🚀 go-pugleaf

In <58fcr0$953@news.ycc.yale.edu> Cluster User wrote:

> some comments about the turkish:
> sakIn (should be sakin - sa:kin), sahra, tekmil ciltlemek
> (from cilt - j^ild), kuvvet (from quwwa(t), however turkish
> kol - qol is relevant) are loanwords from arabic. nam,
> huysuzluk (from huy , xu:y) are loanwrods from persian.
> for ol- (to become, be) most turkic languages have bol-
> for o"ksu"rmek - o"g~u"rmek (to retch, vomit) would be more
> relevant. s^olpan is qIrgIz, but old turkish has c^olpan,
> for elma many dialects of turkish have alma.

Since this is still going around, I decided to try
making some corrections and offer some alternates,
replacements or what I thought to be better matches
myself...

But first I would like to make a point about the
above comments... The first word list had alrady
indicated "s^olpan" as "Kyrgyz Turk", what is the
point in reiterating it as "qIrgIz vs. old turkish"?

"Turkish" examples in the original list inluded
words from Anatolian Turkish, Old Turkish, Kirgiz
Turkish, Osmanli Turkish, Saka Turkish, Uygur Turkish,
Sakha Turkish, Teleut Turkish... Thus it was clear
that those examples represented the Turkish branch
(what came to be called Turkic branch) of Altaic
languages...

The original writer must have felt a certain need
to put the word "Turk" next to "Kyrgyz", in order
to keep it clear to the ones who may not know it,
that "Kirgiz" is a Turkish/Turkic language...

What exactly is your purpose to say "s^olpan is
qIrgIz, but old turkish has c^olpan"...? Are you
trying to drive the wedge (which seems to have been
intentionally created by the usage of the word
"Turkic" instead of "Turkish") deeper between Kirgiz
and other Turkish/Turkic languages...?

Anyway, since I don't know the other languages in
the list and wanted to keep this posting fron getting
too long, I limited my comments to similarities
between Sumerian and Turkish only... I would welcome
and appreciate any comments or corrections to mine...

>Sumerian:       bur 411,104 (to drill, to riddle with holes)
>Turkish:        burmak (to drill - verb)

    Comment:     The verb is "bur", no need for participle form
                 "burmak", without it the similarity is more clear

>Sumerian:       bar 74, 68/302 (family, village)
>Old Turkish:    balIq (city)

    Addition:    bag~rak (family, clan)

>Sumerian:       bur3 411,32 (livestock, four-legged animal, cow)
>Osmanli Turk:   buza�I (two year-old livestock) 

    Comment:     buzag~I is the alternate [correct?] spelling
    Addition:    bur�in (doe - female deer)
                 bug~ra, bug~u (camel)

>Sumerian:       bad 69,100 (to fall apart, to be fallen)
>Turkish:        patla (to burst)

    Addition:    bat (to sink, to collapse, to perish)

>Sumerian:       bad 152 8,4 (wall, stuffing)
>Kyrgyz Turk:    bit� (it closes away - pertaining to arrows?)

>Sumerian:       gab 167,55/57a (to grasp, to get, to catch)
>Turkish:        kap (pot - recepticle, something that catches)

    Addition:    kab (verb: to catch, to grab, to snatch)

>Sumerian:       ab(-ba) 128,13a (father)
>Turkish:        aba (father)

>Sumerian:       s^ub 68,9 (to flatten)
>Sakha Turk:     s�bird�x (page, leaf)

>Sumerian:       gab 167,56 (copy, picture, duplicate)
>Turkish:        k�p (picture in dialect)

>Sumerian:       gib-i/=gig/446,3/4 (be sick, pain, illness)
>Turkish:        gebermek (to pass away)

    Addition:    kebe (to swell, [from which --> gebe-rmek])

>Sumerian:       gir11 152,19 (to stretch)
>Turkish:        germek (to tighten)

    Correction:  ger (means to stretch, rather than tighten)
    Addition:    kirti (wooden bridge)

>Sumerian:       sig 592, 10ff (tight, narrow)
>Turkish:        sIkI (tight)

    Addition:    sIg~ (to fit in a tight space, to shrink)
                 sIk  (to tighten, to press)

>Sumerian:       gig 456,43 (hatred, to hate)
>Old Turkish:    k�k (")

