🚀 go-pugleaf

"Andy M Jenkins" <andy_nfTORIES@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:iN-dnd73FYy7DVjdRVn-uA@giganews.com...
> Freedom2Surf have announced a price reduction on their 1Mb ADSL service.
> A staggeringly low �14.99 per month. And its not some special, never to
> be repeated, once in a lifetime offer either.
>
> http://snipurl.com/2n1k
>
> --
> Regards
> Andy M Jenkins
>
> UK Broadband Usergroup http://www.uk-bug.net

But the service is capped at 1GB per month...

There's cheap and too cheap, flash back of 08002Go and many other ISP's that
did cheap 0800 and 0808 dial ups, they went Bust when demand outstripped
there bandwidth. That will happen again for DSL

"Flexi" <s@s.com> wrote in message
news:ca453b$ggh$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
> "Andy M Jenkins" <andy_nfTORIES@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
> news:iN-dnd73FYy7DVjdRVn-uA@giganews.com...
> > Freedom2Surf have announced a price reduction on their 1Mb ADSL
service.
> > A staggeringly low �14.99 per month. And its not some special, never
to
> > be repeated, once in a lifetime offer either.
> >
> > http://snipurl.com/2n1k
> >
>
> But the service is capped at 1GB per month...
>

And on this link  http://www.freedom2surf.net/adsl/home.php it states
"Up to 1 Mbit download speed", which could mean anything,  the other
more expensive services specifically state "512k download speed" or  "1
Mbit download speed". Also no contention ratio is given for the cheaper
services, but a 50:1 contention ratio is given for the others.

On Tue, 8 Jun 2004 13:29:16 +0100, "GwG" <me@privacy.net> wrote:

| 
| "Flexi" <s@s.com> wrote in message
| news:ca453b$ggh$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
| > "Andy M Jenkins" <andy_nfTORIES@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
| > news:iN-dnd73FYy7DVjdRVn-uA@giganews.com...
| > > Freedom2Surf have announced a price reduction on their 1Mb ADSL
| service.
| > > A staggeringly low �14.99 per month. And its not some special, never
| to
| > > be repeated, once in a lifetime offer either.
| > >
| > > http://snipurl.com/2n1k
| > >
| >
| > But the service is capped at 1GB per month...
| >
| 
| And on this link  http://www.freedom2surf.net/adsl/home.php it states
| "Up to 1 Mbit download speed", which could mean anything,  the other
| more expensive services specifically state "512k download speed" or  "1
| Mbit download speed". Also no contention ratio is given for the cheaper
| services, but a 50:1 contention ratio is given for the others.

My dial up service is fine at 6:00 in the mornings, and useless at midday.
Thus the problem is *not* between the exchange and my computer, it *must*
be somewhere else in the system.

If I am driving from home to London, I see no sence in improving my drive
to motorway standard, when the delays will be due to roadworks on the M1 or
whereever.

-- 
Dave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> 
Killfile and Anti Troll FAQs at 
http://www.hyphenologist.co.uk/killfile. 

chris wrote:
> On Tue, 8 Jun 2004 10:40:43 +0000 (UTC) and in article <ca453b$ggh$1
> @hercules.btinternet.com>, Flexi said...
> : "Andy M Jenkins" <andy_nfTORIES@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
> : news:iN-dnd73FYy7DVjdRVn-uA@giganews.com...
> : > Freedom2Surf have announced a price reduction on their 1Mb ADSL service.
> : > A staggeringly low �14.99 per month. And its not some special, never to
> : > be repeated, once in a lifetime offer either.
> : >
> : > http://snipurl.com/2n1k
> : >
> : > --
> : > Regards
> : > Andy M Jenkins
> : >
> : > UK Broadband Usergroup http://www.uk-bug.net
> : 
> : But the service is capped at 1GB per month...
> : 
> Wrong, it's capped at 5gig a month and downloads from 1am-6am are free 
> from meterage.

Nope ;)

The 1Mb product is capped at 1GB (extra GB's are available at a cost). 
There is ALSO a 1Mb product with 5Gb allowance for an extra �5 per 
month, at �19.99.

Does the article I wrote give the wrong impression in that regard ?

-- 
Regards
Andy M Jenkins

UK Broadband Usergroup		http://www.uk-bug.net

On Tue, 8 Jun 2004 at 10:40:43, Flexi wrote in uk.net.providers
(Reference: <ca453b$ggh$1@hercules.btinternet.com>)


>But the service is capped at 1GB per month..

Mines isn't capped - at least bandwidth usage isn't - and I often pay 
less than that (and one member of my family always does).
-- 
John Underwood
Do not change the Reply-To: address -it will work if you use it within 30 days.
After that visit <http://theunderwoods.org.uk/contact.html> for a current
contact address. Do not write to the From: address.

> And on this link  http://www.freedom2surf.net/adsl/home.php it states
> "Up to 1 Mbit download speed", which could mean anything,  the other
> more expensive services specifically state "512k download speed" or  "1
> Mbit download speed". Also no contention ratio is given for the cheaper
> services, but a 50:1 contention ratio is given for the others.

