🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <90309.111451NIBMSCM@NDSUVM1.BITNET> NIBMSCM@NDSUVM1.BITNET writes:
>I know this group is not for product review, but what about programming
>products??  I'm trying to get everything situated for windows development
>and would like some opinions on the quality of Microsoft's Programmers Library
>CD (with the Denon drive) and the Microsoft C Run-time Library Source Routines.
>If anyone out there is using either in a development effort, I would appreciate
>your comments on their usefulness.

The Programmers Library CD: last time I looked at this it was a bit
out of date. I don't think it has been updated since it was released.
It has things like the complete text of Petzold's Programming Windows
-- version 2.0. The truth is, I don't think it is very useful, and the
places where it is out of date are a pain (you'd think it wouldn't be
that hard for Microsoft to keep it up to date).

The run-time library source may be useful to a windows developer,
because the windows C library is not very complete. However for those
one or two routines you need, you might just want to write them
yourself.

In summary these products are marginally useful but probably not worth
the money.

Joel Spolsky
spolsky@cs.yale.edu                                     Silence = Death

In article <27085@cs.yale.edu> spolsky-joel@cs.yale.edu (Joel Spolsky) writes:
>In article <90309.111451NIBMSCM@NDSUVM1.BITNET> NIBMSCM@NDSUVM1.BITNET writes:
>>I know this group is not for product review, but what about programming
>>products??  ...
>
>The Programmers Library CD: last time I looked at this it was a bit
>out of date. I don't think it has been updated since it was released.

Microsoft has recently (within the last 1-2 months) announced a new version
of the Programmers' Library CD.  If it has the new Petzold (it's out!), I 
think it would be quite worthwhile.  Has anybody actually seen the new 
version?

>The run-time library source may be useful to a windows developer,
>because the windows C library is not very complete. However for those
>one or two routines you need, you might just want to write them
>yourself.

We got a copy of the library sources because I was porting some code that
used sscanf from a dll.  (That's not supported in windows.)  The code
was not very well commented and I didn't need much of the functionality,
so I ended up rewriting to avoid the use of sscanf.

I think the sources would be very useful if you needed to better understand
the behavior of a library routine, or to make romable code.
-- 
Bob Goodearl -- goodearl@world.std.com

In article <1990Nov6.180958.17256@world.std.com> goodearl@world.std.com (Robert Goodearl) writes:
[ about MSC Library Source ]
>I think the sources would be very useful if you needed to better understand
>the behavior of a library routine, or to make romable code.

In fact, reading over some of the assembler code on those disks, I was
truly impressed by what hoops MS jumps through to squeeze more speed
out of their libraries. For example, string/memory copy functions use
the Intel memmov (REP MOV) instruction, but they also make sure to
word align for improved performance -- these libraries contain an
impressive amount of micro optimization, enough to scare me out of
every wanting to "roll my own".

But prepackaged libraries are not always the fastest, I once looked at
the code in the MPW (Apple Macintosh) C libraries and was unimpressed;
I wrote a strcpy which outperformed their library version.

Joel Spolsky
spolsky@cs.yale.edu                                     Silence = Death

In article <27085@cs.yale.edu> spolsky-joel@cs.yale.edu (Joel Spolsky) writes:
>In article <90309.111451NIBMSCM@NDSUVM1.BITNET> NIBMSCM@NDSUVM1.BITNET writes:
>>.... I'm trying to get everything situated for windows development
>>and would like some opinions on the quality of Microsoft's Programmers Library
>>CD.... 
>The Programmers Library CD: last time I looked at this it was a bit
>out of date.  [deleted] 
> The truth is, I don't think it is very useful [deleted]

Also, be warned that that the 15 or so books on the disk are in an
indexed (read: encrypted) format.  The little program that comes with
the CD is limited to cutting and pasting 200 lines at a time.  (Although
a skillful Superkey macro could automate this a good deal.)
Thus, dumping out a copy or two of Petzold to a laser printer is 
trickier than it might seem.  

For a big company with diverse needs, the MS CD can be an excellant buy.
However, if you are just doing Windows work you will be paying for megs
of material that you do not need.  BTW, on the subject of CDs in general,
the Ziff-Davis "Computer Library" series is excellent, especially given
the complex and fast-changing nature of the micro industry.  Also, Alde in 
Minnesota also has some c. $99 CD's that are very reasonable. 


Tom Rombouts  Torrance Techie  tomr@ashtate.A-T.com  V:(213) 538-7108