🚀 go-pugleaf

kony <kony@insightbb.com> wrote in message
news:3cc2273e.2318614@netnews.insightbb.com...
> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote

>>>> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?

>>> I think Logitech makes the best keyboards.

>> Do they have the same problem tho, the letters wearing off ?

> My Logitech Cordless iTouch keyboard has worn fairly
> well, has lasted longer than some modern keyboards
> I've had, but it too has the characters printed on the
> top, not injection molded.  It's not going to "last for years".

OK, the obvious thing to do is make sure its covered by years
of warranty and shaft them on that when the lettering has worn
enough so that its not usable anymore on some of the keys.

And buy it locally from an operation thats going to be around
for that long, to make it easy to shaft them on the warranty.

Our consumer law makes the seller legally liable in the first instance.
You can choose to use the manufacturer/importer if you want to.

���D�A��� <no_private_consultations@here.com> wrote in message
news:fLnw8.45739$uR5.103148@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...

> Take it back for a warranty claim.

Yeah, I plan to. Its noticeably worn, but still readable on the worst keys.

> There was a batch of keyboards that wore excessively.

Everyone who has commented has said that they
all wear like that except the ancient IBM keyboards.


> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote

>> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
>> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to use.

>> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
>> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
>> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
>> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.

>> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
>> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
>> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.

>> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?

JAD <jdemma@eartink.net> wrote in message
news:Miow8.3526$PX2.229312@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...

> Im currently using the logitech cordless optical iTOUCH.
> I like the keyboard, dark with white letters works for me.

Sure, but what I asked about was the wear.

> ITS the DAMN optical mouse i can't get into. It feels like a left hander to me.
> I used a MS ps2 for 7 years and its right handed with the bend ,as it were,
> towards the left. This optical bends to the right and the buttons are of the same
> texture and are too small, i have a hard time feeling if Im on them or not. mho

OK. I currently use the MS Intellimouse Optical corded
and would never use a non optical mouse ever again.
Great to use, tho it appears to be a tad flimsy if dropped.
I dont drop stuff much so that shouldnt be a problem.

I compute in the winter in full sun, basking in the sun in the
mornings. Havent see how the MS Optical does in that situation
yet. Conventional mices are almost universally hopeless, too much
of the sun gets thru the top surface and confuses the hell out of
the movement sensing. You basically have to shade the mouse.

The cordless wasnt available when I got it, so I'll likely get
MS cordless if the corded mouse still works in the sun.



> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote

>> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
>> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to use.

>> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
>> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
>> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
>> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.

>> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
>> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
>> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.

>> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?

"Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a9sppr$5mrlj$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
>
> Gregory Toomey <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:TYkw8.45652$uR5.102991@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
> > Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote
>
> >> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> >> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent
to use.
>
> >> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> >> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> >> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> >> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
>
> >> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> >> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> >> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
>
> >> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?
>
> > I think Logitech makes the best keyboards.
>
> Do they have the same problem tho, the letters wearing off ?

Note yet but I've only had it a few months. I've used keyboards 40 hrs/week
for years without letter rubbing off.

>
> > At the moment I'm using a cheap Mitsubishi Diamond
> > Touch - very good, includes volume & other music
> > controls, and web buttons - not wireless though.
>
> But what about the letters wearing off ?
>

Maybe Mitsubishi has better technology for stamping letters - I'll report
back in a few years.

gtoomey

You must be doing something.  I've had this MS Natural keyboard for over 5
years, and only two letters are about gone (M and N), which I think was due
to what I used to clean it once.  The rest are still fine.  My wife uses
that keyboard on a daily basis.  I currently have the MS Natural Pro, but
not long enough to make any observations about wear.

