🚀 go-pugleaf

Love-Hounds Digest			Issue L6

Topics:

 * continuation / HoL vs TD
 * Fripertronics (2 articles)
 * Big Country, Ministry, Test Dept., etc.
 * Zaine Griff
 * Smiles all around.
 * convoy
 * babble babble, babble
 * Roger Miller (2 articles)

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Date: 27 Jun 86 12:50:00 PST
From: "ROSSI J.A." <rossi@nusc.ARPA>
Subject: continuation / HoL vs TD
Reply-To: "ROSSI J.A." <rossi@nusc.ARPA>

...... I don't believe that quality is necessarily a prerequisite for
becomming classical.  Many of the non-famous contemporaries of the
classics probably were doing music as good or better than there
long-lived brothers.  In many instances, it seems, being different and
setting a trend is a method by which classical success was achieved.
In other instances (Listz for example) it was a combination of
attitudinal excitement and catchy tunes.  Personally, I find much
classical music boring, however, there are pieces I like.
Unfortunately, we have no way of knowing if there was 17, 18 or 19 th
century music which we would prefer to 'the classics'.

Now, to extend this into the music world of the last 25 or so years.
I believe that The Beatles will be remembered and ther music
considered 'Classical' in the 21,22, and 23 centuries (if there are
any).  Notice, I also must say that I don't particularly like the
Beatles (I admit they have had their moments).  There influence on the
state of contemporary music was astounding, but probably
over-publicized and not to correct.  Yes, all people when cornered
usually stickthem into their lists of great influences (Kate may have
liked them but I don't see the great musical influence showing in her
work, besides she's just a kid).

Twenty years ago, if this was the Beatles Digest, I think I would come
across similarly to the viewpoints of Hofmann and Wicinski in pushing
alternative musical talent.  In many ways, I don't think that digest
would be composed of people like those who make up Love-Hounds.
Remember, Love Me Do and I Want to Hold Your Hand etc were not great
musical triumphs.  Christ, Harrison couldn't even do anything but
strum back then.  Brian Epstein is to that era as Hulk Hogan is to
today.  The Beatles were probably the most hyped musical act to hit
the American music scene in the 60's.  True, their progression from
Meet the Beatles to the White Album was remarkable, but no more
remarkable than the progression of any other competent musical acts
which were their contemporaries.  I believe that the Beatles will be
the classically remembered group from the period, but, only because of
the early hype and the generation explosion of the 60s period.  For
every milestone in the Beatles recording carreer, it is possible to
cite equally importan, if not more important recordings by other
(almost made its) most notably The Who and The Kinks.  and the
Animals.  Most people found it strange that I prefered You Really Got
Me to Help, I can See for Miles to Strawberry Fields, and House of the
Rising Sun to any social statement made by the Beatles.  So in the
year 2176, people will probably revere George, Paul Johhn and Ringo as
we do those we consider classical composers.  (A subtle difference may
exist, however, in that more information will be stored from this
period due to the technological advvannces than we have record of for
the classical era.

Now to the heart of the matter.  I do not believe that Kate stands a
chance in a quadrillion of being remembered for her contributions to
the 70/80 period anything like the Beatles were for their period.
That is to say, I doubt Kate Bush will ever achieve classical status.
In fact, it is probably true that Madonna will be more revered by the
masses who secumb to what is pushed at them as classical.  Look at it
this way, we don't have a choice as to who we are going to revere from
the past centuries, the classics have already been picked for us.
Snobbery will probably always be a virtue of the human species and it
will be thhe snobbbish aristocrats who will define what is classical
from our lifetime period.  The fact that Kate Bush is not a household
word, I believe, works strongly in her disfavor in achieving enough
memorable clout to sway the aristocrats of the 22nd century.

Concerning the ensuing battle of HoL and TD, my opinion is that I much
prefer TD because I appreciate its daring.  HoL is in a musical (as
defined by whethwewr my wife can tollerate it) sense, more appealing.
Hence, HoL gets a hell of a lot more airplay (including MTV), has real
hits, and can be listened to by people subject to borderline
schizophrenia.  The catch, HoL is more commercial.  I believe that TD
will soon appear in cut-out bins.  Annd willl be the first of Kate's
albums to go 'Out of Print' (this is again a sad commentary on our
times).

