🚀 go-pugleaf

> every time I post an article to this group I get a nasty
> message from a mailer saying that arpanet refused a piece of mail.
> what is going on?
> simon@mcvax

Ditto for me, except that it's 4 letters.  UCBVAX seems to be the culprit.
-- 

				Craig Werner
				!philabs!aecom!werner
 "Comedy, like Medicine, was never meant to be practiced by the general public."

I had *10* messages waiting for me this morning (Monday) from two 
articles I posted last week.  All were from mailers that failed.
I'm sure I'll have several more from this posting.  :-(

-Kit-

> > every time I post an article to this group I get a nasty
> > message from a mailer saying that arpanet refused a piece of mail.
> > what is going on?
> > simon@mcvax
> 
> Ditto for me, except that it's 4 letters.  UCBVAX seems to be the culprit.
> -- 
me three, is there a workaround ????
-- 
			god bless Lily St. Cyr
			 -Rocky Horror Picture Show

Name:	James Turner
Mail:	Imagen Corp. 2650 San Tomas Expressway, P.O. Box 58101
	Santa Clara, CA 95052-9400
AT&T:	(408) 986-9400
UUCP:	...{decvax,ucbvax}!decwrl!imagen!negami!turner

>Various complaints about arpanet messages sent to usenet people because
>some arpanet machine couldn't contact another to forward a mailing list. 

(Put on your asbestos suit.  Here it comes.)

This is happening to me too.  I once had this happen on net.micro.amiga to
the point where I was getting 8 junk mail messages a day.  This happened for
two weeks (until the involved computers decided to give up).  Frankly, this
pisses me off.  This is not the way the software should behave.  I would
think that arpa sites would be more responsible than that.  This is not
something that needs to be handled on an individual basis.  The software
needs to be changed to do more intelligent things when a mailing list can't
go to a particular machine.  The obviously correct thing to do would be to
mail notices to the person responsible for the forwarding instead of sending
personal mail to the poster of the message.  Gatewaying articles into
arpanet is a Nice Thing, but this brain-damaged behavior is costing Usenet
people a lot of money.  They have to pay real phone bills!

I am quite seriously thinking of writing a program to pull such messages out
of my mailbox and mail them back to the offending machine.  I think maybe if
something like that got posted and people started using it then the people
responsible would take action to correct it.  I wonder how much money has
been wasted because of these messages?  Think about my case.  Eight messages
a day containing the entire source of my postings repeated for two weeks.
That's 112 junk mails.  You want to pay for it?  I don't.

(You can remove the asbestos suit now.)

Sean

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sean Casey                              UUCP:  sean@ukma.UUCP   or
915 Patterson Office Tower                     {cbosgd,anlams,hasmed}!ukma!sean
University of Kentucky                  ARPA:  ukma!sean@ANL-MCS.ARPA
Lexington, Ky. 40506-0027             BITNET:  sean@UKMA.BITNET
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In article <2323@ukma.UUCP> sean@ukma.UUCP (Sean Casey) writes:
>>Various complaints about arpanet messages sent to usenet people because
>>some arpanet machine couldn't contact another to forward a mailing list. 
>
>I am quite seriously thinking of writing a program to pull such messages out
>of my mailbox and mail them back to the offending machine.  I think maybe if
>something like that got posted and people started using it then the people
>responsible would take action to correct it.

Consider yourself lucky. Every message that leaves the USENET from ucbvax
bound for an ARPANET mailing list has two headers added to it:

	Sender: usenet@ucbvax.berkeley.edu
	Errors-To: usenet@ucbvax.berkeley.edu

I'm usenet@ucbvax.berkeley.edu. Imagine my mailbox.

If a mailer is implemented properly, it should send error messages
back to the `Sender:'. `Errors-To:' is something that sendmail knows
about, which I insert as insurance.

The offending systems that have been incorrectly routing error messages
back to the USENET poster are all TENEX/TWENEX systems. I encourage you
to bombard the mailbox

	postmaster@offending.arpa.host

for each error message you receive. If you (and others) lambast the
individual postmasters sufficiently, perhaps they will in turn poke the
mailer implementer(s) to FIX the damned things. Among other odious
behaviour exhibited by these mailers is that they will try an address
for three days, and EACH DAY they will send an update if the message
has not gotten through. Personally, I only want to know when my message
finally fails. Before that, I don't want to hear it!

	keeper of the network news for ucbvax,
		and guardian of the gateway,

	Erik E. Fair	ucbvax!fair	fair@ucbarpa.BERKELEY.EDU

> Among other odious behaviour exhibited by these mailers is that they
> will try an address for three days, and EACH DAY they will send an
> update if the message has not gotten through. Personally, I only want
> to know when my message finally fails. Before that, I don't want to
> hear it!  /* Written  3:21 am  Oct 25, 1985 by
> fair@ucbarpa.BERKELEY.EDU in ccvaxa:net.micro.atari */
----------
That's a necessary attitude on Usenet, where mail may take two weeks
to arrive at its destination.  Perhaps the Arpanet people, with
continuous connectivity, are used to mail performance that makes
a one day delay onerous.

-- 
scott preece
gould/csd - urbana
ihnp4!uiucdcs!ccvaxa!preece