🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <CKuod.177750$df2.57535@edtnps89>, Me@home.ca says...
>
>
>> I'm just as skeptical about your expertise regarding mental health,
>> particularly OCD, as you are of mine.  But I am prepared to discuss any
>aspect
>> of the topic with you in order to find out if my skepticism is warranted.
>You,
>> on the other hand, don't seem to be as forthright.  You made an accusation
>that
>> I don't know much about OCD because of a claim I made.  You can either
>attempt
>> to refute the claim or our ad hominems will remain deadlocked.
>>
>
>OK.  I'll bite.  I am not going to get into a long discussion about mental
>health since this is neither the thread, nor am I so inclined.  However,
>your claim that religious ritual is no different than an OCD ritual is false
>because of one very important point; choice. 

Actually I said ruminating over Pascal's Wager is OCD, but I also endorse the 
claim that religious ritual is closely associated with OCD.  There is 
absolutely nobody with the most rudimentary knowledge of OCD who isn't aware 
of this, so it's quite amusing to me that you'd be attempting to claim I 
don't know what I'm talking about.  I'll proced now to cite a ton of 
references:


http://www.bio-behavioral.com/ocd.asp

Bio-Behavior Institute's definition of OCD:
 
"An obsessive thought is quite invasive and may stay for long periods at a 
time.  It is experienced as "ego dystonic," meaning that the individual does 
not truly believe in the thought, but is unable to erase it from his/her mind. 
 Patients often express how "illogical" or "ridiculous" their thoughts are, but 
still experience a great deal of anxiety.   It is our experience that 
contamination, sexual, religious, and morbid thoughts are the most common. 

Obsessions thinking might be "magical" in that patients believe that the mere 
act of thinking can prevent or control a harmful event or wrongdoing. For 
example, thinking of a good word or number every time a negative thought enters 
the mind in order to prevent harm.  Magical thinking often occurs in 
conjunction with particular rituals. "


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5353151/

"Kids with OCD tend to display what I call "magical thinking". The adage, "if 
you step on a crack, you'll break your mother's back" is similar to the 
thinking of the youngster with obsessive-compulsive thoughts or actions. 
Rationally, the individual knows that stepping on a crack in a sidewalk has 
nothing to do with hurting his mother's back, yet many of us grew up jumping 
over cracks and, guess what, our mothers never did break their backs!" - Dr. 
Ruth A. Peters

www.lancs.ac.uk/staff/subbotsk/0604subb.pdf

"Psychological research has shown thatin healthy children there is a 
significantassociation between magical thinking obsessive-compulsive thoughts 
andbehaviours (Bolton et al., 2002)."


> In addition, the practice of religion has no true pathology
>because it is not a mental issue.  

I disagree. See: The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral 
Mind (1976)


>
>Your claim is tantamount to claiming that all soldiers in combat are
>psychopathic because they can kill without any remorse in the moment. 

My claim has nothing to do with that, but in fact troops who haven't been 
combat-tested tend to fire high on purpose.  It turns out shooting people isn't 
something that comes to most people naturally.


> Again
>psychopaths have a very specific pathology and while there is a larger
>preponderance of psychopaths in the military, not all soldiers who kill are
>psychopaths. 

Apparently your claim is that because psychopaths in the military exist, and 
because people with OCD exist, and because both conditions have 'specific 
pathologies', that you are ummm, making an argument?  I can't tell.  You do 
realize how poorly you're doing in this debate, don't you? 


> Consequently, your statement comparing OCD with the practice
>of religion is not only false, but it calls into question the rest of your
>argument; since from the perspective of logic, one fallacy invalidates an
>argument.

Feeble application of slippery slope fallacy..

>End of discussion on OCD and mental health.  If you want to continue the
>discussion on whether the Bible is false or not, fire away.

That sounds like a dull discussion, I'll leave that OCD ritual to you!