>Sumerian:       s^ag5 356,5/7 (be healthy, good, goodness, nice)
>Turkish:        sag^ (healthy)

>Sumerian:       sig7 351,6 (to live, to sit)
>Turkish:        sakIn (inhabitant)

    Correction:  this is a borrow word, not a Turkish one
    Addition:    sIg~  (to take shelter in)

>Sumerian:       gis^ 296,10 (man, master, sir, gentleman)
>Old Turkish:    iy� (gentleman)

    Addition:    ki$i (person)

>Sumerian:       gal2 80,3 (to be)
>Turkish:        ol- (it is, it will be, it happens)

    Addition:    kal (to continue existance, to remain)

>Sumerian:       gur4 483,23 (to run, to flee)
>Turkish:        kuriye (fast movement?)

    Question:    can this be verified as a Turkish word?
    Addition:    kur ([+tul] to escape, to free onself from)
                 yu"ru" (to walk)

>Sumerian:       zag 332,43 (flatland, field)
>Turkish:        sahra- (steppe, land, plateau)

    Correction:  this is a borrow word, not a Turkish one
    Addition:    saya (pasture, field)

>Sumerian:       dug3 396,10/11 (good, healthy, optimal)
>Turkish:        tekmil (completion)

    Correction:  this is a borrow word, not a Turkish one
    Addition:    dog~ (to be born, to rise)
                 dog~+ru (straight, right, true, good)
                 dog~+ruk (zenith, highest point)
                 du"g~ (to close, to celebrate)
                 tu"k (whole, hair, feather)

>Sumerian:       dah 169,3/10 (one follows, by someone)
>Sakha Turk:     do�or (member, partner)

    Addition:    tak ([<-- dak?] append, follow)

>Sumerian:       kud 12,19 (city, hamlet)
>Old Turkish:    qadas^ (relative, relation, troop, brother)
                 
>Sumerian:       kad4 (to bind)
>Turkish:        kat- (weave)

    Addition:    kat  (to add, to harden)

>Sumerian:       bad3 152^8,7 (deathly ill, sickly)
>Old Turkish:    bed- (it weakens)

>Sumerian:       pa 295,11 (summit, peak)
>Turkish:        bas, (head)

>Sumerian:       bu 371,25 (to blow)
>Turkish:        p�fle- (")

    Addition:    bag~Ir (chest, lungs, to yell)
                 bog~anak (wind)

>Sumerian:       zub 60^x,4 (to flow, rain)
>Uigur Turk:     c^ip-c^ip (onomatopaeia of dripping water - "drip-drip")

    Addition:    suv (water)

>Sumerian:       ki 461,21 (who)
>Turkish:        ki (")

>Sumerian:       kur2 60,34 (circle)
>Turkish:        k�resel (spherical)

    Correction:  this is a borrow word, not a Turkish one

>Sumerian:       kas^ 211a,2 (urine)
>Turkish:        huysuzluk (bile)
>Old Turkish:    qas^an- (be urinating)

    Correction:  "huysuzluk" is a borrow word, not a Turkish one
    Comment:     ka$an - current spelling in Turkish

>Sumerian:       kud 536,4 (to throw, to place, to allow)
>Turkish:        koy- (")

>Sumerian:       s^ita 233,15/442,2 (to bind)
>Turkish:        ciltlemek (to bind)

    Correction:  this is a borrow word, not a Turkish one
    Addition:    �it (to bind, to join, to get entangled)

>Sumerian:       has^ 12,78 (be bending)
>Turkish:        kayma� (slant-eyed)

    Addition:    ka$ (eyebrow, arch)

>Sumerian:       hir 401,9 (picture)
>Turkish:        kertik (notch, gash, score)

>Sumerian:       has^ 12,70/73 (to cut, to split)
>Turkish:        kesmek (to cut)

>Sumerian:       uh 398,6/17 (to spew, to vomit)
>Turkish:        �ks�rmek (to cough)

    Addition:    o"g~+urmek (to make vomiting noise)
                 aksIr+mak (to sneeze)

>Sumerian:       sil(a) 12,117 (to split, to cut up)
>Teleut Turk:    s^IlI (it cuts)

>Sumerian:       sig 592,10/19 (small, little)
>Turkish:        -�ak (diminutive suffix)

>Sumerian:       sag2 295,100a (to strike, to hit)
>Turkish:        �arpmak (to strike)

