🚀 go-pugleaf

RetroBBS NetNews Server

Inspired by RockSolid Light RIP Retro Guy

3 total messages Started by Moderator, John Quarterman Tue, 04 Nov 1986 17:36
Re: Case sensitive file names
#388
Author: Moderator, John Quarterman
Date: Tue, 04 Nov 1986 17:36
54 lines
3124 bytes
From: chris@mimsy.umd.edu (Chris Torek)
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 86 07:33:44 EST

We seem to have three proposals:

CS: Case sensitive file systems.  This is what all major Unix variants
    (V6, V7, SysIII, SysV, 2BSD, and 4BSD) now support.

CC: Case coercive file systems (file names forced to all upper or all
    lower case).

CR: Case retaining but otherwise insensitive file systems (new names
    are created according to the given case; matches are not case
    sensitive).

I sincerely hope that no one is seriously suggesting POSIX adopt
CC: no one seems to like such systems much.  That leaves CS and
CR.  The case for CR appears to be that those who have used both
CS and CR prefer CR.  This may be true; I have seen no studies,
but the anecdotes do seem to favour it.  I have used such a system,
and did not think it so wonderful, but for the sake of argument,
let us assume that CR really is objectively better than CS---so
much so that 5BSD and System V Release N+1 will have CR style file
systems.  Fine.

But as I understand it, POSIX is intended to be an interface
specification for something that resembles `Unix' (whatever `Unix'
may be).  If that is indeed the case, the only sensible choice is
CS, for, as I noted above, this is what all major Unix variants
*do*.  *They all agree:* file names are case sensitive.  Should
we make standard something that no one uses?  I say no!  When
5BSD and Release N+1 come out, then we can create a new standard
to describe these wonderful new systems, but until then, let
us write something that describes what we have now.

I believe that the first standard for *anything* that already exists
should describe the existing implementations, at least wherever
they agree.  Afterward, feel free to invent new improved standards,
so as to foist progress upon vendors.  Indeed, it might not be a
bad idea to publish two standards virtually simultaneously: That
Which Is, and That Which Should Be.  But list first That Which Is.

[ There really are (or at least were) two discussions going on here:
one about what should be in POSIX, the other about what UNIX should do.
I haven't seen any recent arguments that POSIX should do anything but
reflect what UNIX currently does, i.e., case sensitive file names
(really file names as uninterpreted byte streams).  -mod ]

-- 
In-Real-Life: Chris Torek, Univ of MD Comp Sci Dept (+1 301 454 7690)
UUCP:	seismo!umcp-cs!chris
CSNet:	chris@umcp-cs		ARPA:	chris@mimsy.umd.edu

Volume-Number: Volume 8, Number 34
Re: Case sensitive file names
#400
Author: Moderator, John Quarterman
Date: Fri, 07 Nov 1986 13:55
35 lines
1824 bytes
From: mcvax!axis!philip@seismo.css.gov (Philip Peake)
Date: Fri, 7 Nov 86 09:41:00 -0100
Organization: Axis Digital, 135 rue d'Aguesseau, Boulogne, 92100, FRANCE

In article <6226@ut-sally.UUCP>:
>From: chris@mimsy.umd.edu (Chris Torek)
>Date: Tue, 4 Nov 86 07:33:44 EST
>
>We seem to have three proposals:
>
>CS: Case sensitive file systems.  This is what all major Unix variants
>    (V6, V7, SysIII, SysV, 2BSD, and 4BSD) now support.
>
>CC: Case coercive file systems (file names forced to all upper or all
>    lower case).
>
>CR: Case retaining but otherwise insensitive file systems (new names
>    are created according to the given case; matches are not case
>    sensitive).
>
>I sincerely hope that no one is seriously suggesting POSIX adopt
>CC: no one seems to like such systems much.

This one line invalidates completely the rest of this article.
WHY do people trying to defend one of their pet ideas always claim
than 'no one' wants the opposite?

There is at least ONE person whod DOES want such filesystems - me!
And I DO suggest that POSIX adopt such a system.

Philip

[ Nor are arguments consisting solely of "I want it" very useful.  -mod ]

Volume-Number: Volume 8, Number 47
Re: Case sensitive file names
#405
Author: Moderator, John Quarterman
Date: Sat, 08 Nov 1986 23:16
27 lines
1579 bytes
From: seismo!enea!chalmers.UUCP!jacob (Jacob Hallen)
Date: Fri, 7 Nov 86 23:35:50 -0100
Organization: Dept. of CS, Chalmers, Sweden

>We seem to have three proposals:
>
>CS: Case sensitive file systems.  This is what all major Unix variants
>    (V6, V7, SysIII, SysV, 2BSD, and 4BSD) now support.
>
>CC: Case coercive file systems (file names forced to all upper or all
>    lower case).
>
>CR: Case retaining but otherwise insensitive file systems (new names
>    are created according to the given case; matches are not case
>    sensitive).
>

There is a serious flaw in the CR case! You lose orthogonality in
the interpretation of commands since creations, moves, copies and
some other file operations will interpret arguments literally while
other commands will have their arguments interpreted in the flexible way.
A move by the way is a good example since one argument will be treated
in one way and the other in the other way.

Jacob Hallen

Volume-Number: Volume 8, Number 49
Thread Navigation

This is a paginated view of messages in the thread with full content displayed inline.

Messages are displayed in chronological order, with the original post highlighted in green.

Use pagination controls to navigate through all messages in large threads.

Back to All Threads