Article View: sci.physics.relativity
Article #756Re: SAVING SCIENCE? (Open Letter to the Royal Society)
From: Pentcho Valev
Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 09:50
Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 09:50
202 lines
12823 bytes
12823 bytes
http://www.ens-newswire.com/ens/feb2010/2010-02-20-01.html Lord Martin Rees: "It is important that people have the utmost confidence in the science of climate change." Is it equally important that people have the utmost confidence in today's cosmology, Dr. Rees? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/6057362/Give-scientists-the-freedom-to-be-wrong.html Lord Martin Rees: "Over the past week, two stories in the press have suggested that scientists have been very wrong about some very big issues. First, a new paper seemed to suggest that dark energy the mysterious force that makes up three quarters of the universe, and is pushing the galaxies further apart might not even exist." Should people have the utmost confidence in your claim that "time dilation entails no inconsistency or paradox", Dr. Rees? http://www.firstscience.com/site/articles/blackholes.asp Lord Martin Rees: "According to Einstein, the speed of a clock depends on where you are and how you're moving. If your subjective clock ran very slowly compared to the cosmic clock, you could travel "fast forward" into the future. This would happen if you were moving at a velocity close to the speed of light. Furthermore, strong gravity would distort time; clocks on a neutron star would run 20 or 30 percent slower. (...) This elasticity in the rate of passage of time may seem counter to our intuition. But such intuition is acquired from our everyday environment (and perhaps, even more, that of our remote ancestors), which has offered us no experience of such effects. Few of us have travelled faster than a millionth of the speed of light (the speed of a jet airliner); we live on a planet where the pull of gravity is 1000 billion times weaker than on a neutron star. But time dilation entails no inconsistency or paradox." Pentcho Valev wrote: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthnews/7197787/Lords-fear-public-is-losing-confidence-in-climate-change-science.html "Fifteen Lords, including the former head of BP Lord Browne of Madingley and the current President of the Royal Society Lord Rees of Ludlow, are concerned the public is losing confidence in the science after the so-called 'glaciergate' and 'climategate' scandals." Dr. Rees, 9 years ago you were concerned about relativity-gate. More precisely, you declared that "among the ideas facing revision is Einstein's belief that the speed of light must always be the same": http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/519406/posts "A GROUP of astronomers and cosmologists has warned that the laws thought to govern the universe, including Albert Einstein's theory of relativity, must be rewritten. The group, which includes Professor Stephen Hawking and Sir Martin Rees, the astronomer royal, say such laws may only work for our universe but not in others that are now also thought to exist. "It is becoming increasingly likely that the rules we had thought were fundamental through time and space are actually just bylaws for our bit of it," said Rees, whose new book, Our Cosmic Habitat, is published next month. "Creation is emerging as even stranger than we thought." Among the ideas facing revision is Einstein's belief that the speed of light must always be the same - 186,000 miles a second in a vacuum. There is growing evidence that light moved much faster during the early stages of our universe. Rees, Hawking and others are so concerned at the impact of such ideas that they recently organised a private conference in Cambridge for more than 30 leading cosmologists." I think relativity-gate is much more fundamental than glacier-gate and climate-gate so you may wish to return to your 9-years old concern. This will help: http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2005/apr/17/spaceexploration.comment "And on 6 November, 1919, at a Royal Society meeting, the astronomer Sir Arthur Eddington revealed that observations, taken during a solar eclipse, showed that starlight was being deflected by the sun's gravitational field in a way that fitted Einstein's General Theory of Relativity. 