Article View: sci.physics
Article #13656Re: Does God need to prove He exists?
From: rbwinn
Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 12:25
Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 12:25
47 lines
4470 bytes
4470 bytes
On Jul 8, 1:46�am, The Loan Arranger <no...@nowhere.invalid> wrote: > Ben Dolan wrote: > > rbwinn <rbwi...@juno.com> wrote: > > >>>> According to scripture unless a prayer is asked in faith it will not > >>>> be answered. > >>>> Robert B. Winn > >>> And according to empirical evidence, a prayer asked in faith will not be > >>> answered either. > >> What do you call empirical evidence? > >> Robert B. Winn > > > You hang out in physics newsgroups and you don't know what empirical > > evidence is? I'm talking about peer reviewed, double-blind studies on > > the efficacy--or more precisely, the complete lack of efficacy--of > > prayer. > > I hate to mention it, but have you read `The Efficacy of "Distant > Healing"' (Annals of Internal Medicine, 2000, 132/11 pp.903-910)? > > It was a study of peer-reviewed studies (mostly double-blind) into a > range of healing methods, including "healing touch" and intercessionary > prayer. Although it ruled that a number of the trials suffered from poor > protocols or inherent bias, it did conclude that a majority showed > statistically significant treatment effects, including trials considered > well structured and conducted. > > The article had a good range of grant fundings, including the Wellcome > Trust, the �National Center for Complementary and Alternative Medicine > and the National Institutes of Health. > > One of the more interesting conclusions, by the way, is that although > Christian prayer appeared somewhat efficacious, a number of other > methods, some Pagan, some atheist (in the sense of having no worship > element), worked equally well or better. > > TLA Well, if you have to study it, then you do not have faith. How do you get that Christian prayer appears somewhat efficacious when God already said he is not going to answer any prayers made without faith? Are you sure that Satan is not leading you to your conclusion? I believe God when he says he is not going to answer this kind of prayer. Robert B. Winn
Technical Details
Message-ID:
<1cda2526-7cb6-4135-9d03-6147d0671e0e@34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>Path:
arc1-ca.pugleaf.net!g2news1.google.com!postnews.google.com!34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com!not-for-mailReferences:
<6d59jgFusohU4@mid.individual.net> <j06s64huujceqj25r4v5hpd2ns0jctqdq7@4ax.com> <1edcc73f-c01c-4bde-9b08-51aa68b4edb8@2g2000hsn.googlegroups.com> <6d71u9F16r8aU1@mid.individual.net> <62956527-c824-415d-93ab-cdbf47127a02@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com> <6d929uF1ekcbU1@mid.individual.net> <e765a085-e079-4808-aa79-7244fc499d79@25g2000hsx.googlegroups.com> <48707b88$1@clear.net.nz> <07ba26ef-7fc8-444a-b573-c16966a1cd4e@d45g2000hsc.googlegroups.com> <48713636$1@clear.net.nz> <54c66300-0456-4c7f-868d-c7eb35e2dd45@a1g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> <48715d61$1@clear.net.nz> <fd2a7d5b-9b62-44f4-95f8-e0c3965357ee@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> <1ijp85w.11e8xgg1ioa3eN%ben_dolan_III@reet.com> <d0d95a9c-7f65-47e4-85f5-bbfeb18f8b35@34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> <1ijqb6d.11heufq1t49cszN%ben_dolan_III@reet.com> <jcedncBkNazwtO7VRVnyiwA@bt.com>Show Full Headers
Complete Article Headers
X-Google-Thread: 10b271,d932fee6d9806ab9 X-Google-Thread: 102f53,dac8026861d35fee X-Google-Thread: f442a,d932fee6d9806ab9 X-Google-Thread: 116469,d932fee6d9806ab9 X-Google-Attributes: gid10b271,gid102f53,gidf442a,gid116469,domainid0,public,usenet X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,UTF8 Path: arc1-ca.pugleaf.net!g2news1.google.com!postnews.google.com!34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail From: rbwinn <rbwinn3@juno.com> Newsgroups: sci.physics,cam.misc,alt.sci.physics,alt.atheism Subject: Re: Does God need to prove He exists? Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 05:25:21 -0700 (PDT) Organization: http://groups.google.com Lines: 47 Message-ID: <1cda2526-7cb6-4135-9d03-6147d0671e0e@34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com> References: <6d59jgFusohU4@mid.individual.net> <j06s64huujceqj25r4v5hpd2ns0jctqdq7@4ax.com> <1edcc73f-c01c-4bde-9b08-51aa68b4edb8@2g2000hsn.googlegroups.com> <6d71u9F16r8aU1@mid.individual.net> <62956527-c824-415d-93ab-cdbf47127a02@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com> <6d929uF1ekcbU1@mid.individual.net> <e765a085-e079-4808-aa79-7244fc499d79@25g2000hsx.googlegroups.com> <48707b88$1@clear.net.nz> <07ba26ef-7fc8-444a-b573-c16966a1cd4e@d45g2000hsc.googlegroups.com> <48713636$1@clear.net.nz> <54c66300-0456-4c7f-868d-c7eb35e2dd45@a1g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> <48715d61$1@clear.net.nz> <fd2a7d5b-9b62-44f4-95f8-e0c3965357ee@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> <1ijp85w.11e8xgg1ioa3eN%ben_dolan_III@reet.com> <d0d95a9c-7f65-47e4-85f5-bbfeb18f8b35@34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> <1ijqb6d.11heufq1t49cszN%ben_dolan_III@reet.com> <jcedncBkNazwtO7VRVnyiwA@bt.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.188.117.9 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: posting.google.com 1215606321 19771 127.0.0.1 (9 Jul 2008 12:25:21 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 12:25:21 +0000 (UTC) Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com Injection-Info: 34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com; posting-host=205.188.117.9; posting-account=i6vpvwoAAABRbNds_JrzhNT-NaeHIrDG User-Agent: G2/1.0 X-HTTP-UserAgent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 7.0; AOL 9.0; Windows NT 5.1; .NET CLR 1.1.4322; .NET CLR 2.0.50727),gzip(gfe),gzip(gfe) X-HTTP-Via: HTTP/1.1 (Velocity/1.1.1 [uScMs f p eN:t cCMp s ]), HTTP/1.1 spider-dtc-tc02.proxy.aol.com[CDBC7042] (Prism/1.2.1), HTTP/1.1 cache-dtc-ae05.proxy.aol.com[CDBC7509] (Traffic-Server/6.1.5 [uScM])