--This space would have been occupied with a Paul Simon
  philosophical expression, however, Doug took the words
  right out of my VT220--

John

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Date: 27 Jun 86 13:00:00 PST
From: "ROSSI J.A." <rossi@nusc.ARPA>
Subject: Fripertronics
Reply-To: "ROSSI J.A." <rossi@nusc.ARPA>

In answer to the response by Bill Hsu, I take exception and still feel
that the technique should be called Enotronics since the earliest
ambient stuff came first, and, I believe, he introduced the timed
delay loop technique to Fripp.  But, since Eno hasn't quarreled with
the label I guess we are stuck with Frippertronics.  Just trying to
give credit where credit is due.  The pedalboard (which does make up a
portion of the whole Frippertronics thing) is an idea, which I believe
was conceived solely by Fripp.  Six of one, half dozen of the other.
Also, No Pussyfooting (Fripp and Eno) is the better of the two LPs.

John

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Return-Path: EMAILDEV%UKACRL.BITNET@WISCVM.ARPA
Via:      UK.AC.SUSX.VAX2; 27 JUN 86 15:34:15 BST
Date:     27-JUN-1986 15:24:49
From: SSUD3%UK.AC.SUSSEX.VAX2@AC.UK

OK, I'm going off 'round Europe for a bit, so you won't have
to worry about much more KT trivia postings anymore.

However, as a parting shot, here's some stuff from the latest
Record Mirror:

(The "Big Country" interview  they're on the cover):

"....and the title track features a duet with Kate Bush.
Stuart says he's been a Kate fan for a long time.

`The Central character of the song "The Seer" is a woman, so I though
(thought) it would be good to get a woman's vocal point of view.
I have a lot of Kate Bush albums, and I like her voice. She varies it
so much. There's a lot of variety and texture in the way she sings,
and she's always coming up with something different.
She's a perfectionist; she won't give up until she's absolutely satisfied
with what she's done. She has a lot of dedication.'  "

  -Stuart Adamson


Also, Alan Jones in "Chartfile" further amends his claim of Kate being only
one of four women to take more than 3 hits off an album - the fifth being....
SHEENA INSTANT!!!!  (easton). Ugh. Where's Richard Cook and his sugar walls?

Finally, "The Hair of the Hound" was the highest entering music video
for the week, going in at #6.  The Single File is still hovering around
#8.


Hugh


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Date:     Fri, 27 Jun 86 10:15:23 EDT
From: John Lorch <harvard!seismo!umcp-cs!jhunix!ecf_hydb>
Subject:  re:Frippertronics



	The vocals on Exposure are by Terre Roche, one of the fabulous
Roches. Robert Fripp produced their first (and probably best) album, 
"the Roches".  They plan to record a Christmas album soon with Fripp.
Personally, I like her vocals on that song. You would probably prefer
the original, which appeared on Peter Gabriel's second album. Terre also
sings several other songs on Exposure, including a duet with Peter
Hammill.

	More Fripperies - two new Fripp albums are scheduled for release
this month by JEM.  One is Robert Fripp and the League of Crafty
Guitarists, which consists of Bobo and his guitar class from West
Virginia (I think it's Claremont - not sure). This should be
interesting, as it's app. seventeen acoustic guitars, mostly doing
classic Fripp riffs. The second lp is a duet with Fripp's new wife,
Toyah Wilcox. I'm not familiar with her music, so no guesses here. 


John Lorch
Johns Hopkins University
Homewood Computing Facilities

UUCP:   ihnp4!whuxcc!jhunix!ecf_hydb
ARPA:   ecf_hydb%jhunix.bitnet@wiscvm.arpa
BITNET: ecf_hydb@jhunix

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Date: Sun, 29 Jun 86 15:59:23 EDT
From: nessus (Doug Alan)
Subject: Big Country, Ministry, Test Dept., etc.

Well, I picked up Big Country's *The Seer*.  As you might remember,
Kate sings on the title track.  I wasn't expecting much, because
nothing I've heard by Big County (not that I've listened to much) has
ever done the slightest thing for me except for bring a yawn or two.
I've only listened to one song on the album once, the title track, of
course, and I was pleasantly surprized.  It is nice folk rock.
Nothing to write home to mum about, but a pleasant break from the
Meatmen and Scraping Foetus Off The Wheel every now and then.  I'm
sure that Kate singing on it makes me like it bit more than I
otherwise might, but keep in mind, that I don't like everything Kate
sings (eg "Not This Time" -- actually I've listened to this a bit more
and agree with rpk: there's a good song in there trying to come out,
but the arrangement is naff).