>Sumerian:       hus 565,58 (to drive)
>Osmanli Turk:   qos^u (wagon, coach)

    Addition:    ko$ (the verb means: to hitch, to ride, to run)

>Sumerian:       s^ag 384,118/9 (to sigh, a sigh)
>Teleut Turk:    s�zI- (")

    Addition:    sag~u (wail, lament)

>Sumerian:       s^ag 384,2 (word)
>Turkish:        s�v (")

>Sumerian:       s^e 367,58d (to eat)
>Turkish:        yemek (to eat)

    Comment:     The verb is "ye", no need for participle form

>Sumerian:       s^ug 367,11/2 (big, be big, much)
>Turkish:        �ok (lots)

    Addition:    �Ig~ (avalanche)
                 �Ig~Il (a big crowd)

>Sumerian:       s^eg8 551,4 (frost, ice, cold)
>Turkish:        sog^ut (cold)

    Addition:    �ig~ (frost, dew)

>Sumerian:       us^ 4 536,26 (mind, intellect)
>Turkish:        us (intelligence)

>Sumerian:       as^ 2 339,8 (to long for, to want)
>Turkish:        istemek (to want, to desire)

>Sumerian:       gis^ 296,16 (hand)
>Turkish:        kuuvet (strength, power)

    Correction:  this is a borrow word, not a Turkish one
    Addition:    karI$ (span of a flat/open hand)

>Sumerian:       zal 231,16 (also: sal, s^al) (to see) 
                 ?????

>Sumerian:       zal(ag) 393,5 (be lighted, star, to shine)
>Kyrgyz Turk:    s^olpan (Morning Star, Venus)

    Addition:    yal (flame, shine, light)
                 I$Il (shine, light)

>Sumerian:       zir 84,108 (suffering, hurt)
>Turkish:        sIzI (ache, pain)

>Sumerian:       izi 172,11/17/13 (fire, oven, ash, to flame up)
>Kyrgyz Turk:    issyk (warm)

    Addition:    IsI   (heat)
                 is    (soot)
                 issi  (suffocating heat, scorching hot)

>Sumerian:       izi 172.159 (sour)
>Turkish:        eks,i (")

    Addition:    yig~si (unplesant smell)

>Sumerian:       zig 84,45 (to raise oneself, to get oneself up)
>Turkish:        �Ikmak (to go out, to move out, to graduate)

    Addition:    �Ik (to climb)

>Sumerian:       ri 86,41,74 (to fly)
>Kyrgyz Turk:    erb�ng (unsupportable, cannot stand up)

>Sumerian:       sir3 152,3(also: sur, s^ar, sing, song, compose music)
>Turkish:        s,arkI (song)

    Comment:     I don't believe this is a Turkish word
    Addition:    �Ig~Ir / �ag~Ir (to call, to sing)

>Sumerian:       er 50,7 (also: ir, ur) (man, manly)
>Turkish:        er (man, male)

>Sumerian:       bar 74,100 (to frighten oneself, to scare)
>Turkish:        perva (")

    Correction:  can this be verified as a Turkish word?

>Sumerian:       ur2 203,7 (underground, ground)
>Turkish:        alt (bottom)

    Addition:    ura (easily tilled soil)
                 yer (ground)

>Sumerian:       ma 342,98b/10 (also: ma-da) (land, earth, homeland)
>Uigur Turk:     budun (folk, people)

>Sumerian:       ma 233,2 (to go)
>Old Turkish:    man- (")

>Sumerian:       ma3 233,3a (I)
>Turkish:        ben (I)

>Sumerian:       eme 237,2 (also: ama) (mother)
>Turkish:        ana (mother) emcik (nipple) emmek (to suck)

    Addition:    eme (aunt)

>Sumerian:       gam 362,6 (it bends over)
>Turkish:        kemer (arch, vault)

>Sumerian:       na 97,4 (be named, call)
>Turkish:        nam (")

    Possible??:  an  (to call, to be called, to recall/remember)

>Finnish:        omen (apple)
>Turkish:        elma (")

    Comment:     alma (apple, older/alternate spelling)

>Sumerian:       du3 230,19 (known, experienced, knowledge)
>Turkish:        tanImak (to know)

    Comment:     dan (to find, to know [older spelling])
    Addition:    duy (to hear, to sense, to feel)
                 du"$ (to think, to dream)
------------------------------------------
MK