"JAD" <jdemma@eartink.net> wrote in message
news:Miow8.3526$PX2.229312@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> Im currently using the logitech cordless optical iTOUCH. I like the
> keyboard, dark with white letters works for me. ITS the DAMN optical mouse
i
> can't get into. It feels like a left hander to me. I used a MS ps2 for 7
> years and its right handed with the bend ,as it were, towards the left.
This
> optical bends to the right and the buttons are of the same texture and are
> too small, i have a hard time feeling if Im on them or not. mho

I find the Logitech optical mouse very good. It works on just about any
surface.

gtoomey

"GezusK" <patsezel@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3cc250b9$1_2@news.utk.edu...
| You must be doing something.  I've had this MS Natural keyboard for
over 5
| years, and only two letters are about gone (M and N), which I think
was due
| to what I used to clean it once.  The rest are still fine.  My wife
uses
| that keyboard on a daily basis.  I currently have the MS Natural Pro,
but
| not long enough to make any observations about wear.
|
|
|

I think it more to do with the old keyboards being built to last.   The
one I am typing on now has a date code of 94-4-4 (Honeywell) and is used
for up to six hours a day including gaming and all lettering is intact,
and all keys work well.

The second computer in this room has a 12 month old generic brand, and
half the lettering is missing.

--
Cheers

Oldus Fartus

Microsoft makes some of the best designed and innovative keyboards.  In
fact, most all of Microsoft's peripherals are better made and designed than
competitors offerings.  (Although I do prefer the design of the Logitech
Wireless Mouseman)

I've never seen the lettering wear off of Microsoft keyboards under heavy
use.  The other company that I know of that makes excellent keyboards is
IBM.  Although I'm not sure of IBM quality these days after the utter
fiasco/melt down of competence in their hard drive division that destroyed
the division's sales.



Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a9sivr$5pue2$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to
use.
>
> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
>
> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
>
> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?
>
>

GezusK <patsezel@hotmail.com> wrote in
message news:3cc250b9$1_2@news.utk.edu...

> You must be doing something.

I doubt it, I get the same effect with cheap keyboards and never
got that effect with the older double injection moulded keyboards
like the DEC LK201 or the VT100 keyboard before that.

> I've had this MS Natural keyboard for over 5 years,
> and only two letters are about gone (M and N),

Those and A and E are the ones that do go first for most.

> which I think was due to what I used to clean it once.

Bet its just the usual wear problem. In my case the original roughened
surface to the keytop proper has gone smooth on the same keys that
have had the lettering fade, so its clearly a wear effect.

> The rest are still fine.  My wife uses that keyboard on a daily basis.

I do use mine most of most days. Rather
more than most would use a keyboard.

> I currently have the MS Natural Pro, but not long
> enough to make any observations about wear.

This was only in 6 months, tho admittedly it does get a lot of use.

Hi there! <nospam@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:8Asw8.42420$QC1.2899668@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...

> Microsoft makes some of the best designed and innovative keyboards.

Yeah, no complaints about it apart from the wear of the letters.

> In fact, most all of Microsoft's peripherals are better made
> and designed than competitors offerings.  (Although I do
> prefer the design of the Logitech Wireless Mouseman)

Yeah, they are both head to head with that stuff, keyboards and mice.

> I've never seen the lettering wear off of
> Microsoft keyboards under heavy use.

Weird. Maybe its just a dud batch like someone else
said. The plastic used isnt hard enough or something.

> The other company that I know of that
> makes excellent keyboards is IBM.

Yeah, no argument there. Loved the original PC keyboard and the AT too.

> Although I'm not sure of IBM quality these days after
> the utter fiasco/melt down of competence in their hard
> drive division that destroyed the division's sales.

And has now seen them flog that division off to Hitachi.

I havent kept up with their latest keyboards, you dont see
much said about them at all. I really should go for cordless
now, wasnt available when I got the corded keyboard and
optical mouse except at insane bleeding edge prices.

I wont normally by bleeding edge stuff like that anyway,
the next version is usually better, particularly with stuff
like that with stuff like the battery life etc.


> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote

> > Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> > cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to
> use.
> >
> > I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> > branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> > Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> > pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
> >
> > Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> > wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> > wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
> >
> > Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?
> >
> >
>
>
>
>

"Oldus Fartus" <denisNOSPAMand@iinet.net.au> wrote:

>I think it more to do with the old keyboards being built to last.   The
>one I am typing on now has a date code of 94-4-4 (Honeywell) and is used
>for up to six hours a day including gaming and all lettering is intact,
>and all keys work well.