I picked up Ministry's first album, *With Sympathy*, and boy was this
a shock to hear.  It's nothing like their new album.  Instead of
sounding like a more musical Test Dept., it sounds like ABC or
something.  In fact, one of the songs, "I Wanted To Tell Her", I have
heard all over the radio and never had the slightest inkling that it
was done by the same group that does "Over The Shoulder".

Speaking of Test Dept., on the radio I heard a stunning track by them
called "Fist".  It sounded a lot like The Revolting Cocks, only better
and more rhythmically interesting.  Does anyone have any Test Dept.
recommendations?  What should one start with if one liked "Fist"?

			-Doug

"We use them a while
 Then it's over the shoulder"

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Date: Sun, 29 Jun 86 23:00:33 EDT
From: nessus (Doug Alan)
Subject: Zaine Griff

> [Sue:] While on vacation, I picked up an LP by a guy named Zaine
> Griff because it had those magic words "Kate Bush courtesy EMI
> Records" on the back.  The LP's about 4 years old.  It's pretty
> good, very much like Ultravox in their Vienna period, but I have no
> idea who Zaine is.  Not even the trusty Trouser Press guy lists him.
> Kate duets on the song "Flowers," a tribute to Jean Genet...

So how'd you stumble onto Zaine Griff, Sue?  I've never met anyone
who's ever heard of him except 'cuz KB's on one of his albums.  He and
Kate are friends because they were both in a dance class taught by
Lindsay Kemp.

			"with love to share"

			 Doug


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Date:     Mon, 30 Jun 86 13:05:22 EDT
From: James B Hofmann <hofmann@AMSAA.ARPA>
Subject:  Smiles all around.

Sue writes:
>I am going to start a fanzine.  I'm bored, that's why.  If you would

Good luck but the world is saturated towards overflow right now...
and it should prove QUITE frustrating.  How about forming a pirate
radio station instead?  The Robinhood people in Baltimore are starting
a local free new music publication, btw, maybe you could help them?

J.D. is a mediocre writer (much like his friends).  Why doesn't
he hang it up and get a real job?

>As for sending out free records to critics, what the hell's wrong
>with that?  

Because we the record buyers are paying the overhead for promos,
that's why.  Most critics write pretty meaningless drivel to help
enhance their egos.  Personally, I'd rather have a well-educated "describer"
than a critic.   This is one of the reasons I like Sound Choice
over the overpriced, less copy/density "Musician".
---
jim

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From: COBLEY A (on DUNDEE DEC-10) <A.Cobley%dundee.ac.uk@Cs.Ucl.AC.UK>
Date:        Wednesday, 11-Jun-86 20:47:36-BST
Subject:     convoy

	1984 revisited
	you lot out there in the states may not have heard about the
	state of human rights in good old great britain today, how its 
	ok for the police to chase 200 hippies across 3 counties, 
	how its ok for police to 'steal' 200 peoples homes,
	how its ok for the press to abuse a group of people just
	cause they live there own life style, how being yourself
	is suddenly very out of favour in england, so here is the 
	story.

	It goes back 10 or 12 years when a group of 'hippies' started
	off a traveling alternative lifestyle called green avalon, they
	traveled round the country in beat up vans and bus's from 
	free festival to free festival and had a really good time.
	Now the convoy grew and so did the main festival, stonehenge
	until there were over 200 people in the now called
	peace convoy and 70000 people at a free fesitival every year
	where you could see groups like 'hawkwind', 'inner city unit '
	'crass ' 'here and now' 'the enid' 'misty in roots' and so
	on for FREE, and do just about what you like.

	enter 1985
	The govement got fed up with all these 'young' people haveing
	a good time for free and smoking pot, and whats worse the 
	peace convoy claimed social security AND sold drugs so it
	was decided to smash the convoy and ban the festival.  So
 	the battle lines where drawn and inevitable the police won
	200 arresets and vans and busses smashed to pieces 'looking
	for drugs'. end of peace convoy ?

	enter 1986
	The peace convoy having paid its fines and fixed its transport
	tries once again to hold the stonehenge free festival and once
	again is bared from the site, so on it moves to somewhere else
	again to be moved allong and so on until it comes to somewhere
	where the law is a little bit slower.  after three days 500
	police (in full riot gear) move on to the site to move 200
	men, women, children and babies off the site BUT they also
	impound all their vehicles.  This was monday.

