🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <gmwD25w164w@mantis.co.uk> mathew@mantis.co.uk (mathew) writes:

   What exactly do you mean by an "out-and-out copy"?

The interface presented by GEM 1.0 was almost identical to the Macintosh
interface--so much so that casual passersby, in my experience, often
thought they were looking at a Macintosh.  This is, assumably, what
Apple objected to...

   I'd be more impressed with your argument if Apple were to send out a press
   release saying that they specifically will not be pursuing any of the above
   systems even if they win their case.

And I'd be more impressed with your argument if Apple were to send out
letters warning of possible infringement, etc., as is, after all, standard
legal practice.  Apple certainly does this with other sorts of infringement...

   At the moment, we have to rely on Apple's good will, and hope that
   they are only going after out-and-out copies of the Mac UI.

True enough.  So far, they seem to be showing that good will.  If they
turn out not to, I'll be up there arguing with the rest of you...  I'm
just not willing to comdemn them pre-emptively.

   OS/2 2.0 might draw some attention from Apple. Apart from that, I
   really don't see that any of them are competing with Apple to
   anything like the sort of degree Microsoft is with Windows. Apple
   didn't even have UNIX until quite recently.

I dunno.  Baby UNIX boxes are competing with Macs a lot these days,
especially Sun's SLC&IPC, and assorted 386 boxes running Motif...

   So you support the idea that only Apple should be allowed to have a
   pull-down menu bar at the top of the screen?  What other sort of
   menu presentation is suitable for small computers with limited
   screen space?

How about menu bars per window?  Popups from the background (a concept
which only has to be taught once, just like the Mac's menubar)?  Besides,
fewer and fewer machines these days have "limited screen space"...

   Sorry, perhaps it was just the THREAT of a lawsuit. I suppose THAT makes it
   alright, doesn't it?  (Deep sarcasm)

Like I said, just show me a reference.  If it really happened, it
shouldn't be hard to dig up, right?  After all, you heard about from
somewhere, right?  (more deep sarcasm)

   Right. Well let's be specific then. *I* want any windowing system I use to
   have expanding boxes and drag-and-drop file deletion via a wastebasket icon.
   Is there some reason why I should be forced to buy only Apple products as a
   result of my design preferences?

I want to drink my soda out of red cans with white and silver script on them,
with nice curvy wavy shapes as accents.  Is there any reason I should be
forced to buy Coca-Cola products as a result of my preferences?

I want to read descriptions of algorithms written by Donald Knuth.  Is there
some reason I should be forced to buy them from Addison Wesley?

More to the point, I want my stereo to have no visible controls and be
flat and sleek.  Why should I be forced to buy it from Bang & Olufsen?

The Mac is the result of design and implementation done at Apple.  If you
want a Mac, they'll sell you one.  If you don't, then don't buy one.  No
one's forcing you.  If you want to buy something just like a Mac from
someone else, why should Apple be required to let you benefit from their
investment of time and money?

Do you believe in such a thing as intellectual property?  If not, we might
as well stop now, because I doubt you can convince me.  I am a firm believer
in property rights, intellectual and otherwise.

   Why should computers be different?

They *shouldn't*.  In any other industry, manufacturers try to make their
products *different* from anyone else's.  Even "knockoffs" are generally
distinguishable from the originals.  When they aren't, they get into trouble,
as in the case of "clones" of designer handbags, etc...

   So saying "You can build cars, but you're not allowed to use a steering
   wheel" just necessitates a little extra design work?

I'm getting a little tired of this steering wheel analogy--it's more analogous
to someone claiming sole rights to the mouse.  But anyway...

   You think that having every manufacturer's car steer a different
   way -- some with a joystick, some with a wheel, some with a
   horizontal bar -- would be a sensible state of affairs?!

It's hard for to guess, but I certainly woulnd't mind trying it.  As I have
said before, I hardly think a steering wheel is the ideal control device for
a car.  Its sole advantage is its familiarity.

--
Amanda Walker						      amanda@visix.com
Visix Software Inc.					...!uunet!visix!amanda
-- 
A seminar on time travel will be held two weeks ago.