I'll bet it's heavy too. Can you pick it up from one end using one hand?
Bet you can't twist it either.
New ones are so light and flimsy, one of mine developed a permanent bend after
two months of use, due to the 'feet' at the back being used. It was so bad that,
if the feet were folded away, it would rock (as in like a rocking horse, not
"this rocks!") on the desk.

Aye, they don't make 'em like they used to.
Thankfully keyboards haven't changed much over the years, so the ones we used on
our old 386s still work on out new machines.


>The second computer in this room has a 12 month old generic brand, and
>half the lettering is missing.

I have a roomful of computers, all came with cheap keyboards when I bought them.
Some  wear out after 6 months. Others are starting to go now, after a couple of
years hard use.
I replace them with 'proper' ones from the local surplus outlet. Half the price,
twice the weight, and ten times the quality.

The one I'm using here at home is about 10 years old, and apart from a general
discolouring, is perfect. No signs of wear, just a bit grubby.

Oh, and it's the a-s-d-w keys which wear out first (counter strike...).


Best keyboard? Cherry.



Chris Pollard

-- 
CG Internet caf�, Tagum City, Philippines

http://www.chromenet.net/~cginternet

reply to beavis rather than butthead

> it too has the
> characters printed on the top, not injection molded.  It's not going
> to "last for years".

Mine was cheap, but it's lasted very well.  It's a Turbo-Track.  After 4� years of daily use, the keys themselves have become very worn, but the lettering has remained perfectly intact.  I don't have any clue as to the technology that was used though.

Kev

Ever try washing hand before using the keyboard???  The keyboard that I'm
using now would be 10 years old tomorro!

"Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a9sivr$5pue2$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to
use.
>
> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
>
> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
>
> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?
>
>

On Sun, 21 Apr 2002 06:27:43 +1000, "Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
>cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to use.
>
>I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
>branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
>Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
>pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
>
>Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
>wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
>wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
>
>Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?
>

I usually buy Keytronics keyboards for about $25.

The one I'm typing on now is polished nice and smooth-  can't do
anything about that unless you use stainless steel for the key
surfaces (but who cares anyway?).

The keys appear to be double shot-  nice and clear after a couple
years of typing away (although I'm not about to pull one off to check
the backside to be sure).

Of course, it's not wireless, but it IS well made.


BobR

eltan <eltan@NoSpAmStArT.cOm.Au.> wrote in
message news:3cc27d03@iridium.webone.com.au...

> Ever try washing hand before using the keyboard???

Cant be that, that cant wear the keytop surface smooth.

> The keyboard that I'm using now would be 10 years old tomorro!

My DEC LK201 is much older than that, and it shows
no sign of wear at all. Used it at least as much as the
MS keyboard for much longer than 6 months.


> "Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:a9sivr$5pue2$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
> > Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> > cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to
> use.
> >
> > I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> > branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> > Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> > pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
> >
> > Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> > wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> > wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
> >
> > Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?
> >
> >
>
>

bullshit
"eltan" <eltan@NoSpAmStArT.cOm.Au.> wrote in message
news:3cc27d03@iridium.webone.com.au...
> Ever try washing hand before using the keyboard???  The keyboard that I'm
> using now would be 10 years old tomorro!
>
> "Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:a9sivr$5pue2$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
> > Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> > cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to
> use.
> >
> > I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> > branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> > Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> > pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
> >
> > Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> > wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> > wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
> >
> > Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?
> >
> >
>
>

what do you need the letters for??? id have thought that if you do that much
typing you would be able to touch-type.
ive been touch typing since i was ten.

Disz -

"Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a9tb60$61t2h$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
>
> kony <kony@insightbb.com> wrote in message
> news:3cc2273e.2318614@netnews.insightbb.com...
> > Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote
>
> >>>> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore
?
>
> >>> I think Logitech makes the best keyboards.
>
> >> Do they have the same problem tho, the letters wearing off ?
>
> > My Logitech Cordless iTouch keyboard has worn fairly
> > well, has lasted longer than some modern keyboards
> > I've had, but it too has the characters printed on the
> > top, not injection molded.  It's not going to "last for years".
>
> OK, the obvious thing to do is make sure its covered by years
> of warranty and shaft them on that when the lettering has worn
> enough so that its not usable anymore on some of the keys.
>
> And buy it locally from an operation thats going to be around
> for that long, to make it easy to shaft them on the warranty.
>
> Our consumer law makes the seller legally liable in the first instance.
> You can choose to use the manufacturer/importer if you want to.
>
>

I spill red wine into them far too often for them to wear out!!





"Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a9sivr$5pue2$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to
use.
>
> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
>
> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
>
> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?
>
>

Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a9sivr$5pue2$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.

Probably a stupid suggestion but if the keyboard itself is working ok - why
not just draw the letters back in with a pen or apply some stickers.

Just my 2cents worth.

Susan

Sounds like to me you are in dire need of getting laid.

"Alien Spawn" <invasion@crosswinds.net> wrote in message
news:3cc1ee36$0$11451$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
>
> That must have been real hard
> well, stop using hand cream
> Maybe you should wear silk gloves
> As for current cordless KB's I must admit I know nothing.

In article <a9tb9o$61d9k$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de>, rod_speed@yahoo.com 
says...
 
> Everyone who has commented has said that they
> all wear like that except the ancient IBM keyboards.

That is correct. The IBM model M I'm using has a date of Aug 1984 on the 
bottom, came with the PS1 we had at work at one point. I bought a new 
one in 1992 or so just to see if i could get one not as "clickey" 
sounding, but it lasted about 6 months before the "spring" (rubber 
injected molded buttons) under the most used keys wore out so I went 
back to using this one. I bought a half dozen old ps1's for $10 each at 
one point to just to stock up on keyboards though looking back that was 
a waste of money since i'm still using the original one....

Im currently using the Mitsubishi Diamond Touch as well it seems great now
for the price.. doesnt seem to have much wear..maybe give it time.  Although
i cant really say beacause i seem to spill  coke and coffee into them far
too often.

We have a Logitech cordless keyboard and a cherry corded one, both for a
couple of years now. Neither of them has any wear on the keys (used daily)
Why not just buy cheap keyboards and chuck them away when the wear gets too
much?

Steve

"Peter and Susan" <petanoz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a9u8ft$69dqd$1@ID-137780.news.dfncis.de...
>
> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:a9sivr$5pue2$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
> > Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> > wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> > wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
>
> Probably a stupid suggestion but if the keyboard itself is working ok -
why
> not just draw the letters back in with a pen or apply some stickers.
>
> Just my 2cents worth.
>
> Susan
>
>
>

wife says "use clear nail polish" to "protect" the keys....an old office
with a cheap boss trick.  Not to sure bout that though, some plastics don't
much care for nail polish.

"Kevin Dolan" <kev.dolan@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:3CC278B9.5563617E@ntlworld.com...
> > it too has the
> > characters printed on the top, not injection molded.  It's not going
> > to "last for years".
>
> Mine was cheap, but it's lasted very well.  It's a Turbo-Track.  After 4�
years of daily use, the keys themselves have become very worn, but the
lettering has remained perfectly intact.  I don't have any clue as to the
technology that was used though.
>
> Kev
>
>

sorry...i have two logitech KB's the optical / itouch is to new but the
corded one is 4 years old and show no signs of wear...
"Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a9tbm7$62028$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
>
> JAD <jdemma@eartink.net> wrote in message
> news:Miow8.3526$PX2.229312@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
>
> > Im currently using the logitech cordless optical iTOUCH.
> > I like the keyboard, dark with white letters works for me.
>
> Sure, but what I asked about was the wear.
>
> > ITS the DAMN optical mouse i can't get into. It feels like a left hander
to me.
> > I used a MS ps2 for 7 years and its right handed with the bend ,as it
were,
> > towards the left. This optical bends to the right and the buttons are of
the same
> > texture and are too small, i have a hard time feeling if Im on them or
not. mho
>
> OK. I currently use the MS Intellimouse Optical corded
> and would never use a non optical mouse ever again.
> Great to use, tho it appears to be a tad flimsy if dropped.
> I dont drop stuff much so that shouldnt be a problem.
>
> I compute in the winter in full sun, basking in the sun in the
> mornings. Havent see how the MS Optical does in that situation
> yet. Conventional mices are almost universally hopeless, too much
> of the sun gets thru the top surface and confuses the hell out of
> the movement sensing. You basically have to shade the mouse.
>
> The cordless wasnt available when I got it, so I'll likely get
> MS cordless if the corded mouse still works in the sun.
>
>
>
> > Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote
>
> >> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> >> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent
to use.
>
> >> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> >> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> >> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> >> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
>
> >> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> >> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> >> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
>
> >> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?
>
>
>
>

