🚀 go-pugleaf

Ollie North <ollie@gop.com> wrote:

>Horray, Horray!!!  I love hearing about liars because I am one too!  I
>even have a radio show to advance my cynicism.  Keep up the good work
>"truth seeker".  By the way, next time, try posting this to an
>appropriate news group DUMBSHIT!!!!

>Sincerely,
>Ollie

>Truthseeker wrote:
>> 
>> This was originally posted to the Town Hall Forum (#3474)
>> 
>> 
>>   TO: MY DEMOCRAT FRIENDS
>>   FROM: MARK F. (THOR) HEARNE, II
>>   DATE: OCTOBER 11, 1996
>>   RE: THE CASE FOR CHARACTER
>> 
>> 
>>   "Bill Clinton would rather climb a tree to tell a lie than stand on
>> the
>> ground to tell the truth." So said an Arkansas official familiar with
>> Clinton on
>> CNN during the 1992 presidential campaign. Democrat Senator Bob Kerry
>> has
>> said,
>>   "Clinton's an unusually good liar. Unusually good. Do you realize
>> that?"
>>   Senator Kerry did not make this observation during the heat of a
>> primary
>>   battle but this past January in Esquire Magazine. Kerry is not only a
>> Democrat Senator but is a leader of his party and Chairman of the
>> Democrat
>> Senatorial Campaign Committee. Senator Kerry knows whereof he speaks.
>> 
>> 
>>   Forget what this says about Clinton - what does it say about us. We
>> are
>> told that Clinton is leading by a significant margin in his campaign
>> to
>> be our
>> next president. (51% to Dole's 38% according to last week's Wall Street
>> Journal/ABC poll.) We are told that "character" does not count. We are
>> told that a
>>   candidate's "personal life" has no relevance to the office of
>> President
>> and
>>   has no "traction" as a political issue. Indeed, we are even made to
>> feel
>>   ashamed for raising the issue. (On July 15th Clinton said, "I think
>> character is a legitimate issue and I look forward to having that
>> discussion." But,
>>   whenever the issue of character is mentioned Clinton dodges the
>> discussion
>> by claiming any question about his character is a viscous, Republican-
>> motivated "personal attack.")
>> 
>> 
>>   Consider the current bestseller list. A list which includes an
>> astounding
>>   number of books about the corruption which is the Clinton
>> administration.
>> Boy Clinton, Unlimited Access and Blood Sport are only a few. But
>> let's
>> concede
>>   Clinton the benefit of his denials and explanations. Even by this
>> analysis,
>> in the light most favorable to Clinton and taking only those facts
>> Clinton has
>>   acknowledged and granting him his spin on these facts, Clinton is
>> far
>> and
>> away the most dishonest president or presidential candidate in the
>> history of
>> our nation.
>> 
>> 
>>   Assume that only 10% of what these noted authors and a career FBI
>> agent
>> relate about Bill Clinton is valid. Assume that only 10% of the drug
>> use,
>> rampant
>>   promiscuity, financial fraud and blatant violation of state and
>> federal
>> law
>>   are accurate. Assume only 10% of the Wall Street Journal's four-year,
>>   two-volume documentation of Whitewater, Travelgate and FBI Filegate
>> is
>> not
>>   innuendo and conjecture. Assume that Clinton's unlikely explanation of
>>   Whitewater is correct. (It wasn't a crooked deal to funnel taxpayer
>> guaranteed funds from a Savings and Loan into his political campaign.
>> Rather, we are
>>   told, Bill and Hillary, naive in matters of money -- notwithstanding
>> Hillary's wildly successful commodities speculation -- were duped by
>> the
>> crafty
>>   McDougalls into a foolish real estate investment scheme funded by
>> kited
>> checks and illegal loans. Frankly, even if valid, I fail to find any
>> comfort in
>> this explanation. Do we want a sharp crook or a financially
>> unsophisticated waif
>> in charge of our national economy?)
>> 
>> 
>>   Granted even these assumptions, impeachment should be likely,
>> reelection
>>   unthinkable. Consider the following:
>> 
>> 
>>   Richard Nixon's administration collapsed, Nixon resigned the
>> presidency
>> and
>>   Chuck Colson was jailed over misuse of one FBI file and the related
>> cover-up. By contrast, Clinton and Craig Livingstone spirited away FBI
>> files on their
>>   political opponents by the hundreds and the cover-up and stone-walling
