🚀 go-pugleaf

Kurtz wrote:
> <wrcowan1@hal-pc.org> wrote in message
> news:43251271$0$10628$a726171b@news.hal-pc.org...
> 
>>
>>Kurtz wrote:
>>
>>><wrcowan1@hal-pc.org> wrote in message
>>>news:4323a3f4$0$10624$a726171b@news.hal-pc.org...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Kurtz wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>><wrcowan1@hal-pc.org> wrote in message
>>>>>news:43226971$0$10624$a726171b@news.hal-pc.org...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Obwon wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"They won't let
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>anyone in there. You have to be FEMA-certified and I am
>>>>>>>not," he said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Do you have a clue why you need to be certified by FEMA?  It is so
> 
> that
> 
>>>>>>your actions are coordinated with others and that you understand the
>>>>>>scope of tasks being dealt with.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>When a tragedy or disaster occurs in Arizona, trained,
>>>>>>>skilled people are allowed to help without Federal
>>>>>>>Emergency Management Agency certification, he said.
>>>>>>>"But when a national disaster is in effect, federal
>>>>>>>rules take over and FEMA would have to approve it,"
>>>>>>>said Dudelston.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Once the storm has past, Federal agencies do get involved.  They do
> 
> not
> 
>>>>>>want everyone to rush down to give aid, it would create anarchy and
>>>>>>dangerous situations.  That is the same that applies with state agency
>>>>>>runned efforts.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"It's kind of sad people are being turned away, the
>>>>>>>minute they go into a federal situation, they just
>>>>>>>can't get in there," he said. "The problem is when
>>>>>>>something like this happens - when an area is declared
>>>>>>>a national disaster - you can't go in there. They don't
>>>>>>>know them (trained volunteers) from Adam, so they can't
>>>>>>>let them in," he said of federal officials.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>This statements is true of both Federal and State agencies.  To allow
>>>>>>everyone who wants to provide relief efforts in to a disaster zone
>>>>>>invites disaster and poses potential hazards for not only those being
>>>>>>helped but to those who are doing the helping.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>These agencies have to impose control over the area so that relief
>>>>>>efforts are coordinated and effective without putting the lives of
> 
> those
> 
>>>>>>helping in harms way.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>MRC
>>>>>
>>>>>You are clueless, aren't you? Wilfull, or ignorant?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>No, you have demonstrated your utter inability to apply both common
>>>>sense and comprehension.  I am thankful that you are not in charge of
>>>>the efforts in New Orleans.  You would have gotten people killed.
>>>>
>>>>Point Set Match.  You have lost and continue to lose (2000, 2002, 2004,
>>>>2006, 2008)
>>>
>>>
>>>Okay, here's the kicker.
>>>On Friday Sept. 1st I recvd an EMail from the U.S. Department of
> 
> Homeland
> 
>>>Security,
>>>Federal Emergency Management Agency. You see, I have DEEP experience on
> 
> a
> 
>>>piece of communications gear that few others around the nation have. In
>>>addition, I have spent 15 years of my life working with 2.7-13.2 GHz
> 
> full
> 
>>>duplex microwave gear mounted in large vans. I've put up 'the stick'( a
> 
> 30
> 
>>>foot mast ) in howling storms, in water up to the axles, nestled between
> 
> two
> 
>>>moaning Onan Gensets to allow 2 way video and multiband audio and data
>>>streams to be shared, and I have made the shots work. This kind of
> 
> knowhow
> 
>>>and experience is hard to find. I responded IMMEDIATELY: I told the
> 
> Family
> 
>>>good bye, and packed up my gear ( 2 racks full...), staged it all at my
>>>front door, and began waiting for the callback, and the transport to the
>>>staging area.
>>
>>Yeah right!
> 
> 
> A stsement of fact.
> 
>>>And here I am 11 days later STILL waiting for the call. I did recieve a
>>>second EMail  Fri. the 9th: I would LOVE to share the details with you
> 
> so
> 
>>>that you might gather a clue or two, but....well it IS DHS/FEMA bidness,
> 
> and
> 
>>>they don't cotton to sharing their internal communications.
>>>
>>
>>Gee why not?  You are more than willing to critize everything else.
>>Please go ahead and share the news. Perhaps they told you they did what
>>a nut job anywhere near them.
> 
> 
> No: but here is an insite. Gov. employees are professionals who will always
> be there, no matter who sits in the White House. Poor leadership of Gov.
> ops. is the direct result of patronage.

Perhaps but you have to remember the breakdown was at the State level. 
The failed to follow the plans they had set forth.

> 
>>>So I spent my time ( cell and pager at the ready, able to deploy in 15
>>>minutes ) helping out at the Reliant Park clusterfuck. I wish you had
> 
> been
> 
>>>there to help disadvantaged people  ( who don't know a whole lot about
>>>computers ) apply for FEMA assistance, and search the various sites
> 
> created
> 
>>>to allow them to find their families, loved ones, children.........but I
>>>didn't see 'wrcowan-HAL-PC' on any name tags around me.....
>>>It has been a heartbreaking week.
>>
>>Your characterization of the Reliant Park setup suggests that you
>>understand little and can not even fathom what it takes to even get such
>>a operation like Reliant Park up and running in such little time.
> 
> 
> The cronyism at the top confused the orderly operations of an entire
> enterprise.

