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3 total messages Started by Colin Plumb Mon, 17 Nov 1986 20:12
Telepathy??
#7499
Author: Colin Plumb
Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1986 20:12
49 lines
2935 bytes
I think the basic source of a lot of beliefs in "supernatural" events stems
from a misapplication of Occam's razor.

Given two equally valid explanations, I'll choose to believe the simpler.
As a matter of fact, I'll choose simplicity over some degree of validity.
This is a fairly common attitude.  (An awful lot of theoretical work is done
using this premise.)

However, there can be disagreement on the subject of what is "simple".

I find the fundamentals of physics simple.  Even gauge theory and quantum
mechanics is simple in a way.  Others don't think so.  They prefer to think
in terms of human behaviour - psychic powers are "fickle", or "shy", or depend
on the "attitude" or "vibrations" of witnesses.  This may lead to a confusing
system of beliefs, but some find a mathematical approach even more confusing.

Thus, we have people passionately defending ideas they can grasp against ideas
they can't.  The annals of science are full of examples of this - the birth
of quantum theory is one example.

Still, even the opponents of quantum theory were intelligent enough to
recognize the work others had done as valid.  They didn't scream about
organized conspiracies to keep facts covered up, as some of the more extreme
psi believers have done.

I have no objection to people having beliefs that are utter nonsense.
If they try to tell the public about them, I can pay no attention.
If they try to tell me about them, I can tell them to shut up.
If they try to tell *anybody* that these beliefs have a basis in reality, and
present them as fact, I get very angry - whether these beliefs are about
psychic powers, creatonism, or green men from Mars building the pyramids of
Giza.

This sums up my objection to people posting articles about psychic powers in
sci.physics.  I hope future posters will be more careful about the claims they
make on the subject.

	-Colin Plumb (ccplumb@watnot.UUCP)

Zippy says:
Once, there was NO fun...  This was before MENU planning, FASHION statements
or NAUTILUS equipment...
Then, in 1985..  FUN was completely encoded in this tiny MICROCHIP..
It contain 14,768 vaguely amusing SIT-COM pilots!!
We had to wait FOUR BILLION years but we finally got JERRY LEWIS, MTV and
a large selection of creme-filled snack cakes!

P.S. My pet irrational belief is that faster-than-light travel is somehow
possible - but you won't catch me trying to prove it.
Re: Telepathy, physics and imagination
#7512
Author: Paul M Koloc
Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1986 22:40
65 lines
4012 bytes
In article <12193@watnot.UUCP> ccplumb@watnot.UUCP (Colin Plumb) writes:
>I think the basic source of a lot of beliefs in "supernatural" events stems
>from a misapplication of Occam's razor.
>Given two equally valid explanations, I'll choose to believe the simpler.
>As a matter of fact, I'll choose simplicity over some degree of validity.

Why choose?  In such cases, it's good to carry a "handful" of
ideas to cover "the facet of reality".  Since systems (patterns)
of information repeat, there is a good chance that by and by we
can sort through the handful and find the better matches or even
discover a "replacement concept" to solve missing piece of the 
puzzle.   It's probably not necessary that we carry the same
handful, either. 

>I have no objection to people having beliefs that are utter nonsense.
>If they try to tell the public about them, I can pay no attention.
>If they try to tell *anybody* that these beliefs have a basis in reality, and
>present them as fact, I get very angry - whether these beliefs are about
>psychic powers, cretinism, or green men from Mars building the pyramids of
>Giza. ... . I hope future posters will be more careful about the claims they
>make on the subject.

Why don't you either pay attention or, "use your 'K'" key instead
of steam in silence?  

Physics is such a dud when it comes to totally new parent technologies
and innovative theories.  "They MUST be convinced" before they will
"lower" themselves to publish such "things".  Look at the
problems Einstein faced and even Maiman's attempt to get the
results of the first laser published.  Six (6) Journals rejected
his paper, before the British Journal "Nature" did publish!

PHYSICS should have known DECADES EARLIER that, since "material can 
absorb" radiation, it could "amplify".  Then WHY did it take an 
electrical engineer, a mere "technologist" to do it??   Ahh!  but 
of course, there is no PSI, yet how many times do the fiction writers 
spill the beans about future theories and technologies that at the 
time are "pure nonsense" i.e. the ray gun?  Is there a kind of "super 
computer intelligence" that is secretly attached to our brains "wish 
centers" OR just dumb luck?  

My feeling about such "creative nonsense" is not to dismiss, but
to query "if true, how so?".  What possible mechanism/s could
make something like this work, or in the case of a new hypothesis,
what natural phenomena could such a notion explain and simplify if 
it does hold true? 

NOT - is there evidence for PSI, but ... . since it is a concept
how, could it possibly work.  Then let's try it and search for
another way and a better understanding of reality if that
approach fails and why it failed.   

              We can all be a little smart, but imagination,
	      that's something the government can't recognize.
              
Q: How many physicists does it take to screw in a light bulb
R:            That depends on how you define "in". 

If we could only trade our "Nobel Physicists" for a favorable
balance of trade.  
+---------------------------------------------------------+--------+
| Paul M. Koloc, President: (301) 445-1075                | FUSION |
| Prometheus II, Ltd.; College Park, MD 20740-0222        |  this  |
| {mimsy | seismo}!prometheus!pmk; pmk@prometheus.UUCP    | decade |
+---------------------------------------------------------+--------+
Re: Telepathy, physics and imagination
#7522
Author: Erich Rickheit
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1986 17:37
13 lines
1267 bytes
<Nonesense! There's no such things as line-eaters! I'll show you...>

Okay, boyas and girls! mod.psi is back on its feet again. Now you can discuss
this stuff where it belongs. Send articles to mod-psi@ulowell, admistrivia to
mod-psi-request@ulowell.

Sorry to interupt your reading pleasure, but that's what the army's all about!

-- 
			a lesser Power of Darkness
UUCP: ...!wanginst!ulowell!rickheit     : USnail:  Erich Rickheit
"Don't take life too serious--It ain't  :          85 Gershom Ave, #2
 nohow _permanent_"--Walt Kelly         :          Lowell, MA 01854
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