🚀 go-pugleaf

Love-Hounds Digest			    Tuesday, February 11, 1986, 11:57

Today's Topics:

		     JR/KB/TMC/CT/DCD/TR/RS/and BS
			  Rolling Stone FLAMES
		       slag on rolling stone ...
	    Sonic Youth, Keith Haring and other neat people
			    Re: Holly Sh*t!
		    Re: Love-Hounds digest, 1/27/86

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Date: Mon, 27 Jan 86 08:35:43 est
From: Tim Wicinski <wicinski@nrl-css.ARPA>
Subject: JR/KB/TMC/CT/DCD/TR/RS/and BS


news from flem city:  just finished getting over a dragging flu that 
left me tired and weak.  also with a big list of things I need to get done.

Why does anybody still buy Rolling Stone ?? I haven't since high
school.  I thought everybody stopped reading this piece of sh*t. They
called all the previous replacemnets albums (prior to 'Tim') really bad
music, with bad sound quality to boot.  I guess you need a big label in
order to sound good ??  But why put down JR sue ?? It's completely okay
for an artist to be compared to Jonathan Richman, and some people
probably consider it a complement.  In case you don't know, Jonathan
Richman first started out in the boston area ages ago (pre -1976 !)
with a band called The Modern Lovers whose early members contained Dave
Robinson (now of that super group the Cars), and Jerry Harrison (now of
course, with the Talking Heads), and someone who now plays with Robyn
Lane and the Chartbusters.  Most of his stuff is now out of print, but
you can still dig some of his early stuff if you look hard enough.  I
recommend the original album, 'The Modern Lovers'.  I do admit the
other statement the record reviewer said is pretty stupid.  I would
suggest Creem over most magazines mainly because they stupid, but at
least they know it.  They also were the first I remember to point out
that Black Flag is going to turn into another Hawkwind (which they
pretty much have) as they grow older.  Can you believe Creem magazine
mentioning Hawkwind ??

I keep listening to the Cocteau Twins and This Mortal Coil, yet I am
unmotivated by them completely.  Not sure why.  I enjoy Magazine
though, and I have bought three albums (Play, Second Hand Daylight, and
Magic Murder, and the Weather) for less than 4.00 each.  I suggest some
hard looking in the cut out bins.   Also just finished up a sharp
letter to my senator, lame duck Charles Mathais, and puppet to the
record industry.  I urge the same from everyone else.

Sorry, Doug I will not be able to attend the Residents festivities.
Maybe I'll go down and hang out outside and listen.  But at 15.00, It's
just too much money for me.  I haven't even been able to buy a record
all month !! This is getting bad. I guess I'll just have to settle for
a tape of it.

tim


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Date: Mon, 27 Jan 86 08:58:31 est
From: hound!hejira
Subject: Rolling Stone FLAMES


Rolling Stone Magazine is a RAG.  It's pure trash.  It's been that way for 
ten years now (ever since they voted JM's _Hissing_of_Summer_Lawns "worst
album of the year").  The people there have no taste.  

So, don't be surprised that the trashy rag vilified KB's HoL  ..  look at 
what they said about Olivia Newton John's and Diana Ross' newest abortions
in the very same issue (something along the lines of "they're terrific, 
modern and up-to-date").  

Trash, trash, trash, trash and double that!!!

... and so why do I read the filth???

	Rob Preston	<ihnp4!hound!hejira>



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Date:     Mon, 27 Jan 86 11:16:42 EST
From: Jim Hofmann - RAMD-D <hofmann@AMSAA.ARPA>
Subject:  slag on rolling stone ...

So - since everyone else is ...

the last rolling stone I bought was the one with the issue on health clubs
becoming the single bars of the 80's ... it was then I realized the true
irrelevancy of this rag to music.  Incidentally, the offending cover story
became the quasi-subject of the movie "perfect" starring disco-John and
lunatic-victim Jamie ...

Rolling Stone is a good metaphor of the institutionaliztion and acceptance
into the mainstream of rock music (which one could argue was initially
totally oposed to this...)

Ah well, I suggest looking to the independent press like Jet Lag out of
St Louis and Flipside out of Orange County as well as the Penthouse
rag - SPiN (with a terrifying story on Nina Hagen this month) ...

For a real treat, find a library that archives Rolling Stone and read
he old issues where the Grateful Dead's latest bust was the usual cover ...

Tim left a copy he had found on the bus of Rolling Stone's year in review
(which undoubtably Greg Searles would LOVE) wherein RS states, "1985 was
a good year for rock" and then went into the reasons - Don Johnson, Sly
Stallone ... hmmmm.  At best, this is a slightly more sophisticated
and less ecletic National Enquirer ... I guess next year their reason
for a good year in rock will be Mark "Coors" Harmon and Ally Sheedy ...
duh!

hofmann

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Date: Mon, 27 Jan 86 14:20:52 EST
From: hsut@purdue-ecn.ARPA (Bill Hsu)
Subject: Sonic Youth, Keith Haring and other neat people



Found this neat-looking compilation album last week called A Diamond Hidden
in the Mouth of a Corpse, put out by Giorno Poetry Systems, poet John
Giorno's label (I guess). If you ever wondered if the National Endowment
for the Arts ever finances anything interesting, here it is...