Hi,

It simply says up to 1MB because of the fact for people who cannot get
1MB due to distance from exchange etc, they will provision the line at
512K instead, so no varients in speed throughout the day like Bulldog
etc.

Kind Regards,

Justin Johnson
Freedom2Support Project Leader
http://www.freedom2support.net

On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 14:18:45 +0100, Andy M Jenkins 

>Nope ;)
>
>The 1Mb product is capped at 1GB (extra GB's are available at a cost). 

Would be more customer-friendly [1] if once the 1GB (0r whatever - but
is that GB or Gb?) cap was reached then say 10MB per day was still
allowed. That way only  a maximum of eg 1.3GB would be available under
the fixed cost plan but people could still realistically use the net
for day to day tasks such as email throughout each month without
having to worry about buying a new chunk of bandwidth.

[1] I know this is a commercial world but customer relations should
still count for something.

JGD

GwG wrote:
......
> 
> And on this link  http://www.freedom2surf.net/adsl/home.php it states "Up to 1 Mbit download
> speed", which could mean anything,  the other more expensive services specifically state "512k
> download speed" or  "1 Mbit download speed". Also no contention ratio is given for the cheaper 
> services, but a 50:1 contention ratio is given for the others.
> 
> 

The use of the phrase "up to" may well be because of a recent (2 June 2004) adjudication by the ASA
which held that AOL describing an ADSL service as "1 Mb" without qualification was misleading,
since the rate varied depending on contention and other issues. See

http://www.asa.org.uk/adjudications/show_adjudication.asp?adjudication_id=38007&from_index=show_advertisers&dates_of_adjudications_id=564:565:566:567

for the full details. Anyone else describing their service as "512 Kbit" or any other speed without
qualifying that could expose themselves to a similar ruling.

> It simply says up to 1MB because of the fact for people who cannot get
> 1MB due to distance from exchange etc, they will provision the line at
> 512K instead, so no varients in speed throughout the day like Bulldog
> etc.

Correction to the Above, if you cannot have your line provisioned at
1MB due to distance from the exchange they will give you the option of
having it provided at 512K for the same price/specification of the
product.

Cheers

Justin

"Gus" <cro___1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d1ixc.12378$NK4.1716263@stones.force9.net...
> There's cheap and too cheap, flash back of 08002Go and many other ISP's
that
> did cheap 0800 and 0808 dial ups, they went Bust when demand outstripped
> there bandwidth. That will happen again for DSL

Been reading comments from Wanadoo too much? You'd be suprised to hear that
freedom2surf have been going longer than many of the big name ISP's that are
around today.

They've been in the market place since 1997, and believe me, I doubt they're
going to do something stupid with prices.

I'm with them now and wouldn't change them for the world. Freedom2surf will
not go bust, I can promise you that, they're not a fly by night ISP.

"Kevin Ashley" <k.ashley@ulcc.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:ca6jjs$4p3$1@canard.ulcc.ac.uk...
> GwG wrote:
> The use of the phrase "up to" may well be because of a recent (2 June
2004) adjudication by the ASA
> which held that AOL describing an ADSL service as "1 Mb" without
qualification was misleading,
> since the rate varied depending on contention and other issues. See
>
>
http://www.asa.org.uk/adjudications/show_adjudication.asp?adjudication_id=38
007&from_index=show_advertisers&dates_of_adjudications_id=564:565:566:567
>
> for the full details. Anyone else describing their service as "512 Kbit"
or any other speed without
> qualifying that could expose themselves to a similar ruling.
>

It's not misleading at all, all it simply means is that they will provision
the line at 1024K if they can depending on line quality/length, and if they
cannot because BT don't allow them, they will give you the option of having
the same product at the same price at 512K.

Methinks you should check your facts before you start accusing people of
illegal advertising.

> And on this link  http://www.freedom2surf.net/adsl/home.php it states
> "Up to 1 Mbit download speed", which could mean anything,  the other
> more expensive services specifically state "512k download speed" or  "1
> Mbit download speed". Also no contention ratio is given for the cheaper
> services, but a 50:1 contention ratio is given for the others.

They're both 50:1, if you clicked on the product's names to go to their
respective pages you would see that for yourself. Maybe look a little bit
closer before crying wolf next time?

"Justin Johnson" <Justin.Johnson@NOSPAM.bluesweb.co.uk> wrote in message
news:ca6qn6$e2l$1@news.freedom2surf.net...
> > And on this link  http://www.freedom2surf.net/adsl/home.php it
states
> > "Up to 1 Mbit download speed", which could mean anything,  the other
> > more expensive services specifically state "512k download speed" or
"1
> > Mbit download speed". Also no contention ratio is given for the
cheaper
> > services, but a 50:1 contention ratio is given for the others.
>
> They're both 50:1, if you clicked on the product's names to go to
their
> respective pages you would see that for yourself. Maybe look a little
bit
> closer before crying wolf next time?
>

I was not crying wolf, I was comparing the relevant items side by side
on a web page, the differing descriptions created the ambiguity, which
was hardly my fault. It should not be up to the prospective customers to
have to search for these details, they should be clearly and easily
available for comparison.