>>   continues.
>> 
>> 
>>   Spiro Agnew resigned the vice-presidency over charges of tax evasion
>> stemming from $16,000 he accepted from contractors when he was
>> Governor
>> of Maryland.
>> By contrast, Clinton has conceded that he filed misleading tax returns
>> that
>> did not properly disclose illegal loans made by a now-defunct S&L the
>> proceeds
>> of which were used in his campaign for Governor. The reason he is not
>> charged
>>   with tax evasion is that he released the tax returns after the
>> statute
>> of
>>   limitations had expired. Equally well established is the fact that
>> Hillary
>>   enjoyed more than $100,000 in "profits" steered to her from
>> commodities
>> 
>>   trading orchestrated by Tyson Foods in exchange for favorable
>> treatment
>> 
>>   accorded Tyson Foods by her husband the Governor.
>> 
>> 
>>   Gary Hart bowed out of the 1988 presidential race because of one wild
>> weekend in the Bahamas and a sleep- over in Washington D.C.. By
>> contrast,
>> Clinton
>> is being sued in federal court for enticing a young woman - against
>> her
>> wishes
>>  -- into his hotel room, dropping his trousers and suggesting she
>> engage
>> in a
>>   lurid sex act. Clinton's known sex-partners could form a single-file
>> line
>>   longer than the inaugural parade route. (At least JFK was honest
>> about
>> his
>>   philandering. During a 1961 meeting in Bermuda with British Prime
>> Minister
>>   Harold McMillian Kennedy said, "I wonder how it is with you, Harold?
>> If
>> I
>>   don't have a woman for three days, I get terrible headaches.")
>> 
>> 
>>   Ginsburg is not a member of the U.S. Supreme Court because he used
>> marijuana during college. By contrast, during Clinton's term national
>> drug use has
>>   doubled due to Clinton eviscerating drug enforcement. Remember also
>> Josalyn
>>   Elders, Clinton's selection for Surgeon General. In addition to her
>> crusade
>> to distribute condoms (for which she earned the moniker "the Rubber
>> Maid") and
>> to have mast. taught in public schools, she campaigned for the
>> legalization of
>>   drugs. During her term as Clinton's Surgeon General, Elders son was
>> convicted of felony cocaine and crack distribution. (If she couldn't
>> keep
>> her own son
>>   from pushing crack, how could she be expected to reduce national
>> drug
>> use?)
>> It is simply beyond belief that, with someone of Elder's views as his
>> pick for
>>   the nation's chief medical officer, Clinton expects us to believe he
>> truly
>>   wants to battle illegal drugs.
>> 
>> 
>>   On a personal level Clinton acknowledges that he used marijuana but
>> claims
>> he "didn't inhale". Yet in an MTV interview with high school students
>> Clinton
>>   states that if he had it do over again he, "probably should have
>> inhaled."
>>   Roger Clinton described his brother's appetite for cocaine by
>> stating,
>> "He
>>   (Bill Clinton) has a nose like a Hoover." (Referring to the vacuum
>> cleaner
>> not the president. who preceded Roosevelt.) But, we can discount this
>> allegation because Roger Clinton, along with Friend Of Bill Dan
>> Lasater,
>> have been
>>   convicted of felony drug charges for the distribution of cocaine.
>> 
>> 
>>   (As an entry for the "How'd They Do That" file consider this: Roger
>> Clinton
>>   served only two years for his cocaine distribution charges and Dan
>> Lasater
>>   served only six months. Roger cut a deal with the prosecutor to
>> testify
>> 
>>   against Lasater. Lasater was convicted but pardoned by Governor
>> Clinton.
>>   (Clinton says the pardon was so Lassater could qualify for a hunting
>> license.)
>> 
>> However, even as Lasater was being investigated for drug dealing
>> Clinton's
>>   Arkansas Finance Authority awarded Lasater authority to underwrite a
>> $30
>>   million bond issue. An undertaking for which Lasater pocketed
>> $750,000.
>> The
>>   purpose of this bond issue for which the state of Arkansas awarded
>> $750,000
>> to a drug dealer? An Arkansas state police communication facility.
>> Clinton's
>>   pardon of Lasater raises an interesting point. Why won't Clinton
>> promise to
>>   not pardon Susan McDougal (who is currently in jail because she
>> refuses
>> to
>>   testify about Clnton's role in the Whitewater scandal) and other
