Article View: sci.physics
Article #5117Re: Curved space?
From: Craig "Powderkeg" DeForest
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 14:51
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 14:51
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In article <bar> mkohlhaa@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (mike) writes: I've heard "the shortest distance between two points is not necessarily a straight line." I'm not as knowledgable about physics as most of you probably are, and would like a explanation to this interesting statement. It all depends on how you define `straight line'. The most straightforward way is to *define* a straight line to be the shortest distance between two points, come Hell or high water. Then the definition rests on your idea of what constitutes distance. To construct a straight line, you start at one endpoint and construct a random curve between the two points, integrating the metric as you go, then adjust the curve until you get a minumum. Now, we're used to dealing with 3D Euclidean space on a day-to-day basis, so we're used to the Pythagorean metric ds = sqrt(dx^2 + dy^2 + dz^2) so that the shortest distance between any two points is just the straight integral: sqrt( (\delta x)^2 + (\delta y)^2 + (\delta z)^2). This particular choice of metric makes lines behave a certain way: triangles always have 180 degrees of internal angle; you can construct a new straight line by displacing every point on an old one by the same distance and direction; etc. In common usage, when we describe a line as straight, we are often referring to these secondary attributes, rather than the strict minimization of distance. When we consider the spaces that result from *other* metrics than the Pythagorean metric, we're frequently at a loss to describe the secondary behaviour of `straight' lines in the alternate space. For example, consider a 2-D space in which all distances are longer near the origin: ds = sqrt(dx^2 + dy^2) * (1 + 1/(1+x^2+y^2)) Here we've multiplied the normal metric by a term that is near 1 far from the origin, and really big near the origin. Far from the origin, this space behaves a lot like Euclidean space. However, near the origin strange things happen. For example, it's possible to make a closed figure with only two endpoints. I can't draw it in ASCII, but imagine an endpoint at (1,0) and another at (-1,0). If you draw a Euclidean straight line between them, along the X-axis, it'll go through the origin, and be extra long because of the penalty near the origin. So the Euclidean line isn't `straight' in this space. You need to bend it around, either up or down, to get away from the origin. You're done when the amount of extra Euclidean distance you get by going out of your way, is equal to the savings you get by not being near the origin. There are two such lines, one above and one below the origin. If you draw both of 'em, you get a diagram that looks like a flying saucer or a galaxy seen edge on. A circle around the origin, will have a different radius (longer) than in a Euclidean space. So the figure looks curved on your diagram, even though it's got two straight lines on it. There're two reasons: first, you've chosen `strange' coordinates to describe the space (Cartesian coordinates probably aren't the most natural for this space); and second, straight lines behave differently than you're used to, because of the different metric. One way of understanding curved spaces is to `embed' 'em in a larger space. The idea is that (with exceptions), for a 2-D space, you can think of points in the space as being on a curved 2-D surface sitting in a 3-D space. You have the 3D Euclidean metric and an equation of constraint that describes the surface. Plugging-in the equation of constraint, into the metric, yields the 2-D `curved' metric. For example, with the one above: ds = sqrt(dx^2 + dy^2 + (dx^2+dy^2)/(1+x^2+y^2)) we can write dz^2 = (dx^2+dy^2)/(x^2+y^2) and notice that our new expression for ds is just the 3D-Euclidean metric, subject to the constraint above, which defines a curved 2-D surface in the 3-D Euclidean space. To figure out what it looks like, we examine the differential constraint. First notice that everything is radial, so we just need to figure out how z varies with r. Remembering that r = sqrt(x^2+y^2), you get dz = dr/(1+r), which integrates to z = ln(r+1). So our non-Euclidean space can be described as a curved 2-D surface, embedded in a larger 3-D space with the Euclidean metric (which we like). Did you see the movie, `The Black Hole'? Remember those green line diagrams at the beginning, with a flat plane and a big stretched hole in it? That's what we're thinkin' about, except with a floor at the bottom of the hole. Straight lines in the 2-D space are not straight lines in the 3-D embedding space. Oh yeah -- another simple 2-D curved space is described by the surface of the Earth. It's embedded in 3-D space as a sphere. On small enough scales, it's flat, but on large enough scales, the curvature matters, so that, eg, it's possible to draw a triangle on the surface of the Earth, with a total interior angle of 270 degrees. But, within the space defined by the Earth (ie walking on its surface), the shortest distance to, say, Sweden *is* a straight line: you just point yourself towards Sweden, and walk that way. -- DON'T DRINK SOAP! DILUTE DILUTE! OK!
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Newsgroups: sci.physics Path: arc1-ca.pugleaf.net!sparky!uunet!stanford.edu!CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU!times.stanford.edu!zowie From: zowie@daedalus.stanford.edu (Craig "Powderkeg" DeForest) Subject: Re: Curved space? In-Reply-To: jtbell@hubcap.clemson.edu's message of Mon, 21 Dec 1992 05:24:33 GMT Message-ID: <ZOWIE.92Dec21145136@daedalus.stanford.edu> Sender: news@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU Organization: Stanford Center for Space Science and Astrophysics References: <BzL73K.9xr@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <BzL7As.A81@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <1992Dec21.052433.8033@hubcap.clemson.edu> Date: 21 Dec 92 14:51:36 Lines: 93