🚀 go-pugleaf

Andy Hawkins <andy@gently.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Hi all,
> 
> I'm sure this is an FAQ, so I'll start by asking to pointers for the FAQ for
> this group if one exists.

You'll be want demon.ip.support.mac and that FAQ is kept at
http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk
 
> What I want to do is set up a Mac (not sure of exact model, but it's fairly
> new) to connect to Demon. I need mail (multiple accounts), news (ideally
> again read by more than one user), and web access initially.

It should come with Open Transport that handles the TCP/IP side, you can
then get FreePPP or OT/PPP to get it connected up, personally I
recommend the latter (I'm in the minority though it would seem), you
should be able to find it from www.apple.com.   For news I recommend Mac
Soup, It hinkt eh URL is www.snafu.de/~stk/ if that doesn't work, search
through www.kagi.com.  Depending on how new the machine is then it may
well already have Claris Emailer installed.  It might be worth picking
up a copy of .net Magaine as it contains IE & Netscape every month on
the CD along with a copy of Eudora Mail Lite.

> I intend to 'test' everything using my own account before getting my friends
> to get an account with Demon, so some method of disabling mail collection on
> the Mac would be nice.

Easy, don't set up an SMTP server :-)  Using POP3 is probably the
easiest solution anyway.
 
> I have a good understanding of TCP/IP configuration under Win95 / NT and
> Unix platforms, but have never touched a Mac, so I really only need the Mac
> specific parts.

To be honest it should be a breeze.

Andy Hawkins <andy@gently.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Hi all,
> 
> I'm sure this is an FAQ, so I'll start by asking to pointers for the FAQ for
> this group if one exists.
> 
> What I want to do is set up a Mac (not sure of exact model, but it's fairly
> new) to connect to Demon. I need mail (multiple accounts), news (ideally
> again read by more than one user), and web access initially.
> 
> I intend to 'test' everything using my own account before getting my friends
> to get an account with Demon, so some method of disabling mail collection on
> the Mac would be nice.
> 
> I have a good understanding of TCP/IP configuration under Win95 / NT and
> Unix platforms, but have never touched a Mac, so I really only need the Mac
> specific parts.
> 
> Any pointers would be much appreciated.
> 
> TIA
> 
> Andy

The Mac may have one of two TCP extensions TCP/IP is the newer and more
user friendly or MacTCP which is the older version. You will also need a
PPP extension (apple do one and there is one called FreePPP which is
very good). The PPP option when loaded appears in the TCP/IP or Mac TCP
control panel along with the standard ethernet interface if it has one.
Choose PPP as the network interface and then if you have TCP/IP give it
the domain name server addresses 158.152.1.58  &  158.152.1.43 in the
box at the bottom. There is also a scrolling list to do the same in
MacTCP. To configure PPP you will need the telephone number, domain/user
name and its password. There are also settings to configure the modem in
PPP (so that it knows which of the two serial ports - printer or modem
port - they are both interchangeable). The login scripts may be entered
in a series of fields with a WAIT or SEND pop-up menu. Just use whatever
PPP module you have to dial Demon up and it should log you on (he says).

I used to use TCP/IP and FreePPP with a Motorola 28.8k Lifestyle modem
but I had a lot of problems when logging in (it used to get stuck at
waiting for 'word:'). I then got OS8 and there is now a modem control
panel with loads of config profiles that seems to make it all go a lot
more smoothly. I liked the FreePPP as you could get a Control Strip
module to switch it on and off. It also displayed how long you'd been
connected and also totted up how long you'd used PPP since you last
reset it. I reset it all the time when my usage got bad though :).

Now you know what to be looking for, go have a look and see what is
already there and what needs loading. also mention which system version
it is.

As far as the mail and news go - I'd have to recommend IE4/Outlook
Express for multiple users and multiple mail accounts but the jury's
still out on the news capabilities (obviously Bill Gates thinks no news
is good news). I use MacSoup to download news. Its quick, efficient and
will download messages for offline reading. Beats the pants off
IE4/Outlook Express. Only problem is bad support for attachments and no
full newsgroup list means that you need to know the name of where you
wnat to go before you can go.

I hope this is of some use.

Alan
 

In article <1d5g069.1gobgdg1ucfj8mN@pwomar.demon.co.uk>,
Newsmaster@pwomar.demon.co.uk (Paul Womar) wrote:

>It should come with Open Transport that handles the TCP/IP side, you can
>then get FreePPP or OT/PPP to get it connected up, personally I
>recommend the latter (I'm in the minority though it would seem), you
>should be able to find it from www.apple.com.

