🚀 go-pugleaf

"Lloyd Sumpter" <lsumpter@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:pan.2002.09.13.17.50.59.415798.26951@shaw.ca...
> Hi,
>
>    Well, after a year of sounding funny and being hard to steer, the
> steering finally broke altogether on Far Cove. I'd been meaning to replace
> the enclosed cable unit for a year now, but never got around to it...
>
>    In a way, it was Good News/Bad News. The Bad News was that the
> steering broke, the Good News is that the grinding was not the rudder or
> rudder post.
>
>    Wheel steering on a Catalina 36 is done by Edson's Pull-Pull system,
> (http://www.edsonmarine.com/sailboat/pdf/K29_20_21.pdf) which is basically
> conduit-covered cables. In their Infinite Wisdom, Catalina used these
> conduits to turn some mighty tight corners, as well as swapping sides so
> the boat steers in the proper direction. (even though Edson clearly says:
> "Conduit should have no 90 degree bends...")
>
>    So, after 20 years of Hard Labour, the conduit finally failed.
>
>    One comment on cable steering as opposed to hydraulic: it failed
> (completely) as I was trying to turn Far Cove around in a tight marina,
> swinging the wheel lock-to-lock as I alternated between reverse and a
> blast of fwd to conteract the prop-walk (and wind). Even though it had
> failed, I STILL was able to steer the boat adequately to get it into the
> slip. I suspect that a failure in a hydraulic system would mean a COMPLETE
> failure (ie no steering possible at all).
>
>    So, if you have a Catalina, CHECK THE STEERING! If you have the
> Pull-pull system and the conduit is used to turn 90 degrees, consider
> replacing it with proper shivs. And make sure you know where your
> emergency tiller is ;)
>
> Lloyd Sumpter
> "Far Cove" Catalina 36

Good post Lloyd.  We had a similar experience in a Maple Leaf fourty
"something" .  There was a mean souwester blowing just out of the Fraser
River and we lost our hydraulics off Galliano.  All kinds of Coast Guard
activity with rescues going on all over the straights.  This was a new boat
and not fully equipped yet .  We used an oar for a tiller until it broke,
then we broke another.  We finally limped into Nanaimo and dropped anchor
about 30 seconds after breaking our third and last oar.  Learned a scary
lesson that day and that is to have some kind of solid and secure emergency
tiller on board.  Trouble is I would know that but I wasn't the skipper.

"zbigniew buchanan" <bbbb@bb.com> wrote in message
news:sSpg9.312$w8.4537@newscontent-01.sprint.ca...
>
> "Lloyd Sumpter" <lsumpter@shaw.ca> wrote in message
> news:pan.2002.09.13.17.50.59.415798.26951@shaw.ca...
> > Hi,
> >
> >    Well, after a year of sounding funny and being hard to steer, the
> > steering finally broke altogether on Far Cove. I'd been meaning to
replace
> > the enclosed cable unit for a year now, but never got around to it...
> >
> >    In a way, it was Good News/Bad News. The Bad News was that the
> > steering broke, the Good News is that the grinding was not the rudder or
> > rudder post.
> >
> >    Wheel steering on a Catalina 36 is done by Edson's Pull-Pull system,
> > (http://www.edsonmarine.com/sailboat/pdf/K29_20_21.pdf) which is
basically
> > conduit-covered cables. In their Infinite Wisdom, Catalina used these
> > conduits to turn some mighty tight corners, as well as swapping sides so
> > the boat steers in the proper direction. (even though Edson clearly
says:
> > "Conduit should have no 90 degree bends...")
> >
> >    So, after 20 years of Hard Labour, the conduit finally failed.
> >
> >    One comment on cable steering as opposed to hydraulic: it failed
> > (completely) as I was trying to turn Far Cove around in a tight marina,
> > swinging the wheel lock-to-lock as I alternated between reverse and a
> > blast of fwd to conteract the prop-walk (and wind). Even though it had
> > failed, I STILL was able to steer the boat adequately to get it into the
> > slip. I suspect that a failure in a hydraulic system would mean a
COMPLETE
> > failure (ie no steering possible at all).
> >
> >    So, if you have a Catalina, CHECK THE STEERING! If you have the
> > Pull-pull system and the conduit is used to turn 90 degrees, consider
> > replacing it with proper shivs. And make sure you know where your
> > emergency tiller is ;)
> >
> > Lloyd Sumpter
> > "Far Cove" Catalina 36
>
> Good post Lloyd.  We had a similar experience in a Maple Leaf fourty
> "something" .  There was a mean souwester blowing just out of the Fraser
> River and we lost our hydraulics off Galliano.  All kinds of Coast Guard
> activity with rescues going on all over the straights.  This was a new
boat
> and not fully equipped yet .  We used an oar for a tiller until it broke,
> then we broke another.  We finally limped into Nanaimo and dropped anchor
> about 30 seconds after breaking our third and last oar.  Learned a scary
> lesson that day and that is to have some kind of solid and secure
emergency
> tiller on board.  Trouble is I would know that but I wasn't the skipper.


