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Fabrikant wrote:

> he mentions that Canada has as many guns per person as US

That is totally false.

Do a google search.  Here's an example:

http://www.guncontrol.ca/Content/TheCaseForGunControl.html

It says that US gun ownership per capita is about 3 times that of
Canada.  Other web pages say roughly the same thing.

But I still can't believe that per-capita gun ownership in Canada (and
% of households with guns) is roughly 25%.  There is no way that 1 out
of every 4 people, or 1 out of every 4 homes in Canada - has a gun.

Maybe some people (or some homes) have 4, 5, 20 guns.  But you can't
tell me that there is a gun in 1 out of every 4 homes in Canada. 
Maybe in some neighborhoods in Toronto and Vancouver.  But not across
all of Canada.

some guy wrote:
>
> > he mentions that Canada has as many guns per person as US
> ...
> That is totally false.
> Maybe some people (or some homes) have 4, 5, 20 guns.  But you can't
> tell me that there is a gun in 1 out of every 4 homes in Canada.
> Maybe in some neighborhoods in Toronto and Vancouver.  But not across
> all of Canada.

You are talking nonsense. Number of guns in population has nothing to
do with number of murders. Switzerland has obligatory gun ownership for
every men of military age (see
http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-switzerland.htm). Nevertheless, they
don't kill each other like Americans do.

Let me tell you a secret: for a gun, to kill a human being, it's owner
MUST want to kill that human. Got it?

Joon wrote:
 
> some guy wrote:
>
> > you can't tell me that there is a gun in 1 out of every 4
> > homes in Canada.
>
> You are talking nonsense. Number of guns in population has
> nothing to do with number of murders. 

Where did I say anything about murders?

Read what I said.  

I said (1) that the original poster (and Michael Moore) is wrong when
they claim that there are just as many guns in Canada as there are in
the US (on a per-capita basis).

And then I said (2) that I can't believe some published numbers that
say that 25% of homes in Canada have guns.

I did not say anything about the social or human-factors issues
surrounding gun ownership and use.

In article <1132410245.875246.233750@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
 "Fabrikant" <benny_patrick7@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Well, Moore, I can give you an even more startling example: in
> Switzerland every citizen by law is obliged to have a firearm in his
> house, nevertheless, they kill each other much less than even Canadians
> do.  WHY?
> 
> Fabrikant

Well, the point of the film is that no one has figured out why we kill 
each other with guns at such a high rate.  What Michael Moore did was to 
call attention to it in an interesting and sometimes humorous way.  
That's a step in the right direction.  

Dave

CAlling your attention to it?
Um, you've been doing it for decades and decades.
I recal a poster from the late 70's, early 80's. It was part off an American 
awareness campaign.
They listed about 100 countries in the world, beside each country was the 
number of deaths per year by handgun.
Starting with 1, then 2, then 8, then 10, until you got to the second last 
country and it was high, like hundreds, you start to get the idea some 
places are violent. LAst was the USA with over 12,000 deaths by hand guns. 
Admittingly the murder rate has dropped, especally in states like New York, 
so I think it's down to 10,000 or so. But all the other countries combined 
didn't even add up to 1/3.

This is an American problem, and it is supported by their culture. From 
their beginnings a violent revolution, to the wild west, the gun has always 
been a solution, a problem solver that Americans are quick to use, because 
of their history, heritage and culture. After all American's are people too.

You want to know why they kill at a rate way out of proportion to the rest 
of the world, then you need to look at what makes American's different - 
their history, heritage and culture. So it is in there that the answer can 
be found. And if you notice, guns play a dramatic role in American History, 
Heritage and culture. Thus more American's just solve problems with a loaded 
gun. And those things kill people.

A countr like Canada does not have violence in it's history. Well yes, but 
that is either French or Bristish history, not Cnadian. We became a country 
by negotiation and discussion. We didn't take up guns and kill our masters. 
American's did. We didn't expand our country by violent warring. The 
American's did. And we don't make movies that glorify killing, but the 
American's do. Yes, we watch their movies, but we filter it through the 
Candian experience. The American's through the American experience. ANd the 
American experience embracess guns, and killing to solve conflicts, issues 
and problems. That is not the Canadian experience.


Oh, and Fabrikant, you are a convicted murderer, so your opinion is 
incarcerated and does not count for anything.
Actually there s a court order to that effect. Something about 25 years with 
no parrole.....

"Dave Moorman" <none@none.com> wrote in message 
news:none-224351.23104819112005@news.giganews.com...
> In article <1132410245.875246.233750@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
> "Fabrikant" <benny_patrick7@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Well, Moore, I can give you an even more startling example: in
>> Switzerland every citizen by law is obliged to have a firearm in his
>> house, nevertheless, they kill each other much less than even Canadians
>> do.  WHY?
>>
>> Fabrikant
>
> Well, the point of the film is that no one has figured out why we kill
> each other with guns at such a high rate.  What Michael Moore did was to
> call attention to it in an interesting and sometimes humorous way.
> That's a step in the right direction.
>
> Dave 

Dave Moorman wrote:

>
> Well, the point of the film is that no one has figured out why we kill
> each other with guns at such a high rate.  What Michael Moore did was to
> call attention to it in an interesting and sometimes humorous way.
> That's a step in the right direction.
>
> Dave


What he did was too little with too much emotion directed the wrong
way. Let me give an idea as to why one person kills the other: he hates
him. So, the good question to ask is, why is there so much hatred? The
usual source of hatred is in justice. In America, this injustice is
exacerbated by hypocritical propaganda of "justice and freedom for
all", while the reality is totally opposite. This conflict between
reality and the propaganda creates additional hatred.

Fabrikant