If it's a fairly recent Mac, wouldn't it have OT/PPP bundled somewhere in
the Apple Extras folder?

As for FreePPP, I've found the various flavours on any info-mac mirror or
on ftp.demon.co.uk in pub/Mac/internet/ppp/

My preferred site is
ftp://sunsite.ic.ac.uk/computers/systems/mac/info-mac//

comm/inet/conn/ppp/free-ppp-105.hqx is my favourite flavour of FreePPP.

-- 
Peter

Hi Andy

If you are using OS 8.0 you may have problems with freePPP if you OS 8.0 the
set is straight
forward using the Internet Set Up Assistant which comes with it.

Cheers
Nemesis
peace and happiness is a state of mind

----------
In article <B125626696682BFA6@cara.demon.co.uk>, peter@cara.demon.co.uk
(Peter Ceresole) wrote:


In article <1d5g069.1gobgdg1ucfj8mN@pwomar.demon.co.uk>,
Newsmaster@pwomar.demon.co.uk (Paul Womar) wrote:

>It should come with Open Transport that handles the TCP/IP side, you can
>then get FreePPP or OT/PPP to get it connected up, personally I
>recommend the latter (I'm in the minority though it would seem), you
>should be able to find it from www.apple.com.

If it's a fairly recent Mac, wouldn't it have OT/PPP bundled somewhere in
the Apple Extras folder?

As for FreePPP, I've found the various flavours on any info-mac mirror or
on ftp.demon.co.uk in pub/Mac/internet/ppp/

My preferred site is
ftp://sunsite.ic.ac.uk/computers/systems/mac/info-mac//

comm/inet/conn/ppp/free-ppp-105.hqx is my favourite flavour of FreePPP.

-- 
Peter

Alan Guest <alan@macropolis.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Andy Hawkins <andy@gently.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> 
> > Hi all,
> > 
> > I'm sure this is an FAQ, so I'll start by asking to pointers for the FAQ for
> > this group if one exists.
> > 
> > What I want to do is set up a Mac (not sure of exact model, but it's fairly
snips ...
> > Any pointers would be much appreciated.
> > 
> > TIA
> > 
> > Andy
> 
> The Mac may have one of two TCP extensions TCP/IP is the newer and more
> user friendly or MacTCP which is the older version. You will also need a
> PPP extension (apple do one and there is one called FreePPP which is
> very good). The PPP option when loaded appears in the TCP/IP or Mac TCP
snips ..
> is good news). I use MacSoup to download news. Its quick, efficient and
> will download messages for offline reading. Beats the pants off
> IE4/Outlook Express. Only problem is bad support for attachments and no
> full newsgroup list means that you need to know the name of where you
> wnat to go before you can go.
> 
> I hope this is of some use.
> 
> Alan
>  

Eudora through the virtual POP server for e-mail and MacSOUP for news,
which does have a full group listing, at least mine does. 'Special'
menu, 'Show List of all groups' command.

-- 
Larry Stoter
17, Rocks Park Road, Uckfield, E. Sussex, TN22 2AT, UK
email: LPS@teknesis.demon.co.uk
Phone/Fax: +44 (0)1825 767967

Steve Firth <filter@firthcom.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Err, Special/Show List of All Groups works just fine and you can drag
> and drop between the list of all groups and the MacSoup settings window.
> You can also search the list of all groups using MacSoup's rather
> execellent Find... function.

It's just a pity that you can't doa  find whilst connected.  The
original poster may need to check the "Fetch List of All Groups" in the
connection box to get the list.  Macsoup [or Demon] does have a problem
with newgroups, whereby new groups tend to get added several times.
 
> As to the support for attachments... well it doesn't have M$ "kitsch"
> display of an icon for an atachment, but it works just fine, without
> turning MacSoup into a memory hogging monster.

I don't have any problem with it either, I find it little hassle to save
to disk and run stuffit ot UUCD over the files.

Steve Firth <filter@firthcom.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Alan Guest <alan@macropolis.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> 
> [MacSoup]
> > Only problem is bad support for attachments and no
> > full newsgroup list means that you need to know the name of where you
> > wnat to go before you can go.
> 
> Err, Special/Show List of All Groups works just fine and you can drag
> and drop between the list of all groups and the MacSoup settings window.
> You can also search the list of all groups using MacSoup's rather
> execellent Find... function.
> 
> As to the support for attachments... well it doesn't have M$ "kitsch"
> display of an icon for an atachment, but it works just fine, without
> turning MacSoup into a memory hogging monster.
> 
> -- 
> Steve Firth                . Iron Law of Distribution: Them that has,
>   ukm@firthcom.demon.co.uk . gets.
> Message and .sig (c) 1998  . 
> $500 to reproduce either.  . 