>> Whitewater
>>   defendants? Clinton has already indicated a willingness to put the
>> power of
>> a presidential pardon to a personal purpose. Clinton has pardoned Jack
>> Pakis
>> a Hot Springs, Arkansas bookie and close friend of the Clinton family.
>> 
>> 
>>   Given this, why is Clinton the favored candidate for president? Have
>> our
>>   standards for the office of president fallen this far this fast?
>> What
>> does
>> it say about us and our esteem for our nation that we would trust Bill
>> Clinton
>>   with the United State of America.
>> 
>> 
>>   A question should be asked of each vice-presidential candidate in the
>> upcoming debate. "Would you want your daughter to marry a man with the
>> personal
>>   character of your running mate?" Recall the question to Mike Dukasis
>> about
>> how he would view the death penalty if his wife itty was raped. Well,
>> why
>> not a
>>   similar question to Hillary. How would she feel if Chelsea brought
>> home
>> a
>>   boyfriend with the same character and integrity as Bill Clinton?
>> (Some
>> may
>> be upset with me for bringing Hillary into the discussion. After all,
>> they may
>>   retort, she is not running for office. Would it have been fair they
>> ask
>> to
>>   deny Lincoln the presidency because Mary Todd was a lunatic? To which
>> I
>> reply, Yes, if Lincoln had threatened to put Mary Todd in charge of
>> the
>> Union Army
>> as Clinton tried to do with Hillary and health care.)
>> 
>> 
>>   Two responses, and only two responses, are possible. One, all the
>> charges
>>   against Clinton are false and Clinton is, in truth, a noble and
>> honest
>>  -
>>   though much maligned - man. (This is the official White House
>> position.)
>> Two, the charges are, in whole or part, true but it just doesn't matter.
>> Clinton's character is irrelevant to his fitness to serve as president.
>> 
>> 
>>   If you opt for option number one, "Clinton is a wrongly- maligned
>> honest
>> man", than you probably also thought O.J. Simpson was framed. Halley
>> Barber's
>> line, "Clinton may not believe anything but his friends have
>> convictions
>>  - for
>> bank fraud, embezzlement, conspiracy..." resonates because it is true.
>> 
>> 
>>   Two-thirds of the Rose law firm, the source of Clinton's closest
>> colleagues
>>   including his wife, are either dead under suspicious circumstances
>> (Vince
>>   Foster), in jail after serving in the Clinton administration (Webster
>> Hubble) or under indictment or investigation by a special prosecutor
>> (William
>>   Kennedy). A similar fate has befallen many of Clinton's other top
>> advisors.
>>   Housing Secretary Henry Cisneros and Agriculture Secretary Mike Espy
>> subject to independent counsel investigation; former Commerce
>> Secretary
>> Ron Brown
>>   subject to an independent counsel investigation prior to his death;
>> Clinton
>>   understudy and friend Arkansas Governor Guy Tucker and Clinton
>> business
>> 
>>   partners Jim and Susan McDougal jailed for 24 count conviction for
>> bank
>> fraud and conspiracy. Clinton testified on behalf of the McDougals and
>> Governor
>>   Tucker. After the trial, jurors told reporters that they did not
>> believe
>>   Clinton's testimony and several jurors stated that, based upon the
>> evidence
>>   they considered, Clinton was definitely involved in the wrongdoing.
>> 
>> 
>>   It is simply not possible to consider the incredible number of
>> Friends
>> Of
>> Bill who are under indictment, under investigation by independent
>> counsel, in
>> jail or awaiting sentencing and conclude that all the charges against
>> Clinton
>> are false.
>> 
>> 
>>   Clinton apologists reply that it is unfair to paint Clinton with the
>> same
>>   brush as his jailed colleagues. Democrat Senator Chris Dodd claims
>> that
>> to
>>   view Clinton in light of his friends is to engage in "guilt by
>> association".
>>   These defenders argue that Clinton has just suffered the misfortune of
>> being surrounded by dishonest people and is not, himself, dishonest.
>> This
>> 
>>   explanation, even if credible, is of little comfort. Do we want as
>> president a man so lacking in judgment that he has a profoundly
>> uncanny
>> ability to
