best thing to do would be get a line-mode browser.  I know 
source for one is available via anon. ftp from ftp.info.cern.ch.  The
line mode browser is pretty nice if you're not working under the UNIX
desktop (or from a Mac or MS Windows).

|> 
|> Lastly, you need to post technical notes on a regular basis. Perhaps a
|> comp.unix.unixware.technotes would be in order.  This will cut down on
|> resources used by WWW and the other things.  It will provide an online
|> accessability to the users (Hey! You could make it Flib'able!). Etc.

I'll look into this and into getting a process for posting answers to the
most often asked questions.

|> 
|> Give it some thought...reply here....

Thought...Replied.

 

rfarr@Novell.com (Rich Farr) writes:

>In article <zorbaCGy6ww.1I4@netcom.com>, zorba@netcom.com (Harry Skelton) writes:
> 
>|> In article <CGx5t9.DBv@Provo.Novell.COM> rfarr@Novell.com (Rich Farr) writes:

[...deleted...]

>|> Can users post FAQ's or other documents to the database?

>Not Yet.  We hope to add the possibility of doing group annotations.
>Again, this one is down the road a little.

What if you don't like Novell and write an ugly flame - should this be
then searchable as a FAQ document?

I was thinking of creating a form where users could create responses which
would then be accessable by all other users, but I came up with a few problems.
Maybe you guys can give me your input on those :
1.) Is there enough discipline to stay technical and not starting general
    "Why is Novell doing it this way discussions - I'd like it another way?"
2.) Forms are only available to use with Mosaic for X, there is no other
    platform that supports forms right now (sniff) - How does someone with
    a line-mode browser go in there?
3.) Technical information being put in there may be wrong - It might just have
    worked because of the particular setup the writer of the document had.
    This would be misleading for others - but since it's on a Novell WWW server
    Novell would get the complaints

>|> Will this continue to be an open access database or will you require we
>|> switch to the NSE when the UNE programs are in full swing?

>I'm not management, but my understanding is this will continue to be
>open access.
The actual fight we had to go through was to get it online without customers
paying for it - Now that its online there will be hard justification to charge
for it :-)

>|> >2.  Novell Products Buyers Guide
>|> >
>|> >The Buyer's guide is also on-line (and searchable).  The buyer's guide
>|> >is a publication which describes all of Novell's products, and gives
>|> >information such as hardware requirements, compatibility, parts numbers,
>|> >etc.
>|> 
>|> Why not post it or allow others to post it?

>I'll look into it.  I know it's available via FAX.  I'll see if it is
>possible to post it or at least put it on-line somewhere.
The buyers guide IS online available via ftp!
check ftp://FTP.Novell.DE/pub/sjf-lwp/Buyers_Guide
and ftp://sjf-lwp/<somewhere>

The version we have online is written with HTML Markup - I'm not sure whether
you want that :-)
I also do not feel comfortable with posting it or getting it mirrored because
then it would be very hard for us to get it updated. Or if we have wrong
information in it which we correct on our system - how do we update your
local copy ? So if you just download from our what we have it's your
responsibility to see whether there is something new on our system.

[...deleted...]

>|> Will we receive assigned problem numbers in the response or will that be
>|> autoreplied and assigned at that time? 

>If the reply is something that may not be a cut-and-dried solution, you 
>will receive a problem number and the name of the technician handling
>the issue.

There are a few technical things to solve - but the system will generate a
valid call number and send you a confirmation response.
Shows that we are serious with that and taking the system as a valid
source of calls.

[...deleted...]

>|> Lastly, you need to post technical notes on a regular basis. Perhaps a
>|> comp.unix.unixware.technotes would be in order.  This will cut down on
>|> resources used by WWW and the other things.  It will provide an online
>|> accessability to the users (Hey! You could make it Flib'able!). Etc.

>I'll look into this and into getting a process for posting answers to the
>most often asked questions.

We are able to analyse the questions users are doing via the system. 
This gives us the opportunity to do such things. However it also implies
that people are using the system :-)

I don't know whether something like "The Top 50 of requested FYI documents"
would be fine ? Let me know.
>|> 
>|> Give it some thought...reply here....

>Thought...Replied.

I never think!

Peter
-- 
Peter Dennis Bartok               "I wish I knew what I'm doin' here all day!"
Unix Systems Support                                Novell Ease Administrator
Novell European Support Center                         pbartok@c3p0.Novell.DE
D-40549 Duesseldorf                                     Fax: +49 211 5277 772

eric@scalpel.centerline.com (Eric Williams) writes:

>In article <CGx5t9.DBv@Provo.Novell.COM> rfarr@Novell.com (Rich Farr) writes:

>> New Services On the Internet:
>> 
>> Described below are some of the services we've just
>> completed making available.  Please send comments on these services
>> (once you've seen them) to 'webmaster@novell.com'
>> 
>> 1.  Technical Information Database.