optical mice are great no doubt, Are you right handed? and your optical is
the new "mouseman optical"? Cause basically this mouse cramps my hand in the
worst way. I was thinking "knowing how logitech works" that they combo'd all
their left handers with the wireless keyboards to get rid of them...:^)

"Gregory Toomey" <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:09sw8.45953$uR5.103884@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
> "JAD" <jdemma@eartink.net> wrote in message
> news:Miow8.3526$PX2.229312@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> > Im currently using the logitech cordless optical iTOUCH. I like the
> > keyboard, dark with white letters works for me. ITS the DAMN optical
mouse
> i
> > can't get into. It feels like a left hander to me. I used a MS ps2 for 7
> > years and its right handed with the bend ,as it were, towards the left.
> This
> > optical bends to the right and the buttons are of the same texture and
are
> > too small, i have a hard time feeling if Im on them or not. mho
>
> I find the Logitech optical mouse very good. It works on just about any
> surface.
>
> gtoomey
>
>
>

Keyboard are basically meant to be disposable. Some of the
cordless ones are expensive though. You may be able to find
a cordless one that uses the same keytops as their corded version,
so that you could buy the corded keyboard for perhaps as little
as $10-15 when it is on sale, then switch the keytops from the
corded one to the cordless one as the lettering wears out on
the cordless one wears out.

Rod Speed wrote:

> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to use.
>
> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
>
> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
>
> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?

Disz <mein00@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Tmww8.46129$uR5.104582@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...

> what do you need the letters for???

Basically the stuff like CD keys during an
install where no one touchtypes that stuff.

To a lesser extent with code.

> id have thought that if you do that much
> typing you would be able to touch-type.

Yeah, been able to for quite a few decades now.

> ive been touch typing since i was ten.

Yeah, me too, learnt it over a single weekend,
forget whether it was a long weekend or not, while
still in school, because no one could read my writing.


> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote
>> kony <kony@insightbb.com> wrote
>>> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote

>>>>>> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot
>>>>>> injection moulded keytops anymore ?

>>>>> I think Logitech makes the best keyboards.

>>>> Do they have the same problem tho, the letters wearing off ?

>>> My Logitech Cordless iTouch keyboard has worn fairly
>>> well, has lasted longer than some modern keyboards
>>> I've had, but it too has the characters printed on the
>>> top, not injection molded.  It's not going to "last for years".

>> OK, the obvious thing to do is make sure its covered by years
>> of warranty and shaft them on that when the lettering has worn
>> enough so that its not usable anymore on some of the keys.

>> And buy it locally from an operation thats going to be around
>> for that long, to make it easy to shaft them on the warranty.

>> Our consumer law makes the seller legally liable in the first instance.
>> You can choose to use the manufacturer/importer if you want to.

Me <ch@mail.nu> wrote in message
news:MPG.172c747c3457632f989680@news20.bellglobal.com...
> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com>

>> Everyone who has commented has said that they
>> all wear like that except the ancient IBM keyboards.

> That is correct. The IBM model M I'm using has a date of Aug 1984
> on the bottom, came with the PS1 we had at work at one point. I bought
> a new one in 1992 or so just to see if i could get one not as "clickey"
> sounding, but it lasted about 6 months before the "spring" (rubber
> injected molded buttons) under the most used keys wore out so I
> went back to using this one. I bought a half dozen old ps1's for $10
> each at one point to just to stock up on keyboards though looking
> back that was a waste of money since i'm still using the original one....

Unfortunately I've changed over to USB now,
mainly for the convenience with the KVM.

