Article View: misc.consumers
Article #8617Re: Don't you just love America?
From: Tiny Human Ferret
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 03:19
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 03:19
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7077 bytes
Che'Gu Maru wrote:
>
> "Tiny Human Ferret" <ixnayamspay_klaatu@earthops.net> wrote in message
> news:3D60377E.2343B887@earthops.net...
> > Che'Gu Maru wrote:
> > >
> > > We have every right to control our borders, and should do so.
> > >
> > > However, there are a lot of "Mexicans" living in the United States who
> are
> > > citizens
> >
> > __NO__.
> >
> > "Mexicans" are citizens or nationals of Mexico.
> >
> > Citizens of the United States of America are "Americans".
> >
>
> In once sense I stand corrected. In another, however, you misread me. I
> deliberately put the term, "Mexican" in quotes originally to indicate that
> although I was talking about people who some may call "Mexican", in fact
> they are NOT Mexicans.
THANK you.
>
> > > and whose families lived here far before that of the poster. I
> > > personally know some whose family histories predate the Mexican-American
> > > war, and who became American by default after we gained New Mexico, Arizona,
> > > and California.
> >
> > Try reading the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo sometime.
>
> Been there, done that, albeit about thirty years ago.
Right. I'm mostly a little upset at your use of the phrase "by default" in a
rather cavalier way; after the Treaty GH those who wished to retain "the
character of Mexicans" were to remove themselves to the south of the border;
those who chose to remain were to adopt "the character of Americans". I
suppose you can say that they became Americans by default. But having lived
for some time in Texas, I can tell you that most of the Americans of Mexican
ancestry to whom I ever spoke, had a fairly low opinion of Mexicans. These
guys might have grown up speaking Spanish, but they seemed to consider
themselves as blessed; they had all of the advantages of being American and
most of them seemed to think of illegal aliens as the worst of the worst.
> >
> > >
> > > They have every right to be here. A surprisingly large number, like Roy
> > > Benavidez, proved it beyond any doubt whatsoever.
> > >
> > > I appreciate the poem and the humor in it. But you are also implicitly
> > > insulting a lot of people who not only don't deserve it, but who
> > > individually may be a better American than thou.
> >
> > Get off it. That bit of doggerel doesn't talk about US citizens who are
> > "hispanic", it doesn't talk about Legal Immigrants, it speaks of the ongoing
> > and institutionalized abuses of the US by ILLEGAL ALIENS.
> >
> > You're an American citizen of Mexican-ancestry? Fine! We're all Americans.
>
> Actually I'm a native-born American of Neanderthal ancestry.
Fine with me. I've got some substantial brow ridges myself. However,
reliable rumor indicates that I got my brow ridges from evolution on another
planet. Feel free to disbelieve this, however, despite your ancestry, my
ancestry, anyone's ancestry -- US Constitution Amendment 14 Section 1 still
applies. If a corporation is legally a person and a citizen, so is anyone
who was born here or naturalized. Your allegiances should be to the Republic
which admits your rights, not to nations or tribes which repressed your
rights.
> >
> > However, remember, a Mexican is a citizen of Mexico, unless they are here by
> > permission, they're here without permissions.
> >
> > Legal Immigrants are welcome, they're invited.
> >
> > ILLEGAL ALIENS have invaded in numbers of no less than 8 millions over the
> > last decade.
> >
> > ILLEGAL ALIENS' costs are well-documented. See
> > http://www.bordercounties.org/
> >
> > What can you do about it? Not much. Some things can work in some places,
> > though. See http://www.ranchrescue.com/
>
> Actually, the data on the costs of illegal aliens isn't as well-documented
> as you might think.
You are about to step onto a land-mine. In fact, I think you just did.
> An argument has been made, at least, that when they hold
> jobs under false identities, they contribute to Social Security, Medicate,
> and pay income tax, none of which will ever come back to them.
Huddle (Rice University) (et al, including the GAO and especially the US
Commission on Immigration Reform [the so-called "barbara jordan report")
have concluded that while there may be a slight benefit conferred to the
Federal government for these reasons, disproportionately, the State and
Local jurisdictions and revenue authorities take a massive hit in the
finances. Please examine the bordercounties reports. See also Senator Kyl's
documentation of the near-collapse of medical systems in areas overrun with
illegal aliens. If the Federal government has to start compensating the
State and local jurisdictions and revenue authorities, illegal aliens become
a dead loss all around.
> Some people
> think (and I disagree with them) that the only reason we haven't cracked
> down harder on illegals is that they are all that is keeping Social Security
> afloat. I'm not saying this is a correctd argument, but certainly you have
> to include these figures in any valid estimates of the "costs of illegals."
Been there. done that. See GAO, see Huddle, see USCIR, see
http://www.earthops.net/immigration/ and prowl around. Mirrored at
http://media.earthops.net/
--
Be kind to your neighbors, even though they be transgenic chimerae.
Whom thou'st vex'd waxeth wroth: Meow. <-----> http://earthops.net/klaatu/
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X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 106ed4,1e618fe1c86c29f8 X-Google-Attributes: gid106ed4,public X-Google-Thread: 101049,1e618fe1c86c29f8 X-Google-Attributes: gid101049,public X-Google-Thread: 109097,1e618fe1c86c29f8 X-Google-Attributes: gid109097,public X-Google-Thread: 10fa57,1e618fe1c86c29f8 X-Google-Attributes: gid10fa57,public X-Google-Thread: 107518,1e618fe1c86c29f8 X-Google-Attributes: gid107518,public X-Google-Thread: fa37c,1e618fe1c86c29f8 X-Google-Attributes: gidfa37c,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2002-08-20 20:27:33 PST Message-ID: <3D6306B5.68574A27@earthops.net> Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 03:19:17 +0000 From: Tiny Human Ferret <ixnayamspay_klaatu@earthops.net> Organization: copyright 2002 all rights reserved -- non-UseNet transmission prohibited. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.0.38 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: misc.consumers,ok.general,ca.general,dc.general,nj.general,houston.general Subject: Re: Don't you just love America? References: <3D5C278C.20D6D2AE@nospam.com> <ajlpfr$1toe$1@news.hal-pc.org> <3D60377E.2343B887@earthops.net> <ajpj0a$139c$1@news.hal-pc.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NNTP-Posting-Host: 65.205.1.226 X-Trace: vienna7.his.com 1029899958 65.205.1.226 (20 Aug 2002 23:19:18 -0400) Lines: 124 X-Authenticated-User: tjh22isp Path: arc1-ca.pugleaf.net!archiver1.google.com!news1.google.com!sn-xit-02!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-06!sn-xit-04!supernews.com!iad-peer.news.verio.net!news.verio.net!newsfeed.stueberl.de!cox.net!news.lightlink.com!vienna7.his.com