Justin Johnson wrote (in reply to a comment I made on another post):

 >
 > Methinks you should check your facts before you start accusing people of
 > illegal advertising.
 >

Calm down, Justin. And better, check your own facts. I have not accused
anyone of "illegal" advertising. I did draw attention to the fact that
the Advertising Standards Authority recently upheld a complaint against
an advert for AOL. The ASA's opinion seemed to be that since ADSL does
not offer guaranteed bandwidth to the end user, it is misleading to
describe it as having a fixed speed, such as 1Mbit, 512Kbit, etc. They
wanted to see phrases like "up to." If you had followed the link I gave,
you could see the dull detail, which I won't waste time reiterating here.

Now, why did I bother to do that ? Because, I felt that GwG, in his comments
on an earlier post on the freedom2surf offer, cast aspersions on it
because it used the phrase "up to 1Mbit." He seemed to think that cast
doubt on something to do with the offer. I didn't think that was fair; I
believed the phrase "up to" was simply telling the truth about how ADSL
works, and that it may have been inspired by that ASA ruling, which *should*
have an effect on how *all* ISPs advertise ADSL services. (I won't get
into a discussion now on whether ASA rulings actually have any such
effect in practice.)

Unfortunately, in your hasty reply to my posting, you managed to
scramble the attributions such that you removed all of the
words of GwG that I had quoted, but still kept the
phrase "Gwg wrote:".

So, let's try it again, but more simply.

Basically, Gwg said that because your offer said "up to 1mbit"
there was something dodgy about it and maybe it wasn't 1mbit at all
(amongst other things.)

I disagreed; I pointed to the ASA ruling
against AOL intending to show that *any* 1Mbit ADSL service
should properly be described in advertising as "up to 1Mbit",
or words to that effect. Yours had done exactly that; hence,
no adverse inference should be drawn from the wording.

I was supporting your position against GwG. Unfortunately, your
reply and mis-quoting appears to show you think I was doing
exactly the opposite. Please put the safety catch back on your
hair-trigger lest you do the same to the next person who attempts to
defend your position.

Kevin Ashley (who has no particular opinions for or against freedom2surf.)

> I was not crying wolf, I was comparing the relevant items side by side
> on a web page, the differing descriptions created the ambiguity, which
> was hardly my fault. It should not be up to the prospective customers to
> have to search for these details, they should be clearly and easily
> available for comparison.

They are, at the top of any page in the ADSL section you will see a link to
a page called comparison:
http://www.f2s.net/adsl/comparison.php

Hi,

I am not from freedom2surf, I'm merely a user, sorry for over-reacting, had
a massive work load and think I was a bit hasty on venting this in the
newsgroup.

I prolly misread it by the look of things anyway :)

Cheers

Justin

"Kevin Ashley" <k.ashley@ulcc.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:ca7elm$eoq$1@canard.ulcc.ac.uk...
>
> Basically, Gwg said that because your offer said "up to 1mbit"
> there was something dodgy about it and maybe it wasn't 1mbit at all
> (amongst other things.)
>

I did not say there was something dodgy about it, what I wrote was "it
states
"Up to 1 Mbit download speed", which could mean anything," which it
could. This does need clarifying, because anyone taking up the service,
could then not complain later if they only got 56Kb download speed, as
that would still be complying with the "Up to 1 Mbit download speed".

Much more care needs to be made with the wording on some of these
commercial websites.

>They've been in the market place since 1997, and believe me, I doubt they're
>going to do something stupid with prices.
>I'm with them now and wouldn't change them for the world. Freedom2surf will
>not go bust, I can promise you that, they're not a fly by night ISP.


While no doubt true in this case I am reminded of callnet0800. Owned
by a reputable canadian telco they were the official isp of the tory
party and all michael hesiltines big magazine empire (remember
f1racing). Then they stared offering free 0800 internet access even
though bt was still charging them by the minute and rapidly went bust.

The moral being never underestimate a company's ability to suicide
over a dumb idea just because they have been around for a while.

On  10 Jun 2004, ff <webbygodnospammy@usa.net> wrote:

>Then they stared offering free 0800 internet access even though 
>bt was still charging them by the minute and rapidly went bust.

The firm sent me vouchers to a value of 20 pounds (4 x 5.00) with
which to reduce their phone bills.  I used their phone service (a
prefix of 1664 from memory) for quite a while, including calls to
mobiles, but they never sent a bill; I stopped using their access
code after a fairly short time, in part to reduce the chance of a
significant bill appearing, but none did - no doubt some went for
longer and perhaps only stopped when the firm went bust.  I would
really have preferred they remained, as they were offering me the
internet at low cost, when there were few other cheap options for
daytime use.  Peter M.