Steve Hough <stevehough@NOSPAMblueyonder.co.uk> wrote in
message news:mkAw8.3978$kL.31909001@news-text.cableinet.net...

> We have a Logitech cordless keyboard and a cherry corded one, both for a
> couple of years now. Neither of them has any wear on the keys (used daily)

Yeah, looks like I'll go that route and just
do them under the warranty if they wear.

> Why not just buy cheap keyboards and chuck
> them away when the wear gets too much?

I've done that for many years, ever since the first clones and basically decided
that since the keyboard/mouse/monitor are what I use virtually all day every day
it makes a lot more sense to get something decent than cheap irritating crap.

Bashing the seller about the ears with the keyboard under warranty
appears to be a much more viable route than cheap keyboards basically.


> Peter and Susan <petanoz@hotmail.com> wrote
>> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote

>>> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
>>> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
>>> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.

>> Probably a stupid suggestion but if the keyboard itself is working ok -
>> why not just draw the letters back in with a pen or apply some stickers.

Rather less effort to monster the seller into a warranty
replacement with a branded keyboard like an MS or Logitech.

>> Just my 2cents worth.

Jeffrey Karp <jeffkarp@erols.com> wrote in message
news:3CC2F1D3.339A67D5@erols.com...

> Keyboard are basically meant to be disposable.

Thats not right. The MS and Logitech keyboards have 3-5 year warrantys.

> Some of the cordless ones are expensive though.

Yeah, usual problem with recovering the R&D costs quickly presumably.

> You may be able to find a cordless one that uses the same
> keytops as their corded version, so that you could buy the
> corded keyboard for perhaps as little as $10-15 when it is
> on sale, then switch the keytops from the corded one to the
> cordless one as the lettering wears out on the cordless one wears out.

Seems simpler to just belt the seller around the ears using the warranty.


> Rod Speed wrote:

>> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
>> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to use.

>> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
>> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
>> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
>> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.

>> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
>> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
>> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.

>> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?

I learned many years ago not to drink (coffee, soda pop) or eat at my work
desk.  I worked for a real tough boss and messed up an original document
once with a drink.  Very simple rule he had, you're paid to work, not to
talk to other co-workers or on the phone needlessly or to eat, smoke or
drink on his time.  You have breaks and lunch time for that.  Period.  No,
ifs, ands or buts.  Really bothers me today how some people think working is
just a social event, but they don't last long or go far.  But that is
another thread and definitely off-topic.  This is a hardware newsgroup.

Older keyboards are the best, with IBM's being my preference.

"James Hastie" <jhastie@smartchat.net.au> wrote in message
news:a9ued0$bg6$1@gnamma.connect.com.au...
> Im currently using the Mitsubishi Diamond Touch as well it seems great now
> for the price.. doesnt seem to have much wear..maybe give it time.
Although
> i cant really say beacause i seem to spill  coke and coffee into them far
> too often.
>
>

Howdy!

"Gregory Toomey" <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:e7sw8.45949$uR5.103869@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...

>
> Maybe Mitsubishi has better technology for stamping letters - I'll report
> back in a few years.

        If the letters are printed or stamped on, they WILL wear off.

        The only way currently to avoid that is to use
double-injection-molded key caps, where the letter and body of the cap is
one color, and the outer layer is another color, both molded in the
manufacture.

        RwP

"Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a9sivr$5pue2$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to
use.
>
> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
>
> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
>
> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?

**I know it's not cordless, but the best, toughest keyboards ever made, were
the old IBM PS/2 ones. Find one of those and you'll have it for life.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

Trevor Wilson <rageaudio@optushome.com.au> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote

>> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
>> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to use.

>> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
>> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
>> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
>> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.

>> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
>> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
>> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.

>> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?

> I know it's not cordless, but the best, toughest keyboards ever made,
> were the old IBM PS/2 ones. Find one of those and you'll have it for life.

Fraid not, I've changed over to USB now. Much better with a KVM.

I agree tho, they appear to be about the last of the properly
manufactured stuff with double injection moulded keytops.

Bugger it, I'll just monster the seller using the warranty.
Easier that buying a new one whenever the lettering is worn off.