This looked like a really interesting album, with a bunch of Keith Haring
sketches (he's the guy who draws the stick figures in NY subways) on the
cover, and in the background of the photos of the bands. The actual
music on the album was a little disappointing, despite some nice tracks
(maybe I was expecting too much). Sonic Youth had an ok song (inferior
to most tracks from Bad Moon Rising), and there were contributions from
Husker Du, David Johannsen and Coil. I enjoyed the Cabaret Voltaire track
(my first exposure to CV). The spoken pieces by William Burroughs and
Michael Gira were amusing but hardly earthshaking.

If anyone else picked up this album, could you identify some of the photos?
I recognized Husker Du, David Johannsen and Sonic Youth, and William
Burroughs (I think...) but which one is Coil?... Cabaret Voltaire?...

Bill Hsu

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Posted-Date: 27 Jan 86 08:30:51 EST (Mon)
Subject: Re: Holly sh*t!
Date: 27 Jan 86 08:30:51 EST (Mon)
From: J Eric Roskos <ll-xn!topaz!peora!jer>
X-From: J Eric Roskos <jer@peora.UUCP>

> > 1) In "All the Love," you expressed a feeling of fear and
> > vulnerability ... [and subsequently changed to a more popular style]
> > ... Do you have any regrets at doing this?
>
> I doubt that this had much to do with it since the British music press
> *hates* concept albums.  And HoL is certainly still quite weird.

But the approach she used would be a good compromise; the British Press
would say what they did say about it, viz., that the first side was OK, but
the back side was sort of strange (although, naturally, since people bought
many copies of the album, they would append "but in a nice way" to it.

Also, I don't perceive the Ninth Wave as being particularly "wierd".

I detect a subtle change in your philosophies in the following comments.

> I am
> going to ask her about her purpose in making the first three songs on
> the album more commercial than anything on "The Dreaming", but I was
> going to put it in a way much more palatable to me, and hopefully to
> Kate too.

Asking questions that attempt to get to the basis of issues can't always
be done in a "palatable" way, if the person you are questioning is
accustomed to evading the answers.  On the other hand, as I said in the
original posting, I doubt I would have asked such questions myself.

> Believe me, Kate is not one to be a feminist protester.  If she felt so
> strongly about the objectification of women, she would probably not lean
> towards eroticism so much.

This line of reasoning is indeed often used by feminist protesters, i.e.,
that "eroticism" is equivalent to "the objectification of women," but of
course in reality this is not true; it depends on whether what you have
written is itself objectified, or whether it is a sort of purely conceptual
framework which is applied by the listener to specific people, rather than
to "women in general".  Some of the better love songs are examples of this.

> Also she has said that she thinks women have the better end of the deal.

This is why it takes true resolve to be a non-hypocritical feminist, since
women *do* "have the better end of the deal," and are merely striving
either to achieve equity (in the process sacrificing some good things for
other, more just, ones), or else "want it all now".

> Because at the end of "Hello Earth", Kate has been rescued and the storm
> is over, and she can finally go to sleep.

This is an interesting idea.  It suggests that the person speaking in
"Hello Earth" is not merely an observer, but rather an active entity, if
there is any causal relation between her being rescued and the German
sentence just before she says "Go to sleep, little earth." For some
reason, this causality seems to be suggested by the short amount of time
between these two sentences, perhaps because a longer wait would have
suggested a sort of futility, that the observer could say "help her" but
it wouldn't accomplish anything.  This idea of an active, helping entity
goes well with the line "I was there at the birth," I think.

> > 4) Does the "old lady" in "Jig of Life" represent the folding-of-time
> > perceived by a woman who looks in the mirror and suddenly sees a face
> > reminiscent of her mother's when she was born?
>
> She's already said that it means just what I said it means.  If you
> asked her this, she'd say "That's a really nice interpretation, but what
> I really had in mind is [insert my interpretation here]."

But that was what she said about the interpretations you did ask her
about, which you are fairly certain were correct interpretations she just
didn't want to acknowledge.

> > 5) Is this folding-of-time represented again by the "you asleep on the
> > seat" in "Hello, Earth"?  Or who is this "you"?
>
> I think "you" is Del Palmer.  But I could be wrong.

I have doubts about this, unless "on the seat" is a British colloquialism.
The phrase suggests a small person or animal, much smaller than the seat,
such that they are "on" it, like on a table.

> > 6) In the phrase "Help this blackbird," there seems to be this
> > parallel sound-meaning: "Help this black bard."  Yes?
>
> No.

Well, it would certainly fit well with what you had claimed the poem was
about, viz., about people accusing her of having evil intentions in some of
her poems, about her "singing like a witch," etc.

