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Archive-name: misc-forsale-faq/buying-selling
Posting-Frequency: 6th & 21st of the month
Last-modified: 1995/07/26
Version: 4.33
Major-Changes: Title change to make web-friendly
URL: http://www.phoenix.net/~lildan/FAQ


		--The Usenet Marketplace FAQ--

Volume II.	    The How-To of the
Transactions	       biz.marketplace.*
			  and misc.forsale.*
			     newsgroups

The entire FAQ is now in full hypertext on the Web.  If you
have a web browser, then for goodness sakes, don't plow
through the text version!  Point your web browser to:
	<http://www.phoenix.net/~lildan/FAQ>

maintained by Daniel King 	<mailto:lildan@phoenix.net>
	Suggestions/comments/flames always welcome!
-----------------------------------------------------------

Volume I. Posting Ads on the Usenet Marketplace
	1.  Welcome to the Usenet Marketplace!
	2.  Purpose of the Usenet Marketplace.
	3.  What is appropriate to post, what isn't?
	4.  Which newsgroup should I post to? [Full Group List]
	5.  How can I receive newsgroups not carried by my site?
	6.  Other advertising servers on the Internet.
	7.  What must I include in my ad?
	8.  Considerations for profit-motivated entities.
		Subtopic:  A short guide to cancelling articles

Volume II. Conducting Transactions on Usenet
	9.  Where can I find what I'm looking for?
        10.  How to consummate Usenet Marketplace transactions.
	11.  Additional International considerations.
	12.  Glossary of misc.forsale.* terms

----------------------------------------------------------


------------------------------

Subject: 9. Where can I find what I'm looking for?

  Are you looking for a better television?  Maybe you want a new
    hard drive for your computer?  Or perhaps you just need a
    programming consultant for a few weeks.  In any of these
    cases, and many more, you've come to the right place.  The
    Usenet Marketplace groups are a forum where sellers offer
    their merchandise and services, and buyers find great deals
    on things they want.  Between commercial ads in the
    biz.marketplace groups and individual ads in the misc.forsale
    groups, you should be able to find or sell just about
    anything, if you're patient.  If you can't wait, you might
    post a wanted ad, or browse the many classified ad services
    on the Internet.  For more information, read the appropriate
    Subjects in the first volume of the FAQ.  The rest of this
    volume is devoted to helping you complete your transactions
    once a buyer-seller pair has been matched.

------------------------------

Subject: 10. How to consummate Usenet Marketplace transactions.

  A buyer-seller pair has been matched.  However, you are halfway
    across the country, or even world, from each other.  How can
    you exchange goods or services safely and honestly?  Many
    people lose out by staying away from such markets entirely.
    For the vast majority of users, however, transactions in the
    Usenet Marketplace are successful, as long as you take
    reasonable precautions.  In the rest of this Subject, we'll
    present some suggestions which have worked well for thousands
    of satisfied users across the globe.

  Before you consider shipping arrangements, it is extremely
    important that both sides understand the details of the sale.
    The number one problem in Usenet Marketplace transactions is
    not fraud--which is negligible--but miscommunication.  Make
    absolutely certain that both you and the other party
    understand exactly what is being sold and how the exchange
    will take place.  Also, make sure you have the other party's
    correct street address, e-mail address, and a current
    telephone number before you ever send anything.  Some
    experienced buyers even make it a policy to call the phone
    number to confirm its existence for added safety, although
    this isn't necessary in most cases.  Also, we strongly urge
    you to get a current street address, even if it isn't the
    shipping address.  In the exceedingly unlikely event that you
    need to file a lawsuit, this will save a lot of hassle later.

  Above all, ask questions now, _before_ the sale takes place!
    The more clear you are on details beforehand, the happier
    both parties will be afterwards.  If you're not satisfied
    with the answers to your questions, then ask more questions,
    or back out.  If you think the person on the other end of the
    line may cheat you, then don't give him the opportunity.

  Make sure that both sides understand:
      The goods or services being exchanged
      Implied warranties and return conditions
      Shipping arrangements, especially _when_
    If you have a problem later, it will be much easier to
    resolve if you have this information documented.  Be sure you
    save all e-mail and written correspondence.

  When it comes to exchanging money for an item, the following
    methods work best:

    Small to medium transactions within country boundaries:
    Shipping COD (collect on delivery)
	Almost a standard on the Usenet Marketplace for such
	transactions, shipping COD is one of the safer routes for
	transactions which don't merit the intervention of a
	third party escrow service.  FedEx, UPS, US SnailMail,
	and many other countries' postal carriers offer this
	option for a very small fee.  The seller ships the item
	COD to the buyer, who pays the courier on arrival with
	cash, check, or	money order.  The courier then forwards
	the payment to the seller.  The small fee is well worth
	the security of having the courier act as an
	intermediate--the buyer	can't receive the package until
	he pays, and the seller	isn't paid until the buyer
	receives the package.  This method is not foolproof, as
	the buyer generally cannot check the package to make sure
	the correct item was sent.  We recommend that the buyer
	pay by check or cashier's check so she can stop payment
	if necessary.  An important note, COD is not available
	for international transactions.