Maybe but it still was a helluva an operation in such a short time.


>  As
> 
>>for name tags, why would it have wrcowan1-HAL-PC on it?
> 
> 
> My apologies: posting while enraged...
> 
>>My activities have been helping out those who did not go to Reliant
>>Park.  I have been helping out the Second Mile ministry in Missouri City
>>and other area relief operations.  You know the one who are providing
>>food clothing and such to those who lost it all.  If you have been
>>helping out great.
> 
> 
> Thanks for your efforts
> 
>>>Punchline is I am PISSED at the political footdragging ( not the
>>>departmental or Ops )
>>>that stymied the rollout of gear that would have streamlined field
>>>communications, and maybe have saved a few lives.
>>
>>If the Govenor of Lousinan would have got the hell out of the way and
>>allowed FEMA to have coordinated efforts as it is designed to do it
>>would have gone a hellua a lot better than it did.  Would it have been
>>perfect no but it would have been better that what did happen.
>>
>>
>>>So when you popped up and popped off on any number of subjects that you
>>>haven't got the foggiest clue about,
>>
>> From the post that you have written I am way more versed in these areas
>>than you are.  YOu show you do not even know how FEMA operates or even
>>what the laws are concerning the Military.
> 
> 
> Not my areas of expertise: but the entire response was screwed due to the
> politization of agencies designed to work for our common safety. The
> SuperDome fiasco
> was preventable. For the first time in history, the Red Cross was denied
> access to the scene. They have been on the frontlines since their inception.
> But not this time.
> 

I do not think it was politicalization per se.  It was just plain 
stupidity.  The Mayor of N.O was an idiot who failed to carry out the 
emergency plan as outlined.  He did not think out his actions.  Instead 
he just reacted badly with poor judgement.  The Govenor of Louisiana did 
not follow the emergency plan as was outlined.  She furthe made things 
worse by failing to send in the guard earlier and in sufficent numbers. 
  She failed to allow FEMA and the Red cross to do its job.  I think she 
probably politicized the situation.  She wanted to retain control when 
clearly she had no clue or was even prepared.  She feared sending in the 
guard because it would look bad.  She did not want to make mandatory 
evacuations because of perception.

I am confident that if had at least directed all her agencies to 
coordinate with FEMA and the Red Cross things would have been better.


>>
>>>I vented my frustrations at you.
>>
>>Fine I do not care if you do or not but it just reflects badly on you.
>>
>>
>>>rightly so. It is the apologists, sycophants, spinners, ignoramouses,
> 
> and
> 
>>>disinfo agents like you that have allowed a criminal and incompetant
> 
> junta
> 
>>>to continue fooling all of the people some of the time, and some of the
>>>people all of the time.
>>
>>See you lose credibility everytime you pop off like that.
> 
> 
> I just can't understand the apologists for this giant failure to 'do the
> right thing'.

I am not an apologist for anything, but I look at the situation for what 
it was.  There was a disaster.  It is not going to go well.  It will 
take time to evacuate a major city that had been flooded out.  But with 
that said we have laws that have to be followed.  You talk about states 
rights but if the Feds got involved by taking over then you set a 
precedent that could in the future have bad consequences.

> 
>>>As to demonstrated utter inability to apply both common sense and
>>>comprehension skills, you have repeatedly proven that you are the poster
>>>child for Freeper cluelessness. You are the arm-chair Major of the 'all
> 
> of
> 
>>>the time' contingent.
>>
>>Feel better now that your tantrum is over?
> 
> 
> Mea Culpa.
> 
>>>The 'game' is just starting: don't even begin to claim victory when you
>>>don't even know where the court is......
>>
>>
>>The game ended a while back.  I won when you were unable to defend your
>>points and started to spew vapid responses.
> 
> 
> I agree with and welcome your right to disagree. But this isn't a game, it's
> our common rights and futures at stake. I don't want to see a repeat when
> the next catastrophy occures.
> 
>>MRC


True but when have we had a major city like New Orleans destroyed in 
recent time?  YOu have to go back to perhaps Texas City or back to 
Galveston or even to San Francisco earthquake.  Think the response to 
the last two disasters were better that N.O.  Compare this disaster with 
the last couple of Cat 4 or 5 hurricanes.  In comparison, the federal 
responsewas better now then it was then.  Lessons have been learned.

In the future these should be lessons we take from this crisis.

1 Follow all state and local emergency plans.
2 do not wait to evacuate or ask for federal help.
3. If unable to carry out relief operations, get out of the way and let 
FEMA and red cross do it.
4.  Let FEMA and the Red Cross do it job.

It may not be perfect but sure will be better than what we had.

One furthe note.  FEMA is a weak organization with not much powers 
outside organizing and managing federal assessts.  IT always has been 
that was and way intentionally made weak.  Perhaps it should be given 
more power to actual take charge ofthe scene.

MRC