OK. I did write the 'cons' of MacSoup without checking the facts. It
does have a full newsgroup listing as you say but mine has always been
dimmed in the menu as I have never asked it to download a list of all
groups. Why it can't download a list at first connection to the news
server as Netscape and IE do seems beyond me. Your second comment
however sounds like 'I like being techy for the sake of it". If you're
trying to tell me that receiving loads of hexadecimal in a text file is
the ideal way of receiving attachments then I find it difficult to
believe that you are a Mac user. A small icon and a bit of code to hide
all that shit isn't going to bust the memory bank. 
Without being partisan or biased (I'm certainly not a Microsoft fan) I
would say that MacSoup is an efficient, well written piece of software
that suffers from a poor interface as opposed to IE/Outlook Express
which is quite a badly written piece of software with a good interface.
I've searched all over in menus and prefs in MacSoup to find things that
I needed and it's not that I'm some sort of muppet. I use software
ranging from Quark to Photoshop, Windows NT to IRIX. If it's a two month
learning curve for a bit of newreading software then it must have a bad
interface. I use email and news as an extension of my usual work. I
don't have time to persevere with a bad interface/bad programming which
is why I ditched the idea of using Outlook for reading news after 1 day.

Despite not being a big Microsoft fan, I have to hand it to them for the
way they have developed IE. As a case study of how to develop software
it is a fine example. A couple of years ago explorer appeared as what
may have been mistaken as a bit of badly written shareware and has added
a long list of functionality to it. In true Microsoft style some of the
functionality doesn't function but it does show what can be done to
software in a couple of years. Why is it then that we have to pay �100
for an upgrade for a fraction of the functionality a free piece of
software has had added in the same space of time?

Ideally, I would like Cyberdog without the OpenDoc (which I thought was
a disaster) and some of the extra functionality offered in Outlook by
Contacts and Rules, with the offline capabilities, speed and efficiency
of MacSoup. I don't think I'll ever get that but I can always dream.


-- 

Alan Guest <alan@macropolis.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> OK. I did write the 'cons' of MacSoup without checking the facts. It
> does have a full newsgroup listing as you say but mine has always been
> dimmed in the menu as I have never asked it to download a list of all
> groups. Why it can't download a list at first connection to the news
> server as Netscape and IE do seems beyond me. 

It gives you the option in the connection box, I'm very glad it gives me
the option, it annoyed the hell out of me when I was trying out news
software, I knew the groups I wanted so I'd liked to have just typed
them i instead of spending 5 minutes several times over) downloading a
list of 30,000+ newsgroups.

Paul Womar <Newsmaster@pwomar.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Alan Guest <alan@macropolis.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> 
> > OK. I did write the 'cons' of MacSoup without checking the facts. It
> > does have a full newsgroup listing as you say but mine has always been
> > dimmed in the menu as I have never asked it to download a list of all
> > groups. Why it can't download a list at first connection to the news
> > server as Netscape and IE do seems beyond me. 
> 
> It gives you the option in the connection box, I'm very glad it gives me
> the option, it annoyed the hell out of me when I was trying out news
> software, I knew the groups I wanted so I'd liked to have just typed
> them i instead of spending 5 minutes several times over) downloading a
> list of 30,000+ newsgroups.

Yes, but you only need to do this once though and you would have thought
that Internet Config could be extended to utilise one common newsgroup
list for all apps.

Alan Guest <alan@macropolis.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Yes, but you only need to do this once 

But if I don't want to do it, I don't want to do it and see no reason
why I should have to.

> though and you would have thought
> that Internet Config could be extended to utilise one common newsgroup
> list for all apps.

That is an idea but then where do you stop, maybe we should have shared
news & mail spools too?

Paul Womar <Newsmaster@pwomar.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> That is an idea but then where do you stop, maybe we should have shared
> news & mail spools too?

Well, as I understand it, that's the way *nix works, and I can see it
being very handy, you can choose which news reader or mail program to
use without mucking up your read and unread articles etc.

-- 
'ric

ric <btgsch@rmplc.co.uk> wrote:

> Paul Womar <Newsmaster@pwomar.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> 
> > That is an idea but then where do you stop, maybe we should have shared
> > news & mail spools too?
> 
> Well, as I understand it, that's the way *nix works, and I can see it
> being very handy, you can choose which news reader or mail program to
> use without mucking up your read and unread articles etc.

I wasn't saying it was necessarily a bad thing, just probably a job a
lot bigger than what the IC developers had in mind.