    Small transactions, and small international sales:
    Payment by check or money order
	For small items, fast delivery, or if both parties trust
	each other, payment by check can be a good method.
	Either the buyer sends a check first, seller sends the
	goods first, or both agree to send at the same time.
	Buyer sending a check first is the most common.
	Sometimes, the seller may wait a short time to make sure
	the check clears.  If you use this method, make sure both
	parties understand when the goods will be shipped, and
	above all, do _not_ send cash.  A cancelled check makes
	a good proof-of-payment if the seller doesn't deliver.
	An important note--for interstate transactions, goods
	must be shipped within 30 days of receipt of payment,
	unless specifically stated otherwise, according to
	federal law.  If a shipment will be delayed, buyer has
	the right to cancel his order, and receive a refund. 
	Most states have similar laws.

    Medium to large transactions, and international sales:
    Third-party escrow services
	For more expensive items, additional precautions are
	prescribed.  One good suggestion is escrow.  In this
	case, a third, trustworthy party acts as an intermediary.
	The intermediary receives both the buyer's check and the
	seller's merchandise.  Once the intermediary has both, he
	forwards the goods to the buyer, who then has a short
	trial period (typically 2 days) to make sure the item is
	as-described.  Then, the intermediary forwards the
	payment to the seller.  Sometimes, the intermediary may
	only receive the check to save on shipping costs, and
	some intermediaries accept credit cards--especially
	helpful for international trades.  Many	lawyers offer
	this service, as do the following commercial enterprises:

	American Computer Exchange, 800-786-0717  (USA)
	  5-8% commission, min. $50
	Boston Computer Exchange, 800-262-6399  (USA)
	  Flat fee
	Computer Classified Exchange Service, 216-481-2563  (USA)
	  $20 flat fee up to $1000 transactions
	  Welcomes international sales
	  <mailto:classexch@aol.com>  Subject: Seller Info
	GuaranTrade, 913-841-4483  (USA)
	  5% commission, min. $5, rate declines above $1500
	  <mailto:trade@gtrade.com>  Subject: info
	NETtrade, (919) 682-7715  (Durham, NC, USA)
	  $5 for transactions up to $100, $10 up to $1000, $20 > $1000
	  <mailto:NETtrade@mzdc.pdial.interpath.net>
	TradeSafe Online Corporation, (800) 994-6362
	  $15 for transactions up to $300, 1-5% thereafter
	  <http://www.brainiac.com/tradesafe>
	  <mailto:TradeSafe@aol.com>
	United Computer Exchange
	  [no information available]

	[No implication is made as to the integrity of any
	company at this time.]

    Transactions in the biz.marketplace groups:
    Pay by credit card
	This option is only available when dealing with
	commercial vendors or certain escrow companies, but it is
	strongly recommended if available.  This is the safest
	means for the buyer, as you can appeal to the credit card
	company if the other party defaults.

  We suggest adhering to these methods, as they are the most
    proven and the safest for both parties.  Some readers have
    suggested that the buyer send half-payment before receiving
    the goods, then half after.  This method is strongly
    discouraged, as the cancelled check for the first payment may
    be enough to convince a judge that the buyer paid in full--
    introducing unnecessary risk to the seller.

  When problems do occur, please remember that the primary cause
    is miscommunication.  Over the last few years, the incidence
    of fraud has been limited to roughly once a month.  When you
    consider that several hundred ads are posted every day, true
    fraud is negligible.  Much more significant are the
    misunderstandings and unneeded delays by people slow to
    follow through.  To help take care of this, and to protect
    yourself in the very unlikely event of fraud, be sure to
    take these additional precautions:

	Keep records of your e-mail, checks, proof-of-mailing
	Insure packages adequately
	Make sure both of you are ABSOLUTELY clear on the
	    items and arrangements
	Exchange and double-check addresses and phone numbers

    In the case of expensive items, you may wish to make a
    notarized bill of sale.  ejbarr@epix.net has provided a
    sample bill of sale for free distribution on the Usenet
    Marketplace.  If you would like a copy, please send mail to
    Dan King, <mailto:king@holli.com>.

  If something does go wrong, the best place to start is to
    contact the other party--via e-mail or telephone.  Again, the 
    #1 source of problems is miscommunication.  If this doesn't
    work, contact the other person's system administrator by
    sending e-mail with an explanation of the situation to
    <mailto:postmaster@[systemname]>.  Often times the threat
    of losing net access is enough to help the process along--but
    please do this _only_ when discussions fall through.

  DISCLAIMER:
    While rare, occasionally fraud does occur on the Internet.
    It is ultimately the buyer and/or seller who must take
    precautions to ensure fair treatment.  Presented here are
    merely suggestions of means of transaction which worked for
    others.  There is no guarantee that they will work for you.

------------------------------

Subject: 11.  Additional international considerations.