"Mike Lamb" <Mike36000@alltel.net> wrote in message
news:a9u9us$hj9$1@iac5.navix.net...
> Sounds like to me you are in dire need of getting laid.

aren't we all.

>
> "Alien Spawn" <invasion@crosswinds.net> wrote in message
> news:3cc1ee36$0$11451$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
> >
> > That must have been real hard
> > well, stop using hand cream
> > Maybe you should wear silk gloves
> > As for current cordless KB's I must admit I know nothing.
>
>
>

"JAD" <jdemma@eartink.net> wrote in message news:<wOBw8.5102$PX2.361154@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...
> wife says "use clear nail polish" to "protect" the keys....an old office
> with a cheap boss trick.  Not to sure bout that though, some plastics don't
> much care for nail polish.

Enamel and polyurethane won't damage the keys, but lacquer may.

The keyboards I've seen made by NMB, including IBM and Microsoft,
don't seem to have problems with the letters wearing off, and they
don't seem to be double-shot molded.  The cheapest Focus-made
keyboards (incl. all those Rocketboards that were given out a few
years ago) have markings made with laser burns, and while they don't
look the best, they also wear well.

"Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<a9usgr$6dp8s$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de>...

> Bashing the seller about the ears with the keyboard under warranty
> appears to be a much more viable route than cheap keyboards basically.

Today's keyboards are too light to be effective as weapons, unlike the
old IBM XT and 84-key AT keyboards that weigh three times as much
(almost 6 lbs. - I mailed several) and automatically add 5 years to a
prison sentence for assault and battery.

do_not_spam_me <do_not_spam_me@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:101710fa.0204211726.4d4c719c@posting.google.com...
> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote

>> Bashing the seller about the ears with the keyboard under warranty
>> appears to be a much more viable route than cheap keyboards basically.

> Today's keyboards are too light to be effective as weapons,

Dunno, that particular MS Internet Pro is quite a bit more
solid than  many of the elcheapos I had used up till then.

> unlike the old IBM XT and 84-key AT keyboards that weigh
> three times as much (almost 6 lbs. - I mailed several)

Yeah, its not as heavy as one of those.

> and automatically add 5 years to a
> prison sentence for assault and battery.

We dont even have prison for that here.

> Do they have the same problem tho, the letters wearing off ?

My Logitech Cordless Desktop iTouch is now about 2 years old, and I have to
say, it's in perfect condition.  I'm a computer science student so I've been
using it pretty heavily the whole time, and I can't even see any signs of a
single letter fading on it.  Also every key still works perfectly.  No other
keyboard I've had has lasted more than a year without some deterioration so
I'm very impressed.  Also the last thing is Logitech give a 5 year
guarantee.  All in all it's one of the best things I've ever bought for my
PC.

do_not_spam_me@my-deja.com (do_not_spam_me) wrote:

>"Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<a9usgr$6dp8s$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de>...
>
>> Bashing the seller about the ears with the keyboard under warranty
>> appears to be a much more viable route than cheap keyboards basically.
>
>Today's keyboards are too light to be effective as weapons,

They would probably fall apart too...


Chris Pollard

-- 
CG Internet caf�, Tagum City, Philippines

http://www.chromenet.net/~cginternet

reply to beavis rather than butthead

"Steve Hough" <stevehough@NOSPAMblueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

>Why not just buy cheap keyboards and chuck them away when the wear gets too
>much?

Because, as well as wearing out quickly, the just feel so cheap.

Better to buy one decent one and hang on to it. And out here I can get a surplus
Compaq, or Dell for half the price of a cheap new one.


Chris Pollard

-- 
CG Internet caf�, Tagum City, Philippines

http://www.chromenet.net/~cginternet

reply to beavis rather than butthead

On 21 Apr 2002 18:26:48 -0700, do_not_spam_me@my-deja.com
(do_not_spam_me) wrote:

>"Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<a9usgr$6dp8s$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de>...
>
>> Bashing the seller about the ears with the keyboard under warranty
>> appears to be a much more viable route than cheap keyboards basically.
>
>Today's keyboards are too light to be effective as weapons, unlike the
>old IBM XT and 84-key AT keyboards that weigh three times as much
>(almost 6 lbs. - I mailed several) and automatically add 5 years to a
>prison sentence for assault and battery.

tell me about it.  I have an IBM warhorse here.  Remember when I
bought it ages ago.  Brought up to the checkout clerk handing it to
him, and kerplunk boom onto the counter.  He's like "what is in this
box?".  Six pounds, eh?  lol  It is the steel backplate in them,
unlike the piece of plastic with painted on traces or whatnot in kbs
now.  