>> choose as his closest advisors a collection of crooks and felons.
>> 
>> 
>>   Bluntly put, Bill Clinton is an unmitigated, dissembling liar. What
>> Clinton
>>   says is meant to deceive not to inform. During an interview on
>> September
>> 23rd with PBS's Jim Lehrer Clinton said, "There is not a single
>> solitary
>> shred
>> of evidence of anything dishonest that I have done in my public life."
>> Most of
>> us hearing this proclamation would understand it to be a blanket
>> denial
>> of any
>>   wrongdoing. Clinton clearly intended to communicate this
>> understanding.
>> 
>>   However, reread Clinton's statement. "There is not a single solitary
>> shred
>> of evidence...." Clinton does not deny dishonestly, rather he denies
>> that
>> there is any evidence of his dishonesty. Quite a different proposition.
>> Continuing with a further qualification Clinton said, "...that I have
>> done in my
>> public life." The injection of "public life" presumes a distinction
>> with
>> Clinton's
>>   private life. Given the mountainous evidence of Clinton's
>> dishonestly,
>> we
>> can only conclude that Clinton believes using drugs, funding his
>> Arkansas
>> 
>>   gubernatorial campaigns, funding his presidential campaign, managing
>> the
>>   WhiteHouse travel office and FBI files and formulating national
>> policy
>> are
>> all part of his private life.
>> 
>> 
>>   Option Two, "Clinton is dishonest but character doesn't count when
>> choosing
>>   the President", is equally untenable. Consider the purpose of the
>> election.
>>   For starters, this November we will decide who will take the
>> constitutionally prescribed oath next January. A candidate for
>> president
>> does not become
>>   president by winning the election. The candidate must also take the
>> oath of
>>   office and does not become president until he does so. (Recall the
>> photograph of Lyndon Johnson taking the oath of office in Air Force
>> One
>> on the tarmac
>> in Dallas standing next to a blood- splattered Jackie Kennedy.)
>> 
>> 
>>   We do not make much of oaths now days. Yet, the men who crafted our
>> form of
>>   government, founded our nation and authored the Constitution placed
>> great
>>   significance on oaths and, correspondingly, the integrity of the
>> individual
>>   taking the oath. A man's honesty and integrity were vitally
>> important
>> to
>> our founding fathers. Thomas Jefferson, founder of the Democrat party,
>> wrote,
>> "We mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred
>> Honor."
>>   Of what value is Bill Clinton's "sacred honor" and to what cause
>> would
>> he
>>   pledge it? (Obviously not his wife, nor his country when called to
>> military
>>   service.) More importantly, would you believe him if he did?
>> 
>> 
>>   This is a more troubling question for my principled liberal friends.
>>   (Especially for those who make so much of Republican scandals
>> whether
>> it be
>>   Watergate, Iran- Contra or the Teapot Dome.) The most outrageous
>> Republican
>> is a piker compared to the mythomaniacs, miscreants and poltroons which
>> populate the Clinton administration. (Will someone please tell me George
>>   Stephanopoulos's job description and how whatever it is he does
>> furthers
>> the legitimate business of the presidency.)
>> 
>> 
>>   Those Democrats who support Clinton (and their allies in the media who
>>   overlook the Clinton scandals) have lost the right to ever again
>> mention
>>   Watergate, Iran-Contra or any other allegation of Republican
>> corruption.
>> 
>> 
>>   Most liberals acknowledge Clinton's fundamental dishonesty. However,
>> they
>>   appear willing to tolerate or overlook his moral failings because they
>> believe Clinton will advance a liberal ideology and Bob Dole will
>> oppose
>> the
>> liberal's agenda. But, in choosing Clinton as their standard bearer,
>> what
>> are
>> liberals saying about their own integrity and the validity of their
>> ideology?
>> 
>> 
>>   How can the noble ideals proffered by the liberal be reconciled with
>> the
>>   tawdry and untrustworthy reputation of their candidate? What does is
>> say
>> about the validity of liberalism that the adherents chosen advocate is a
>> consummate fraud? In choosing Clinton as their candidate (a candidate