>I tried out your support database, and I found it to be *excellent*.
>Being a support person myself, I was wondering how you implement the 
>searching, and if/how this accomodates multiple keywords.  If you 
>specify multiple keywords, do you show documents that match ANY
>keyword, or only those that match ALL keywords?  IMO, with how large
>your database is, you should limit this to those that match ALL
>keywords.

Ok, it actually is very simple :-)

We are using WAIS (Wide Area Information Servers [I hope thats the right term]).
This consists of several parts, a search engine(server), indexing engine and
clients for textbased and graphical information query. It is based on
the z39-50 protocol which is (in my understanding) a kind of database
retrival protocol.
WAIS was developed by thinking machines inc. (Think.COM) and made publicly
available, it has now been taken over by 
" Clearinghouse for Networked Information Discovery and Retrieval (CNIDR) "
You can get wais at:ftp://ftp.cnidr.org/pub/NIDR.tools/freeWAIS-0.202.tar

The enginge we are using is the old wais (8b5) from thinking machines,
since we have porting probs with the other stuff.

freeWais does boolean searches, means it will only return documents matching
all words given.

wais (8b5) does some magic on matching documents and will have a kind of 
"hit value" and it will also return documents only matching one keyword.
However, it has a lower hit value and will appear later in the list.
The indexing engine automatically eliminates words occuring more then 
20.000 (!) times (e.g. you cant search for 'netware' only)

The magic to get wais implemented into the WorldWideWeb is done by 
a perl program I wrote.
Just check http://WWW.Novell.DE/Authors/PeterB/ - it will bring you to this
script (and a few other programs and scripts)

Any questions left over ? Just ask.

Peter
-- 
Peter Dennis Bartok               "I wish I knew what I'm doin' here all day!"
Unix Systems Support                                Novell Ease Administrator
Novell European Support Center                         pbartok@c3p0.Novell.DE
D-40549 Duesseldorf                                     Fax: +49 211 5277 772

Eric Williams (eric@scalpel.centerline.com) wrote:
: In article <CGx5t9.DBv@Provo.Novell.COM> rfarr@Novell.com (Rich Farr) writes:

: > New Services On the Internet:
: > 
: > Described below are some of the services we've just
: > completed making available.  Please send comments on these services
: > (once you've seen them) to 'webmaster@novell.com'
: > 
: > 1.  Technical Information Database.

: I tried out your support database, and I found it to be *excellent*.
: Being a support person myself, I was wondering how you implement the 
: searching, and if/how this accomodates multiple keywords.  If you 
: specify multiple keywords, do you show documents that match ANY
: keyword, or only those that match ALL keywords?  IMO, with how large
: your database is, you should limit this to those that match ALL
: keywords.

   I have worked product support myself and would like to commend Rich
   and Novell for makeing this service available. 

   The multiple keywords can be implementation can be done with the
    veronica interface. This will allow boolean expressions such as
    'scsi and controller' or 'scsi or controller'. The veronica interface
    is a perl script available on the net.


   A couple of other suggestions would be:

   Put your Top list into Mosaic. You know your top issues that your
   working on for fixes. Allow votes per problem. Some where on the
   net their was a Mosaic movie voter. I was thinking of takeing the
   same idea and applying it to the problems with Unixware. That way
   the management get's an idea what are the problem areas.  Also
   allow the customer to vote on if the problems is a bug fix or
   an enhancement. All this can be done with the fill in the forms
   type www. 

   Setup a fill in the forms bug report. Let your customers have 
   access to status reports on bugs filed. I have noticed working
   product support before the the customer will go through extrems
   documenting and finding bug, calling it in, a support engineer
   logs it in and the customer is left off with out knowing the 
   status.  It is my opinion that the customers that are willing 
   to take the time to do detailed reporting do not like calling
   through voice channels and wasteing time just ot get a status
   on a bug report. Novice admins gain the experience of monitoring
   such reports. This process allows the tech support engineers to
   concentrate on the real issues of reproducing the bugs and/or
   bug fixes etc.


   ------------------------------------------------------------------

   Don't worry about running out of bugs. Remember the theory behind
   UNIX is that it is a bottomless pit no matter which way you look
   at it.


---Bob


   

-- 
---
Bob Palowoda
palowoda@netcom.com