🚀 go-pugleaf

"Gareth Magennis" <sound.service@btconnect.com> wrote in message
news:TeCdndqv6fQI-hXUnZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@bt.com...
>
> "Soundhaspriority" <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:Pr6dnR54X7gIUxrUnZ2dnUVZ_qvinZ2d@giganews.com...
>>
>> "jason" <absent@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> news:MPG.23f1929671f1b1f4989827@news.verizon.net...
>> [snip]
>>>
>>> So, my questions are these: does NV memory incorporate ECC?
>>> And if not, why not? And, what's the majority opinion on the
>>> reliability of these memory cards. I'd used this particular
>>> Lexar card many times, so I don't know if the error was a
>>> problem with the card or with the 671. It was running on
>>> batteries, with fairly long mic cable runs, so I suspect
>>> that static electricity may have played a part; no grounding
>>> to bleed static. It was a very cold, dry day.
>>>
>> There are actually two types of flash:
>>
>> 1. NOR flash, which is made in very small capacities, and has
>> individually addressable cells. The cells are considered reliable, and
>> there is no ECC.
>>
>> 2. NAND flash, used by all flash drives, cards, etc. The cells are
>> unreliable; it's part of the manufacturing process that they do not write
>> reliably, and it's all compensated for by writing the data in ECC,
>> error-correcting-code. NAND is only block-addressable, which gives the
>> ECC a nice long word length. The combination is very reliable, on paper.
>>
>> Yet we all know flash drives fail. SD cards are particularly vulnerable,
>> because they rely on the external equivalent of a disk controller. But
>> your machine uses CF cards, which do contain integral controllers. If a
>> CF card fails, it's entirely the fault of the CF card.
>>
>> There are two types of NAND flash cells: single layer, and multi-layer.
>> The multi-layer cells store three bits per cell, but have a short
>> lifetime. If you have a multilayer CF card, you could have worn it out.
>> This would be unlikely with a single-layer card.
>>
>>
>>> Before the 671, I used a Sony HD Minidisc for recording, and
>>> it worked well. I think I could hook it to the Line Out or
>>> Optical out on the 671 (I think they're active during
>>> recording) for a backup. I haven't tried that yet, but I
>>> sure will!
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Jason
>>
>> It's always good to have a backup.
>>
>> Bob Morein
>> (310) 237-6511
>>
>
>
> I recently bought a M Audio Microtrack 2 and 2 x 8GB Kingston CF cards, as
> I need to make 8 hour uninterrpted recordings.  I have been sent 2
> replacement machines, the last one has just been sent back for a refund,
> I've had enough now, as I couldn't get any of the three with either card
> to reliably complete the recordings - they would randomly hang and the
> card would be empty on re-boot.  Also, the first machines recording time
> elapsed display was about 10% slow (!!!???), the second machine refused to
> boot up with one of the cards, the second machine refused to boot with
> either of the cards, though both cards have made numerous transfers of
> these large WAV's via a USB reader and my laptop and desktop with no
> reported errors at all so far.
>
> I hadn't realised CF cards are not considered reliable or I would never
> have gone down this route in the first place.  I don't know where the
> fault lies here, the machines, the cards, or some incompatability/bugs.
> I'm not impressed.
>
>
>
> Gareth.
>
Gareth, I didn't mean to imply that CF cards are unreliable. The scheme of
unreliable  cells combined with massive error correction combines to produce
a reliable media (on paper.)  People in the r.a.m.p.s. forum use these cards
extensively. There are failures, and my personal impression is that the user
experience with flash is not as good as with hard disk. However, in the case
of low priced flash recorders, I would suspect a design flaw in the
recorders. A flash card requires steady power at a good amperage to write.

It would be easy to be critical of the Microtrak after a look at the plastic
case, and how it's put together on the inside. But that isn't the answer
either. It is probably a case of the notorious Chinese quality control. One
production run will be good, the next, bad. Many well reviewed products end
up causing user misery that is not reflected in the reviews, because the
quality control slipped after the first run.

I wish I had an easy solution for you. It will probably take a lot of
persistence by you with M-Audio to get them to make good. If you need some
help harassing them, I am very experienced at intimidating weak people to do
my bidding.

Bob Morein
(310) 237-6511