What other interpretations might be associated with a "blackbird"?

> > 7) What does the reference to Ireland in "The Big Sky" mean?
>
> She likes Ireland.

This sounds like an answer she would give, to avoid giving the real answer.

> > 8) In "Suspended in Gaffa," you seem to suggest the idea that by
> > choosing the path of an entertainer, you have bound yourself
> > against progress to a higher level of enlightenment; that your
> > spiritual progress is "suspended in Gaffa."
>
> That's not what she's saying.  She's saying that in the quest for
> perfection, it always feels like you're "suspended in Gaffa".

Why "Gaffa"?

> > Yet the conclusion of "The Ninth Wave" is quite opposite this idea.
> > Does this reflect a change in your ideologies in the past few years?
>
> You'd really have to argue pretty ****** well to convince me that the
> allegory in "The Ninth Wave" has any specific meaning, raher than just
> being a colage of impressions from traumas in life.

Unfortunately, I have forgotten what I had in mind when I wrote the above,
since it was so long ago ... oh, I do remember, too... at the end she says
"you know what? I love you better now," which suggests that she has grown
in some sense as a result of the traumatic experiences.

I don't think of "The Ninth Wave" as an allegory.  I am not very fond of
allegories.  I think "The Ninth Wave" symbolizes personal growth through
adversity.

> > 9) Don't give up!  "The Dreaming" was great, and you shouldn't let the
> > critics mislead you.  You can have your immortality now or later.
>
> [Better now.]

No, it's better later... now always runs out.


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Return-Path: <earle@gorbag>
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 86 00:49:29 pst
From: ia-sun2!smeagol!gorbag!earle@csvax.caltech.edu (Greg Earle)
Subject: Re: Love-Hounds digest, 1/27/86


Re: SPIN radio show

Just from the name "Nocturnal Emissions", you can tell it's gonna be 
interesting ... Sure hofmann isn't the DJ? :@)

BTW, in 1984 the debut Dead Can Dance LP was probably *My Favorite* LP
of the year; you can take that with however many grains of NaCl and a twist
a lemon...

Errm, about the SPIN radio show.  It is hosted by a thing that goes by the
moniker of Andrea 'Enthal; if you met her you'd know that the 'Enthal must
certainly be a diminutive of Rosenthal (why hide your heritage?).  Though
you'd never guess in a million years from the stuff she plays, in person
she is this 200 lb. + behemoth, who wears ankle-length tie-dyed dresses by
Omar the Tentmaker (straight out of Haight-Ashbury, I swear!), and my best
guess is that she baths as frequently as there are heavy rainstorms out here
in L.A.   Oh well, enough mud-slinging...  She has hosted a show on KPFK
in L.A. for the last 5 years (12am - 6am Sat. nights, 90.7 FM for you visitors)
called "12 O'Clock Rock" (Hrmpf, musta meditated on L for a while to get that).
The one thing that I respect her for, is that of all the people who attempt
to assert their opinions/authority over people (musically speaking), at least
she goes out and *buys* all of her own records, and she buys *EVERYTHING*.
Which means that the Hit/Miss ratio is brought down proportionally, but at
least there is something for everyone, and nobody in this city can touch her
show for range of stuff (Because she's the only one wacko enough to spend every
last dime on musical recordings).  I may not agree with her opinions, but at
least she has the necessary credentials for me to at least *respect* them.
Her major problem is that sometimes she succumbs to gloating and preaching
(as in "well, I think that so-and-so sucks donkey dicks etc.", and last week
she played a tape of Jesus and Mary Chain live at the Roxy LA 12/22/85, then
afterwards gloated "this tape is in a recording studio, and *I* know where that
studio is ....", later, "Well, I'm just gonna haveta spend a lot of time mixing
down this live JAMC stuff from that tape for the SPIN magazine compilation *I*
am putting out"; Gawd, I swear I wanted to reach through the radio and hit her)
So to make a long story short - listen, but with a jaundiced ear ...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

>Subject: Re: John Fox and Garry Numan
                     ^       ^^
Hmmm, do we call this "Double letter Dyslexia" :@)

Love-Hounds Trivia Test Number 1:
(1) [Easy] Gimme John Foxx' real name.
(2) [Not so] Name the band that was the precursor to Ultravox! Mk. I
(3) [Massively Difficult] Name the title of the record by said band.
If I see any quotes from the book "Volume", you LOSE BIG.

	Greg Earle
	sdcrdcf!smeagol!earle (UUCP)
	ia-sun2!smeagol!earle@csvax.caltech.edu (ARPA)

Sorry, no Know Your Culture this time 
(see my last net.musack posting for latest one)

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-- 
It's like a jungle sometimes, it makes me wonder how I keep from goin' under.

Greg Skinner (gregbo)
{decvax!genrad, allegra, gatech, ihnp4}!mit-eddie!gds
gds@eddie.mit.edu