Article View: sci.physics
Article #8623Re: Instantaneous Ageing in the Twin Paradox
From: John C. Baez
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1992 21:05
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1992 21:05
41 lines
3263 bytes
3263 bytes
In article <1992Jan24.191554.6217@sunova.ssc.gov> brian@helium.ssc.gov (Brian Scipioni) writes: >I know the twin paradox has been beaten to death, and I know what the >mainstream viewpoint is. It is simple and straightforward to understand. > >My problem continues to be the unsupported assertion that information - >which does not contain matter or energy - travels, and is limited to the >speed of light. You can send information using light if you like, but the >speed belongs to the light. > >You can also use your observations coupled with a knowledge of physical >laws to deduce information about events not directly accessible to >you through observation. > >When information is created does it have a location? Does it appear throughout >the universe at once? Well, you're entitled to use the word however you want, and in some senses of the word you might be right in saying that information is "created" or "appears throughout the universe at once." But there is a well-defined concept of information which is what people are using when they say that no information travels faster than the speed of light. Actually, I bet most people who say this only have a fuzzy notion of information, but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. :-) In quantum theory (or even classical theory) observables are represented by elements in an algebra (e.g. an operator algebra). In relativistic physics we may assign to each nice (e.g. open) subset of spacetime the algebra of observables that can be measured within that subset. The state of a physical system is represented by a linear functional on the algebra of observables (which should satisfy some properties). In nice cases we can actually measure the information of a state, also called its entropy. For example if the state is represented as a density matrix (as often done in quantum statistical mechanics), say D, then the information is Tr (D ln D). (The sign is a frequent nuisance in discussing information. Here it's chosen so that a pure state, which carries the most information about what'd going on with the system, has zero information, while mixed states have less information (a negative amount, actually, but you can add any number you like if negative numbers freak you out.)) Using these notions you can rigorously say what you mean about information not traveling faster than light. (Left as a nontrivial exercise to the reader.)
Technical Details
Message-ID:
<1992Jan24.210510.11353@galois.mit.edu>Path:
arc1-ca.pugleaf.net!sparky!uunet!snorkelwacker.mit.edu!galois!riesz!jbaezReferences:
<13390@drutx.ATT.COM> <gill.696241152@physics.ubc.ca> <1992Jan24.191554.6217@sunova.ssc.gov>Show Full Headers
Complete Article Headers
X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 10b271,1e9f89d1a67d9895 X-Google-Attributes: gid10b271,public X-Google-Thread: f803e,77fc19304d24b96c X-Google-Attributes: gidf803e,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 1992-01-24 13:58:33 PST Newsgroups: sci.physics,bionet.info-theory Path: arc1-ca.pugleaf.net!sparky!uunet!snorkelwacker.mit.edu!galois!riesz!jbaez From: jbaez@riesz.mit.edu (John C. Baez) Subject: Re: Instantaneous Ageing in the Twin Paradox Message-ID: <1992Jan24.210510.11353@galois.mit.edu> Keywords: Special Relativity Sender: news@galois.mit.edu Nntp-Posting-Host: riesz Organization: MIT Department of Mathematics, Cambridge, MA References: <13390@drutx.ATT.COM> <gill.696241152@physics.ubc.ca> <1992Jan24.191554.6217@sunova.ssc.gov> Date: Fri, 24 Jan 92 21:05:10 GMT Lines: 42