	The peace convoy is now homeless, with out transport
	and walking the 60 miles or so to glastonbery CND festival.
	they say they will not be split up and will return next year
	I believe them.

	On top of all this the press and tv have shown the most
	predudiced set of views I have ever come across, if you 
	substituted jew or black for hippy in the headlines  and
	articles we would be back in nazi germany.

	Now i hear that you have n't been told about it.
	Do we live a free democracy?

	enough of this.

	love and peace
	
	andy c

cobley%dundee.micro%dundee@ucl.cs


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Date: Mon, 30 Jun 86 23:31:20 edt
From: The weenies are everywhere.... <wicinski@nrl-cst.arpa>
Subject: babble babble, babble


>labels.  More stats, you ask?  Let's rummage through the last 10
>LPs I bought and check the labels: Alpha, Rough Trade, MCA, Rough
>Trade, el/Cherry Red, Mercury, Cartel, Palladium, Tandan and Wax
>Trax.  I only see 2 major labels there.  

I have a collection of everything JD baby writes in the post, from his
blasting england synth bands (which I liked and would shake his hand for
it) to his articles on 'Genesis stioll rocking'.  Yawwnnnnnn...

I call a major label anyone who charges list price (8.98 or similar) for
an album.  Homestead and Enigma are major labels, as are Rought Trade,
and the Cartel.  Skate Punk Hardcore, you have re affirmed my belief in
you sue.

>As for sending out free records to critics, what the hell's wrong
>with that?  All the critics I know buy tons of records and review them
>as well, but say that critic A has never heard of band B or seen their
>record in the shops.  Band B's label send critic A their latest LP.
>Critic A loves it and writes a glowing review.  It happens, you know.

We pay for it. The consumer that is.  Which is why the american indie
labels sell there records for cheaper than list price cause they don't
send that many promos out.

My feeling is that the big record labels are trash.  critics are trash.
we are trash. everything is trash.  

I think that Fripp's idea of "small, mobile, and intelligent" (actuall
Bennet's) should be applied to record labels.  What I would like to see
is a collection of small labels which put out bands that live in the
same area as the label (Ace of Hearts, Dischord, and Rabid Cat come to
mind as prime examples).  These labels can concentrate on local artists,
and releasing albums with little publicity.  The resulting products can
be sold for a cheaper price, since most other expenses could go away.
Also I can't see why record companies be non-profit. Most operate like
that anyway due to reality.

I also don't see too many big critics reviewing any cassette releases ??? 
too much pressure from the record industry ??

>Ooh, how cutting.  I've seen the Morning Glories, and found them not
>to my liking, I'm afraid.  

I forgot, they opened for mr. hitchcock.  Did you buy a copy of the
fanzine they were selling, Greed ??  If you want to put out a fanzine,
there's a place to look for a prime example on how to put out a WELL
prepared zine.  Nice graphices, typeset nice, pictures you can see,
cartoons, and great fiction.  only 1.50.  most zines you see will be shredded
pieces of xerox.



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Date: Mon, 30 Jun 86 23:37:27 edt
From: The weenies are everywhere.... <wicinski@nrl-cst.arpa>
Subject: Roger Miller

Roger Miller Maximum Electric Piano  at d.c. space

wow, only about 30 people or so showed up for this event, I guess they
were "trying" to be hip seeing green on red at 9:30.  well, me and
labovitz are hip, we saw the dude.  Played some boss tunes our way.  Did
some new stuff which is on his new album, as well as a burma cover, miss
shiparo, and a cool song about cyclops.  
Gave us a tour of his equipment too.  One of the few (and I've been told
lucky) owners of a 16 second digital delay.   what a way to make
effects, too.  aliigator clips, wood blocks, and combs.  

his new album should be out in a few weeks.  not planning any major tour
as of yet, just weekend 'jaunts'.

stayed tuned for more.

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Date: Tue, 1 Jul 86 00:28:56 EDT
From: nessus (Doug Alan)
Subject: Re:  Roger Miller

> [Iguana Breath on Roger Miller:] his new album should be out in a
> few weeks.  not planning any major tour as of yet, just weekend
> 'jaunts'.

Translate few weeks into six months and you will probably have a more
accurate estimate.  Didn't I tell you he was boss?  Hey, I'm so
flucking godlike!  Did I mention that Birdsongs of the Mesozoic's new
EP is *finally* out.  Buy it!

			-Doug


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End of Love-Hounds Digest