>> who
>> liberals
>>   support because they believe he will govern with a liberal bent even
>> though
>> he publicly campaigns as a conservative) aren't liberals saying that
>> their
>> agenda is best advanced by disguising and concealing their ideology
>> and,
>> by
>>   implication, recognizing that if American voters truly appreciated the
>> liberal agenda they will reject the ideology?
>> 
>> 
>>   If I believed I had a worthy policy to advance I would not choose an
>> unworthy spokesman to advance the policy lest the message be sullied
>> by
>> the
>> messenger. If I was trying to sell a drug to cure cancer I wouldn't
>> choose Jack
>> Kavorkian to be my spokesman.
>> 
>> 
>>   Indeed, Clinton's failure to keep the faith even with political
>> bed-mates
>> is why two high-ranking administration officials resigned when Clinton
>> signed
>> the Republican welfare reform bill. A bill that Clinton had previously
>> promised
>> to veto. Abandoning Clinton is the only rational response available to
>> honest
>>   liberals who truly believe in the merits of their ideology.
>> 
>> 
>>   Others don't defend Clinton but disparage us. They argue:
>> 
>> 
>>   "So what if Clinton lies, uses drugs and cheats on his spouse, most
>> American's behave this way and it is hypocritical to hold a leader to
>> a
>> standard
>> higher than the standard by which we measure our own behavior."
>> 
>> 
>>   While I don't agree that Clinton's behavior is characteristic of the
>> typical American, I will grant this point for the sake of argument.
>> Granted even
>> that assertion, I dispute the central premise. Americans aspire to
>> greatness and
>>   have always been an optimistic people. Our leaders should be the
>> best
>> from
>>   among us not the worst.
>> 
>> 
>>   A far sadder event than a second Clinton term will be a second
>> Clinton
>> term
>>   because a majority of Americans believe a man of Clinton's integrity
>> is
>> 
>>   representative of the character of our nation.
>> 
>> 
>>   It has been said that hypocrisy is vice's tribute to virtue. Well,
>> if
>> so,
>>   Clinton should be Master of Ceremonies hosting a Telethon for Virtue.
>> Within hours of being elected president Clinton proclaimed that his
>> administration
>>   would be the most ethical ever. This promise was made in the context
>> of
>> 
>>   Clinton's campaign attacks upon the Bush administration for, what
>> Clinton
>>   claimed was, unethical behavior such as the State Department
>> official
>> who
>>   allegedly tried to pull Clinton's visa file and document Clinton's
>> trip
>> to
>> the Soviet Union during the time Clinton was leading anti-American
>> rallies
>>   overseas. Clinton was "shocked" at the Bush campaign's "outrageous"
>> use
>> of
>>   official personnel and records to gain an advantage on a political
>> adversary. Clinton can not understand, however, why everyone seems so
>> exercised about
>> the hundreds of FBI files on Republican opponents he and Craig
>> Livingstone have
>>   squirreled away in the White House.
>> 
>> 
>>   What does it mean when the victor of this fall's campaign will take
>> the
>> oath of office to lead our nation into the next millennium? For me I
>> want
>> to
>>   believe the man who places his hand on the Bible and says, "I do
>> solemnly
>>   swear that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the
>> United
>>   States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and
>> defend
>> the Constitution of the United States."
>> 
>> 
>>   November 5th is national examination day. The question is one of
>> character.
>>   Not Clinton's character but our character; our character as a nation
>> and as
>>   individual voters. And, if the answer is Bill Clinton, we all fail.
>> 
>> 
>>   Mark F. (Thor) Hearne, II

1) This is typical of the ultra-right wing conservative BS that Bob
Dole caters to! thats all I'll say on that.

2) This is a music newgroup, hence the name DC.MUSIC!!!!!, we are
musicians in a rapidly dying music scene, we dont need this group
cluttered up with junk that no body really cares about anyway!

3) My band, Division is playing @ Jaxx w/ No SaNER on saturday nov 2nd
9:00 pm






http://www.crosslink.net/~division


scott