🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <BstxFE.C88@apollo.hp.com> goykhman_a@apollo.hp.com (Alex Goykhman) writes:
>In article <1992Aug11.145521.29060@mcshub.dcss.mcmaster.ca> bunker@physun.physics.mcmaster.ca (Alex Bunker) writes:
>...
>>World govenrment is closer at hand now than in the 60's and yes I will
>>not hide it Frank can speak for himself but I will stand proud and say
>>I AM IN FAVOR OF WORLD GOVERNMENT AND I REFUSE TO FEEL ANY ALLEGENCE TO
>>ANY SUBUNIT OF THE WHOLE COMMONLY KNOWN AS A COUNTRY!!!!
>
>    Do you realize that if the New World Order takes hold,
>    there will be no place to hide?

   This is correct.   The single biggest problem with one world
   government is that if you don't happen to agree with it or
   like it you're still stuck with it.  Note that this is a 
   problem even if it's not some sort of totalitarian police
   state.   And what if is IS some sort of totalitarian police
   state?

   
---peter

goykhman_a@apollo.hp.com  writes:

> In article <1992Aug11.145521.29060@mcshub.dcss.mcmaster.ca> bunker@physun.physics.mcmaster.ca (Alex Bunker) writes:
> ...
> >World govenrment is closer at hand now than in the 60's and yes I will
> >not hide it Frank can speak for himself but I will stand proud and say
> >I AM IN FAVOR OF WORLD GOVERNMENT AND I REFUSE TO FEEL ANY ALLEGENCE TO
> >ANY SUBUNIT OF THE WHOLE COMMONLY KNOWN AS A COUNTRY!!!!
> 
>     Do you realize that if the New World Order takes hold,
>     there will be no place to hide?

Why would you have to hide?  Are you breaking any laws or something
     that would make you want to hide?


> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Disclaimer: all opinions are mine.
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Stephen @Trajan

trajan@cwis.unomaha.edu (Stephen McIntyre) writes:

>goykhman_a@apollo.hp.com  writes:

>> In article <1992Aug11.145521.29060@mcshub.dcss.mcmaster.ca> bunker@physun.physics.mcmaster.ca (Alex Bunker) writes:
>> ...
>> >World govenrment is closer at hand now than in the 60's and yes I will
>> >not hide it Frank can speak for himself but I will stand proud and say
>> >I AM IN FAVOR OF WORLD GOVERNMENT AND I REFUSE TO FEEL ANY ALLEGENCE TO
>> >ANY SUBUNIT OF THE WHOLE COMMONLY KNOWN AS A COUNTRY!!!!
>> 
>>     Do you realize that if the New World Order takes hold,
>>     there will be no place to hide?

>Why would you have to hide?  Are you breaking any laws or something
>     that would make you want to hide?

Maybe because you disagree with government policies on taxes, civil
liberties, etc....right now, if I dislike the laws enough, I have to option
of going somewhere else...

 -Steve
--
 The opinions expressed above are those of the author and not SPSS, Inc.
                        -------------------
     adams@spss.com                           Phone: (312) 329-3522
     Steve Adams                              Fax:   (312) 329-3558

trajan@cwis.unomaha.edu (Stephen McIntyre) writes:
>goykhman_a@apollo.hp.com  writes:
>> 
>>     Do you realize that if the New World Order takes hold,
>>     there will be no place to hide?
>
>Why would you have to hide?  Are you breaking any laws or something
>     that would make you want to hide?
>

  I hope your just trying to be funny, right?

 Jews in 1940 Germany were breaking laws by not turning themselves in for
 the ovens. Instead they went into hiding or ran.

  Get the point?

---
  "Freedom is irrelevant, self determination is irrelevant. You must comply!"

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<*LIVE FREE OR DIE*>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Steve Matson (The original Rocky Mountain nationalist)         **COLORADO**

In article <1992Aug12.001838.14325@news.unomaha.edu> trajan@cwis.unomaha.edu (Stephen McIntyre) writes:
>goykhman_a@apollo.hp.com  writes:
>> In article <1992Aug11.145521.29060@mcshub.dcss.mcmaster.ca> bunker@physun.physics.mcmaster.ca (Alex Bunker) writes:
>>     Do you realize that if the New World Order takes hold,
>>     there will be no place to hide?
>
>Why would you have to hide?  Are you breaking any laws or something
>     that would make you want to hide?

I hope that is meant to be sarcastic.  One of the reasons small oppresive
governments like that of Eastern Germany, Czecheslovokia, Poland and
the USSR fell is because there was an example of a prosperous, happy,
and *freer* society right next door.

China may well be too big to fall, simply because no nation would open
its borders sufficiently wide with respect to China to absorb its
dissatisfied citizens.  Those citizens which escaped communist Eastern
Europe during the Cold War often kept in touch with those they left behind,
telling them the truth about conditions outside Soviet Tyranny.

Another argument against the World Government:

 1)  The US has never had a serious challenge to its sovereignity, so
we really don't have personal experience with how it feels.  Think of
how Mexico felt about the US kidnapping its citizens to try them in the
US.

2)  Even if started with the best of intentions, the World Government
could easily become oppresive, especially as there is no suitable
entity to act as a check against it.

3)  What government form will you choose?  That form is intricitly tied
to national and cultural identity.  Some states/nations/religions/cultures
believe authority comes from the Mandate of Heaven and so have a very
different notion of the "loyal opposition", and legitimate challenge to
authority from US.

4)  The World Gov't could easily violate either our Bill of Rights, or
other Nations Bills simply by declaring its own version to be of a
higher priority.  For a long despairing chuckle, read the complete
 
list of Human Rights supposedly guaranteed by the UN charter.  Lets see,
right to a vacation with pay, right to a 'decent' standard of living,

>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Stephen @Trajan


-- 
Michael Sandy
michaels@m2xenix.psg.com
"Going to teach someone a lesson" is a very interesting English phrase.
It obliterates the altruistic connotation of 'teaching'.

In article <1992Aug12.001838.14325@news.unomaha.edu> trajan@cwis.unomaha.edu (Stephen McIntyre) writes:
>goykhman_a@apollo.hp.com  writes:
>
>>     Do you realize that if the New World Order takes hold,
>>     there will be no place to hide?
>
>Why would you have to hide?  Are you breaking any laws or something
>     that would make you want to hide?

That's a singularly stupid statement. If you were living in a country
that decided to exterminate jews, would you happily obey the law?
Suppose you were a jew. Stupid, dangerous, and vicious laws have been 
passed throughout history by dictatorships *and* by democracies. Mob rule 
is one of the most dangerous kinds of rule, look at the French revolution,
or early Soviet Union for examples of what happens when the will of the 
majority is unchecked. Or look at the US where the majority (white)
considered it proper to enslave a minority (black) and passed *laws*
enforcing that condition. Would you obey the law and return a runaway
slave to his rightful owner? Would you do it knowing he would be whipped
to within an inch of his life, or perhaps actually killed? A place to
hide is sometimes vital when the howling mob decides to impose their
*majority* will on some hapless minority.

Our founding fathers partially saw this danger called democracy. That's
why the US is not a democracy. It's a constitutional republic with some
democratic elements. The system of checks and balances on majority whim
is an attempt to mitigate the horrors of the mob. It's fallible because
it's operated by fallible men, but it's better than any purely democratic
alternative in protecting the rights of individuals.

Gary