'Revolution in science. New theory of the Universe. Newtonian ideas overthrown,' the Times announced the next day on its front page. Einstein became a global superstar - thanks to the Royal Society." http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg16321935.300-ode-to-albert.html New Scientist: Ode to Albert "Enter another piece of luck for Einstein. We now know that the light- bending effect was actually too small for Eddington to have discerned at that time. Had Eddington not been so receptive to Einstein's theory, he might not have reached such strong conclusions so soon, and the world would have had to wait for more accurate eclipse measurements to confirm general relativity." http://www.amazon.com/Brief-History-Time-Stephen-Hawking/dp/0553380168 Stephen Hawking: "Einsteins prediction of light deflection could not be tested immediately in 1915, because the First World War was in progress, and it was not until 1919 that a British expedition, observing an eclipse from West Africa, showed that light was indeed deflected by the sun, just as predicted by the theory. This proof of a German theory by British scientists was hailed as a great act of reconciliation between the two countries after the war. It is ionic, therefore, that later examination of the photographs taken on that expedition showed the errors were as great as the effect they were trying to measure. Their measurement had been sheer luck ["sheere luck" is a euphemism for "sheer fraud"], or a case of knowing the result they wanted to get, not an uncommon occurrence in science." http://discovermagazine.com/2008/mar/20-things-you-didn.t-know-about-relativity "The eclipse experiment finally happened in 1919 (youre looking at it on this very page). Eminent British physicist Arthur Eddington declared general relativity a success, catapulting Einstein into fame and onto coffee mugs. In retrospect, it seems that Eddington fudged the results, throwing out photos that showed the wrong outcome. No wonder nobody noticed: At the time of Einsteins death in 1955, scientists still had almost no evidence of general relativity in action." http://www.upd.aas.org/had/meetings/2010Abstracts.html Open Questions Regarding the 1925 Measurement of the Gravitational Redshift of Sirius B Jay B. Holberg Univ. of Arizona. "In January 1924 Arthur Eddington wrote to Walter S. Adams at the Mt. Wilson Observatory suggesting a measurement of the Einstein shift in Sirius B and providing an estimate of its magnitude. Adams 1925 published results agreed remarkably well with Eddingtons estimate. Initially this achievement was hailed as the third empirical test of General Relativity (after Mercurys anomalous perihelion advance and the 1919 measurement of the deflection of starlight). It has been known for some time that both Eddingtons estimate and Adams measurement underestimated the true Sirius B gravitational redshift by a factor of four." http://alasource.blogs.nouvelobs.com/archive/2009/01/26/l-erreur-d-einstein-la-deuxieme.html "D'abord il [Einstein] fait une hypothèse fausse (facile à dire aujourd'hui !) dans son équation de départ qui décrit les relations étroites entre géométrie de l'espace et contenu de matière de cet espace. Avec cette hypothèse il tente de calculer l'avance du périhélie de Mercure. Cette petite anomalie (à l'époque) du mouvement de la planète était un mystère. Einstein et Besso aboutissent finalement sur un nombre aberrant et s'aperçoivent qu'en fait le résultat est cent fois trop grand à cause d'une erreur dans la masse du soleil... Mais, même corrigé, le résultat reste loin des observations. Pourtant le physicien ne rejeta pas son idée. "Nous voyons là que si les critères de Popper étaient toujours respectés, la théorie aurait dû être abandonnée", constate, ironique, Etienne Klein. Un coup de main d'un autre ami, Grossmann, sortira Einstein de la difficulté et sa nouvelle équation s'avéra bonne. En quelques jours, il trouve la bonne réponse pour l'avance du périhélie de Mercure..." http://astronomy.ifrance.com/pages/gdes_theories/einstein.html "Le deuxième test classique donne en revanche des inquiétudes. Historiquement, pourtant, l'explication de l'avance du périhélie de Mercure, proposé par Einstein lui-même, donna ses lettres de noblesse à la relativité générale. Il s'agissait de comprendra pourquoi le périhélie de Mercure ( le point de son orbite le plus proche du soleil ) se déplaçait de 574 s d'arc par siècle. Certes, sur ces 574 s, 531 s'expliquaient par les perturbations gravitationnels dues aux autres planètes. Mais restait 43 s, le fameux effet "périhélique " inexpliqué par les lois de Newton. Le calcul relativiste d'Einstein donna 42,98 s ! L'accord et si parfait qu'il ne laisse la place à aucune discussion. Or depuis 1966, le soleil est soupçonné ne pas être rigoureusement sphérique mais légèrement aplati à l'équateur. Une très légère dissymétries qui suffirait à faire avancer le périhélie de quelques secondes d'arc. Du coup, la preuve se transformerait en réfutation puisque les 42,88 s du calcul d'Einstein ne pourrait pas expliquer le mouvement réel de Mercure." http://astronomy.ifrance.com/pages/gdes_theories/einstein.html "Arthur Eddington , le premier en 1924, calculâtes théoriquement un décalage 0,007% attendu la surface de Sirius mais avec des données fausses à l'époque sur la masse et le rayon de l'étoile. L'année suivante, Walter Adams mesurerait exactement ces 0.007%. Il s'avère aujourd'hui que ces mesures , qui constituèrent pendant quarante ans une "preuves" de la relativité, étaient largement "arrangée" tant était grand le désir de vérifier la théorie d'Enstein. La véritable valeur fut mesurée en 1965. Elle est de 0.03% car Sirius est plus petite , et sont champ de gravitation est plus fort que ne le pensait Eddington." http://www.cieletespace.fr/evenement/relativit-les-preuves-taient-fausses RELATIVITE: LES PREUVES ETAIENT FAUSSES "Le monde entier a cru pendant plus de cinquante ans à une théorie non vérifiée. Car, nous le savons aujourd'hui, les premières preuves, issues notamment d'une célèbre éclipse de 1919, n'en étaient pas. Elles reposaient en partie sur des manipulations peu avouables visant à obtenir un résultat connu à l'avance, et sur des mesures entachées d'incertitudes, quand il ne s'agissait pas de fraudes caractérisées." http://www.cieletespaceradio.fr/index.php/2008/05/26/390-histoire-des-sciences-les-preuves-de-la-relativite "Au début du XXème siècle, des scientifiques comme le Britannique Arthur Eddington avaient tant à coeur de vérifier la théorie de la relativité qu'ils ont tout mis en oeuvre pour que leurs expériences soient probantes." (ECOUTEZ!) Pentcho Valev pvalev@yahoo.com
Technical Details
Message-ID:
<7ac34516-6513-4d20-8f1b-939f185a8d9c@g11g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>Path:
arc1-ca.pugleaf.net!g2news1.google.com!postnews.google.com!g11g2000yqe.googlegroups.com!not-for-mailReferences:
<bd63adab-75ee-450a-9abf-b7ca7227a0b3@k19g2000yqc.googlegroups.com> <99f970dd-c6cf-45b7-afe9-ae6117efe0e7@x1g2000prb.googlegroups.com> <hki1gr$bho$3@news.eternal-september.org> <089ba740-743b-4196-abf7-1d14b639c536@b10g2000yqa.googlegroups.com> <e82a9b5a-de54-4629-ab6c-ac21a3bc6464@g28g2000yqh.googlegroups.com> <e8d345ce-e448-4cea-b5b4-503825b71689@d37g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>Show Full Headers
Complete Article Headers
X-Google-Thread: 237b8ad48,d097d56aabe1cbca X-Google-Attributes: gid237b8ad48,public,usenet X-Google-NewGroupId: yes X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII Path: arc1-ca.pugleaf.net!g2news1.google.com!postnews.google.com!g11g2000yqe.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail From: Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> Newsgroups: sci.physics.relativity,sci.physics,fr.sci.physique,fr.sci.astrophysique Subject: Re: SAVING SCIENCE? (Open Letter to the Royal Society) Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 01:50:19 -0800 (PST) Organization: http://groups.google.com Lines: 202 Message-ID: <7ac34516-6513-4d20-8f1b-939f185a8d9c@g11g2000yqe.googlegroups.com> References: <bd63adab-75ee-450a-9abf-b7ca7227a0b3@k19g2000yqc.googlegroups.com> <99f970dd-c6cf-45b7-afe9-ae6117efe0e7@x1g2000prb.googlegroups.com> <hki1gr$bho$3@news.eternal-september.org> <089ba740-743b-4196-abf7-1d14b639c536@b10g2000yqa.googlegroups.com> <e82a9b5a-de54-4629-ab6c-ac21a3bc6464@g28g2000yqh.googlegroups.com> <e8d345ce-e448-4cea-b5b4-503825b71689@d37g2000yqa.googlegroups.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 89.215.201.40 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: posting.google.com 1266832219 27351 127.0.0.1 (22 Feb 2010 09:50:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 09:50:19 +0000 (UTC) Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com Injection-Info: g11g2000yqe.googlegroups.com; posting-host=89.215.201.40; posting-account=Lz-LbgoAAABPDavKeW-eYeobwLHD_cvQ User-Agent: G2/1.0 X-HTTP-UserAgent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 7.0; Windows NT 5.1; AskTB5.5),gzip(gfe),gzip(gfe)