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Thread View: misc.emerg-services
5 messages
5 total messages Started by Charles S. Krin, DO FAAFP Sat, 10 May 1997 00:00
re: case 2
#2333
Author: Charles S. Krin, DO FAAFP
Date: Sat, 10 May 1997 00:00
100 lines
4943 bytes
OK, here's the first set of responses. 
>> 35 year old black male presents to the emergency department at your
>> hospital  .... with complaints of weakness and nausea. 
>For how long? 
problems have been increasing over the last several days.
>Any emesis with the nausea?
no
> Dizziness?
no
> Chest pain?
minimal, described as heartburn
>Bowel/bladder changes?
some loose stools, one or two a day.
>> He is well known to your facility as a homeless person dependent on
>>the ED for all of his medical care. Past medical history includes
>>alcoholism and hypertension. He states that he has been out of his
>>medications for several days.
>WHat meds? When was last dose?
He has previously been on Clonidine 0.2 mg po tid and
Hydrochlorthiazide 25 q am

>Has he ever been hospitalized before for his HTN? for anything?
 He has been hospitalized multiple times for problems related to poor
nutrition and hypertensive urgency.'

>> He states that his appetite has been down for several days, but denies
>> increased alcohol consumption, beyond his normal 2 pints of
>> "Thunderbird" per day. Further questioning reveals a moderately
>> productive cough,
>Color, quantity of sputum? Smoker? Asthma history?
Sputum is scanty and thick, rusty brown. Smokes up to three packs a
day of "OP's" when he can get them. No history of asthma.

>>2 pound weight gain since last visit three weeks
>> ago.
 
>> Physical exam shows B/P 100/60 seated, pulse 100, respirations 35 with
>> 1 sentence dyspnea.
>Get some O2 on him immediately. Pulse oximetry, 
O2 2 lpm per nc started. Pulse ox on Room Air 85%, increases to 90%
after O2 started
>EKG immediately!!!
Shows sinus rythm with occasional PVC's

> Place a hep lock and draw labs.
Done. 
>> Head is atraumatic, PERRLA, EOMI. Mouth is moist with poor dentition
>> and bad halitosis.
>Is that "bad halitosis" or FOUL?
Foul, and it persists when the patient is breathing through his nose 
>> Lungs show marked rales bilaterally with decreased breath sounds.
>> Heart is mildly tachycardiac, regular rate and rythem without murmurs,
>> gallops or rubs.
 
>> Abdomen is soft and non tender with mild tympany and distention. No
>> obvious masses are found on palpation, but the liver margin is found
>> behind the costal margin.
> 
>> Genitalia shows moderately atrophic testes, otherwise normal
>> uncircumcised male. Rectal shows marked hemorrhoids.
> 
>> Extremities show moderate clubbing, minimal cyanosis and 2 + pitting
>> edema.
> 
>> Weather has been in the high 70's during the day, dropping to the 40's
>> overnight. He is dressed in a heavy, ragged coat, and shivers in the
>> 65 deg. exam room. While you are talking to him, he is occasionally
>> looking off to either side, and asking you to repeat your questions.
> 
>> Question 1: What further information do you want to try to obtain on
>> the history?

>See above...and I'm sure that I'm missing some biggies..HIV status? TB
>status? 
Recent HIV testing at the TB clinic was negative, but he has completed
a 6 month course of observed triple drug therapy.
>> Question 2: How much can you depend on any history he gives you that
>> is not previously documented? (by the same token, how much can you
>> depend on the old documentation obtained from the patient which is not
>> backed up by family or professional observations?)
>Probably little to none, but it's the "best you've got" right?
right- however there's a hint above as to where you can find more
history- time is now 1000 hrs on a Tuesday morning. 
>> Question 3: What is your working assessment, and what do you want to
>> do while waiting for the doc to arrive and re evaluate the patient?
> Wouldn't be comfortable with diagnoses yet, but my "BIG #" differential would include:
>1- CHF
>2- Pneumonia
>3- PE
All of which are good working diagnoses, but there are a couple of
addtional ones that you have missed despite a flare lit history.
> Question 4: What lab work or tests would you want to have ready to
> roll by the time the doc gets there?


> CBC, PT/PTT, ABGs, SMA-20 to include LFTs & amylase.  Chest X-Ray, EKG.
Ekg above, others pending.

ck
Re: case 2
#2319
Author: Carey Gregory
Date: Sun, 11 May 1997 00:00
14 lines
1089 bytes
Not much I can add in terms of exam, labs, etc, so I'll cut right to the
chase...

Working diagnosis is lung abscess.

Given the ETOH hx, etiology of aspirated material from periodontal
disease is a good possibility, lung CA is another.  Direct extension
from a liver abscess is an outside possibility.

-- 
Carey Gregory, EMT-I
Deputy Chief, EMS
Canton (CT) Fire & EMS
Re: case 2
#2323
Author: Charles S. Krin, DO FAAFP
Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 00:00
30 lines
1885 bytes
On 11 May 1997 16:21:36 GMT, laadedah@aol.com (LaaDeDah) wrote:

>In article <3378d7fd.30608086@news.iamerica.net>,
>nospam*ckrin@Iamerica.net (Charles S. Krin, DO FAAFP) writes:
>
>>> Wouldn't be comfortable with diagnoses yet, but my "BIG #" differential
>>would include:
>>>1- CHF
>>>2- Pneumonia
>>>3- PE
>>All of which are good working diagnoses, but there are a couple of
>>addtional ones that you have missed despite a flare lit history.
>>> Question 4: What lab work or tests would you want to have ready to
>>> roll by the time the doc gets there?
>>
>>
>
>Lung CA.  TB. Besides the others above mentioned, what else would result
>in "rusty" (I assume this means hemoptysis) sputum?  Are we looking for a
>zebra here, or is this a straight forward kinda case?
>This is fun, we should do more of these....
>LauraA

rusty sputum is a classic sign, and not of TB or lung cancer- Sir
William Osler noted that it was one of the oldest consistent signs of
one of the problems that this patient has. (and he wrote at the turn
of the last century!)

ck
Re: case 2
#2324
Author: Starlight
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 00:00
12 lines
1313 bytes
Charles S. Krin, DO FAAFP (ckrin@Iamerica.net*nospam) wrote:
: 
: rusty sputum is a classic sign, and not of TB or lung cancer- Sir
: William Osler noted that it was one of the oldest consistent signs of
: one of the problems that this patient has. (and he wrote at the turn
: of the last century!)

has to be pulmonary edema from congestive heart failure.  the rusty sputum
gives it away.  :)
Becky
harmony@apk.net
Re: case 2
#2326
Author: Eazy-T
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 00:00
14 lines
1204 bytes
Starlight (kicker@apk.net) wrote:
: Charles S. Krin, DO FAAFP (ckrin@Iamerica.net*nospam) wrote:
: : 
: : rusty sputum is a classic sign, and not of TB or lung cancer- Sir
: : William Osler noted that it was one of the oldest consistent signs of
: : one of the problems that this patient has. (and he wrote at the turn
: : of the last century!)
: 
: has to be pulmonary edema from congestive heart failure.  the rusty sputum
: gives it away.  :)

Rusty sputum = pneumococcus (gram-positive lancet-shaped diplococci), not
CHF
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