🚀 go-pugleaf

rbwinn wrote:
> On Aug 2, 1:07�pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>> rbwinn wrote:
>>> On Aug 1, 11:54 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>> On Aug 1, 8:25 am, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>> On Jul 31, 6:11 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Jul 31, 5:45 am, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 30, 10:15 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 30, 6:13 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 30, 5:37 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 30, 3:13 am, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 22, 5:24 am, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 21, 8:39 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 21, 7:16 pm, "Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al)"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <alwh...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 21, 5:51 pm, rbwinn <rbwi...@juno.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 7:54 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 2:53 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 10:00 am, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 6:34 am, Stan-O <bndsna...@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 22:27:44 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...@juno.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No, a couple of atheists have told me that. ?They said he was a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Russian Orthodox and an alcoholic.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He was an alcoholic.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, you're making things up again.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hint: He was not a Christian merely because an atheist claimed he was...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hint #2: ?What school did Stalin go to in 1888?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin went to a Russian Orthodox seminary. ?He rejected what he was
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> taught there and became a mass murderer.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Only partially true. Like I told you before, politicians, and in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> particular tyrants, will say anything to gain or remain in power.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, Stalin did say he was an atheist. ?He told the truth about that.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He never openly admitted this. In fact, his religious beliefs were
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pretty vague. What he hated was the concept of god as presented by the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ROC. He did, however, find a political use for the church when it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suited his purpose.- Hide quoted text -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Show quoted text -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That is quite a statement. So you are saying that Stalin did not
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> believe in the Communist Manifesto?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tyrants will use or believe anything to maintain their control. He
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> probably found some parts useful, and ignored anything that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contradicted his personally ideologies...pretty much the same with you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and your bible...- Hide quoted text -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin tried to stamp out religion in the Soviet Union. It is well
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> documented.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And what's that got to do with atheism?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin was a prominent atheist of his time who is claimed to have been
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a Christian by atheists of today.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Don't change the subject. What has what Stalin tried to do relevant to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> atheism?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So what is the matter? Stalin and Pol Pot were atheists. They will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> never turn into Christians no matter how many times you try to claim
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Don't you atheists ever take responsibility for anything?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Because what they did is irrelevant to me? Now, back onto the question
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you are REFUSING to answer:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What has what Stalin tried to do ("tried to stamp out religion in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Soviet Union") relevant to atheism?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin was an atheist. His values and beliefs were much like yours
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are today.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Robert B. Winn
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Torquemada was a christian. His values and beliefs were much like
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> yours are today. And you're doing your best to make us all see the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> point of shooting christians. You really are.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Al- Hide quoted text -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, let's talk about those feelings, Al. Pol Pot was just an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> unassuming atheistic school teacher until he became a Communist
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dictator.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, really, aren't you talking about communism and totalitarianism?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What does atheism have to do with it?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Under World Communism one of the pre-requisites for being a dictator
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> was being an atheist.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Why?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Because Karl Marx said that religion was the opiate of the people.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And...?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Religious people were not allowed to be Communist dictators.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cite?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, just go ahead and list all of the Communist dictators who were
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Christians, Daniel.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thomas M ntzer, for starters.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have more, but I think even one example destroys your guess that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> religious people are not allowed to be communist dictators.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> By the way, check out this quote from tienne Cabet: "Communism is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Christianity... it is pure Christianity, before it was corrupted by
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Catholicism."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Never heard of Thomas Muntzer.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Then this is an opportunity for you to do research. Seek and ye shall find.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Etienne Cabet sent a colony to Nauvoo,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Illinois, to take over the houses left by members of the Church of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints who were driven from the city by
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mobs. The Communist colony failed.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Irrelevant.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, I do not think it was irrelevant.
>>>>>>>>>>>> It is irrelevant to whether Christians can be communist and whether
>>>>>>>>>>>> Christians can become communist dictators.
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> Well, it was not irrelevant at the time, just as it is not irrelevant
>>>>>>>>>>> now whether independent voters are allowed to run for office in this
>>>>>>>>>>> country.
>>>>>>>>>> Um, what?
>>>>>>>>> Since the election of 1800 political party politicians have passed
>>>>>>>>> laws at state level designed to keep independent voters from running
>>>>>>>>> for public office.
>>>>>>>> What has that got to do with Christian Communistic Dictators?
>>>>>>>> (And independent voters can't run for public office?! WHAT?!)
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Political party politicians are passing laws as we speak to prevent
>>>>>>> independent voters from running for office. In Arizona, the state
>>>>>>> where I live, an independent voter is required to obtain about 20,000
>>>>>>> nomination petition signatures to appear on the ballot for the same
>>>>>>> office a major party candidate is required to obtain 3,000 signatures
>>>>>>> to appear on the ballot.
>>>>>>> States like Alabama, Oregon, and Pennsylvania have been passing
>>>>>>> similar laws designed to insure that independent voters cannot compete
>>>>>>> with party candidates for ballot access.
>>>>>> So, you lied when you said that independent voters were denied from
>>>>>> running for public office.
>>>>> Independent voters are denied from running for public office, and have
>>>>> been denied from running for public office since the election of 1800.
>>>> So, all I need to do is to show one independent voter that did run for
>>>> public office and your claim will be demolished, right?
>>>> Karen M. Hartley-Nagle (Independent) ran for public office in 2006.
>>>> Now what do you have to say for yourself?
>>> Are you sure that Karen M. Hartley-Nagle was an independent voter?
>> In 2006, she was.
>>
>>> Most people who run for office as independent candidates are maverick
>>> party candidates, like Joseph Lieberman just did in Connecticutt.
>> But they don't have to be. �All they have to do is to register as an
>> independent.
>>
>> Bernie Sanders (I-VT) is actually IN CONGRESS RIGHT NOW!
>>
>>> Most independent voters do not have the means to meet the requirements
>>> for ballot access that party politicians have imposed.
>> Most PEOPLE do not have the means to meet the requirements for ballot
>> access that the party politicians have imposed.
> 
> 
> Well, I am sure that you Europeans are very impressed by that, but we
> Americans would like to have our own system of elections in effect.
> Democrats and Republicans see the voters as their personal property
> the same way Nazi party members saw the people of Germany as their
> personal property before World War II.

I notice you TOTALLY ignored the demolition of your claim.

-- 
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*          DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226          *
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* Can God create a Thai dish so spicy that even He *
* can't eat it?                                    *
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