  Despite the large number of USA-specific advertisements which
    appear, the Usenet Marketplace is truly a global institution.
    As a result, all advertisers, even individuals, should be
    prepared to deal with international issues should the need
    arise.  Many successful transactions occur across country
    boundaries.  However, a few additional considerations must be
    taken into account before conducting business with other
    nations.

  For one thing, COD is generally not allowed for international
    shipments.  Along the same lines, some shippers like UPS or
    US Mail may cause the buyer to incur additional fees on
    receipt of packages.  These may involve import taxes, or just
    a delivery arrangement if the shipper doesn't operate in a
    country directly.  Make certain you know how your country's
    courier/postal services handle such shipments.

  Another, extremely important consideration involves technology.
    It is illegal to send many kinds of advanced equipment from
    the United States to certain countries, and likewise across
    other international borders.  Advanced technology is more
    encompassing than just weaponry--things as simple as software
    or personal computers may face export restrictions punishable
    by jail time in many countries.

  Because of the complexity, and sometimes absurdity, of these
    laws, and because of the documentation required for all
    international packages, all readers who wish to deal
    internationally should speak with a company experienced in
    such matters.  Any local packaging and mailing service should 
    be able to refer you to an appropriate company, or you can
    contact one of the following international freight
    forwarders:

	Overseas Alliance Group  914-472-3204  (USA)
	  International equipment freight forwarding
	  <mailto:jc88@delphi.com>

    Questions you need to ask:
	Is it legal to ship this item to country X?
	What import/export/value-added taxes must be paid?
	What is the best way to ship, and how much will it cost?
	What documentation is required?
	How can international shipments be insured?

------------------------------

Subject: 12.  Glossary of terms.

  Given that a large number of Usenet Marketplace readers are on
    the newsgroups for the first time, here is a short list of
    terms commonly seen in the misc.forsale and biz.marketplace
    groups:

  CD-ROM -- Compact Disc Read Only Memory, a method that allows
	   ~650MB of storage on a standard compact disc, writable
	   only at the factory
  COD -- Collect On Delivery, a service where the shipping
	   company collects money for a parcel from the recipient
  DOA,WOA -- Dead/Working On Arrival, used to express warranties
  EIDE -- Enhanced IDE, the successor to the IDE hard drive
	   interface, allowing for CD-ROM drives and >500MB hard
	   drives
  ESDI -- Enhanced Small Device Interface, an older
	   high-performance hard drive interface for PCs
  FAQ -- Frequently Asked Questions, in computer parlance an
	   article which answers many; this article
  FD -- Floppy Drive, for 3.5", 5.25" or 8" floppy disks
  FS -- For Sale
  HD -- Hard Drive, the computer permanent storage component;
	   Note that physical capacity and usable capacity may
	   be different for a given drive
  IDE -- Integrated Drive Electronics, the standard hard drive
	   interface for PCs sold today.
  IMHO -- Net abbreviation for "In my humble opinion..."
  MB -- Motherboard, the backbone of most computers on which the
	   CPU and other support resides
  xxxMB -- Megabyte, a unit of memory/storage as in a 500MB hard
	   drive; in common language 1MB = 1000 kilobytes
  meg -- Abbreviation for 'megabytes', the unit of memory/storage
  MFM -- Modified Frequency Modulation; a physical method of
	   storing data on a hard drive; the original IBM PC
	   standard for hard drive interfaces--not compatible
	   with most recent systems
  MO Drive -- Magneto-Optical Drive, a hard storage device
	   similar to a rewritable CD-ROM
  OBO -- Or Best Offer; the price is negotiable
  OEM -- Original Equipment Manufacture; describes parts intended
	   to be used to make original equipment, not as spares
  RAM -- Random Access Memory; The main operating memory for most
	   computers
  RLL -- Run Length Limited; a method of encoding data on hard
	   drives; often describes the successor to MFM
  SCSI -- Small Computer Standard Interface, for hard drives,
	   CD-ROM drives, floppy drives, ...
  SIMM -- Single In-line Memory Module, one type of RAM which
	   comes in 72 and 30 pin varieties for different
	   computers; the standard for most computers
	   manufactured in the last several years
  SIPP -- Single In-line Pinned Package, a type of RAM which
	   comes in 30 pin varieties; can be converted to SIMM
	   with the appropriate adapters
  WORM -- Write Once Read Many, a method of hard storage that can
	   only be saved to once, but can be accessed often
  WTB -- Wanted To Buy
  ;-) -- The Universal Internet Smiley; used to indicate a joke,
	   sarcasm, or any instance where you don't really mean it.

	       -*-*-*-*-End transactions FAQ-*-*-*-*-

  The Usenet Marketplace FAQs are posted every 5 days to all
    misc.forsale and biz.marketplace groups, as well as to
    <news:news.answers> and <news:misc.answers>. 
  These FAQs and hundreds of other Usenet FAQs can be anonymously
    FTPed from:
    <ftp://rtfm.mit.edu/pub/usenet/misc.forsale.non-computer>
    or read through the World Wide Web at:
    <http://www.cis.ohio-state.edu/hypertext/faq/usenet/FAQ-List.html>