I should add, to my last post, we had also lost the use of our diesel engine
minutes after losing the steering.  The whole trip was a five day comedy of
errors.
>
>

I investigated an accident about two years ago where an 18 ft. outboard boat
had a complete steering failure at high speed.  The engine went hard over
into a starboard turn.  Flipped both occupants out the port side.  One or
both hit the windshield on the way out.  The owner drowned and the passenger
got a broken arm.



"Lloyd Sumpter" <lsumpter@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:pan.2002.09.13.17.50.59.415798.26951@shaw.ca...
> Hi,
>
>    Well, after a year of sounding funny and being hard to steer, the
> steering finally broke altogether on Far Cove. I'd been meaning to replace
> the enclosed cable unit for a year now, but never got around to it...
>
>    In a way, it was Good News/Bad News. The Bad News was that the
> steering broke, the Good News is that the grinding was not the rudder or
> rudder post.
>
>    Wheel steering on a Catalina 36 is done by Edson's Pull-Pull system,
> (http://www.edsonmarine.com/sailboat/pdf/K29_20_21.pdf) which is basically
> conduit-covered cables. In their Infinite Wisdom, Catalina used these
> conduits to turn some mighty tight corners, as well as swapping sides so
> the boat steers in the proper direction. (even though Edson clearly says:
> "Conduit should have no 90 degree bends...")
>
>    So, after 20 years of Hard Labour, the conduit finally failed.
>
>    One comment on cable steering as opposed to hydraulic: it failed
> (completely) as I was trying to turn Far Cove around in a tight marina,
> swinging the wheel lock-to-lock as I alternated between reverse and a
> blast of fwd to conteract the prop-walk (and wind). Even though it had
> failed, I STILL was able to steer the boat adequately to get it into the
> slip. I suspect that a failure in a hydraulic system would mean a COMPLETE
> failure (ie no steering possible at all).
>
>    So, if you have a Catalina, CHECK THE STEERING! If you have the
> Pull-pull system and the conduit is used to turn 90 degrees, consider
> replacing it with proper shivs. And make sure you know where your
> emergency tiller is ;)
>
> Lloyd Sumpter
> "Far Cove" Catalina 36
>

Yes, that's OB cable steering, where the cable is under tension. Edson
(and other) wheel steering isn't like that. Cable breaks => wheel no
longer turns rudder (boat wanders...). Not that a hard turn on a sailboat
running at 6 knots would throw out the passengers...

   I was told OB, tension-style cable steering was now "illegal".

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36


On Fri, 13 Sep 2002 13:47:03 -0700, Bill Sc wrote:



> I investigated an accident about two years ago where an 18 ft. outboard
> boat had a complete steering failure at high speed.  The engine went
> hard over into a starboard turn.  Flipped both occupants out the port
> side.  One or both hit the windshield on the way out.  The owner drowned
> and the passenger got a broken arm.
> 
> 
> 
> "Lloyd Sumpter" <lsumpter@shaw.ca> wrote in message
> news:pan.2002.09.13.17.50.59.415798.26951@shaw.ca...
>> Hi,
>>
>>    Well, after a year of sounding funny and being hard to steer, the
>> steering finally broke altogether on Far Cove. I'd been meaning to
>> replace the enclosed cable unit for a year now, but never got around to
>> it...
>>
>>    In a way, it was Good News/Bad News. The Bad News was that the
>> steering broke, the Good News is that the grinding was not the rudder
>> or rudder post.
>>
>>    Wheel steering on a Catalina 36 is done by Edson's Pull-Pull system,
>> (http://www.edsonmarine.com/sailboat/pdf/K29_20_21.pdf) which is
>> basically conduit-covered cables. In their Infinite Wisdom, Catalina
>> used these conduits to turn some mighty tight corners, as well as
>> swapping sides so the boat steers in the proper direction. (even though
>> Edson clearly says: "Conduit should have no 90 degree bends...")
>>
>>    So, after 20 years of Hard Labour, the conduit finally failed.
>>
>>    One comment on cable steering as opposed to hydraulic: it failed
>> (completely) as I was trying to turn Far Cove around in a tight marina,
>> swinging the wheel lock-to-lock as I alternated between reverse and a
>> blast of fwd to conteract the prop-walk (and wind). Even though it had
>> failed, I STILL was able to steer the boat adequately to get it into
>> the slip. I suspect that a failure in a hydraulic system would mean a
>> COMPLETE failure (ie no steering possible at all).
>>
>>    So, if you have a Catalina, CHECK THE STEERING! If you have the
>> Pull-pull system and the conduit is used to turn 90 degrees, consider
>> replacing it with proper shivs. And make sure you know where your
>> emergency tiller is ;)
>>
>> Lloyd Sumpter
>> "Far Cove" Catalina 36
>>
>>

Hydraulics CAN fail suddenly, as in a broken hose, but when the seals
go it is kind of a gradual process.

That's right Joe.  Our steering went instantly when the line in the bowels
of the bilge split.  We could have made a temporary repair which we
eventually did (duct tape and a radiator hose clamp)  but it took two hours
of calm  port time removing stuff to find where the leak was.


"Joe Della Barba N3HGB" <spam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:3d826fd0.2082070378@news.toad.net...
> Hydraulics CAN fail suddenly, as in a broken hose, but when the seals
> go it is kind of a gradual process.