🚀 go-pugleaf

>In article <1554@redsox.bsw.com> campbell@redsox.bsw.com (Larry Campbell) writ
>>In article <sa0KhqO00Uh7M2R25C@andrew.cmu.edu> bas+@andrew.cmu.edu (Bruce...
>>-The analogy with audio is that a CD with frequency response out to 10
>>-MHz would not sound better than one with frequency response out to 20
>>-KHz, because the human ear can't hear the higher frequencies.
>>
>>Speak for yourself.  Perhaps the *average* human ear can't hear higher
>>than 20 KHz, but some can.  I don't know what frequency they are, but
>>CDs would have been nice if they had a decent high frequency rolloff; but if
>>I A/B an LP and a CD it is clear that the CD has cut off the higher
>>frequencies.
>>
>>Anyone know if DAT will have a better high end than CDs (presumably this
>>depends almost entirely on its sampling rate)?

1. If you were to do a FFT or detailed signal analysis of LP's VS CD's you
   would discover that LP's may/can/do sound 'brighter' in some circumstances.
   a. The 'label' re-eq'ed the lp pseudo master to create a cd master.
      (This is the worst, & especially a problem with older stuff that the
      un-mixed masters are a memory, especially from smaller labels.)
   b. The extra LP high frequency 'response' is noise.  It is nearly random
      and is/was (usually) NOT intended as a part of the audio program.
      (some high end cd players allow you to add desired pseudo noise to
      recreate this effect, they add a funny name but all they do is create
      frequency modulated noise using the actual signal as a base freq multip.

2. Human freq response is typically about 22Khz for 30Db roll off for a 20
   year old male.  This average changes to about 20Khz & 40Db by age 40.
   I can still personally hear out to 24Khz at 20Db, but also can hear it
   dropping over the last several years.  I quite sure that human recorded max
   was 28Khz & 15 Db.  Usually what we hear loudly from ultra sonic devices
    are harmonics, USUALLY.

3. If you think CD's are bad, DAT has a 45DB NOTCH cut in it at 15KHZ, that is
   about 1K wide above 3DB.  I find this offensive cut worse than anything
   cd's could do.  Besides, as in 1a 1b, they will sound the same because the
   lp noise isn;t there, & the bad eq's stuff should be all gone by the time
   it really hits these shores, but don't count on either.

4. If the cd's sound so bad for top freq, you could also be hearing a junk
    cd player.

5. If played a analog or digital, digitizing ratethat of cd or above, & given
    pictures of 3 waveforms, which you are listening to: The waveform type is
    listened to & 'taught' at a low freq, 10K or below.  Then again at 18 or 20
    & amplified to correct for tested subject rolloff, the resulting type
    selection rolls off from a average around 95% to 5%.  Basically random
    chance.  Therefore, audibly; the method by which CD's recreate higher
         frequency waveforms, does not make any measurable difference.
    I agree, the sampling rate should have been higher & given today technology
    would/could be.  But, consider the following, if the same were said of
    LP technology, we would just be switching from 78's to laser read 8"
    analog 100 minute disks.  Can you imagine your or any real stereo today,
    which 78's are just ending as the 'standard' media ?  A standard media
    (any) has to make tradeoffs for the current affordable technology when
    the standard 'goes public'.  It also has to make tradeoffs that can be sold
    to the market, packaged,.....

Further, I believe that amyone that thinks lp's as a 'standard' will outlast
CD's is in a dream world.  DAT isn't the thing that will do it, and TOO much
money has been gambled on it for something else to come along in time to 
kill of cd's soon, (IF even that is possible now, but.....).  DAT's are one
sided, so rewinding will return as a major Pain in the A.  Then we consider
tape damage & wear.  Up north & down south temperature is a major source of
tape death in the car.  I would never consider putting a 12-15 $ abrasive
original in such a environment.  Then we consider getting dubbing decks for
DAT's & the installed cassette car base.  I believe that recording CD's will
stamp out any chance that DAT may have, even for the audiofile.  For most of
us, DBX, dolby C, & metal tape would be sufficient.  Too bad the early DBX
system flaw(s) weren't fixed & accepted by the public at large.
al