I liken it to the old ma bell telephones.  When you got an ATT/ma bell
phone back then, you only had to pick it up to know it was the general
article.  You dropped that handset on your foot and  You hurt.  A lot.
Phone was fine.

you would find that keys rubbing off has to do with what ppl have on their
hands
"Brooks Moses" <bmoses@stanford.edu> wrote in message
news:3CC666B8.6CABC9A3@stanford.edu...
> Rod Speed wrote:
> > Trevor Wilson <rageaudio@optushome.com.au> wrote
> > > Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote
> > >> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore
?
> >
> > > I know it's not cordless, but the best, toughest keyboards ever made,
> > > were the old IBM PS/2 ones. Find one of those and you'll have it for
life.
> >
> > Fraid not, I've changed over to USB now. Much better with a KVM.
> >
> > I agree tho, they appear to be about the last of the properly
> > manufactured stuff with double injection moulded keytops.
>
> You know, there's been all this talk about IBM doing the proper double-
> injection-molded keytops on the PS/2 keyboards in this thread....
>
> Tell me, then, on this IBM PS/2 keyboard I've got sitting on my desk,
> how did they get two different colors of lettering on the number-pad
> keys?  :)
>
> (Actually, on closer look, this one appears not to be double-molded.
> Still solid and has every appearance of indestructability, though.  It's
> vintage-1993, for what that's worth.)
>
> - Brooks

acids and alkalines baby. Used to make solvents, and its in our sweat.
"Stealth Technologies" <stealthtech@vision.net.au> wrote in message
news:6c6y8.49312$uR5.115451@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
> you would find that keys rubbing off has to do with what ppl have on their
> hands
> "Brooks Moses" <bmoses@stanford.edu> wrote in message
> news:3CC666B8.6CABC9A3@stanford.edu...
> > Rod Speed wrote:
> > > Trevor Wilson <rageaudio@optushome.com.au> wrote
> > > > Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote
> > > >> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops
anymore
> ?
> > >
> > > > I know it's not cordless, but the best, toughest keyboards ever
made,
> > > > were the old IBM PS/2 ones. Find one of those and you'll have it for
> life.
> > >
> > > Fraid not, I've changed over to USB now. Much better with a KVM.
> > >
> > > I agree tho, they appear to be about the last of the properly
> > > manufactured stuff with double injection moulded keytops.
> >
> > You know, there's been all this talk about IBM doing the proper double-
> > injection-molded keytops on the PS/2 keyboards in this thread....
> >
> > Tell me, then, on this IBM PS/2 keyboard I've got sitting on my desk,
> > how did they get two different colors of lettering on the number-pad
> > keys?  :)
> >
> > (Actually, on closer look, this one appears not to be double-molded.
> > Still solid and has every appearance of indestructability, though.  It's
> > vintage-1993, for what that's worth.)
> >
> > - Brooks
>
>
>

Stealth Technologies <stealthtech@vision.net.au> wrote in message
news:6c6y8.49312$uR5.115451@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...

> you would find that keys rubbing off has
> to do with what ppl have on their hands

Fraid not. Doesnt explain why all the older double injection moulded
keytops like the DEC LK201 and VT100 keyboards dont rub off and its
only the more recent crap that aint double injection moulded that does.

Stupid way to do something that gets as much rubbing as a keytop.


> "Brooks Moses" <bmoses@stanford.edu> wrote in message
> news:3CC666B8.6CABC9A3@stanford.edu...
> > Rod Speed wrote:
> > > Trevor Wilson <rageaudio@optushome.com.au> wrote
> > > > Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote
> > > >> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore
> ?
> > >
> > > > I know it's not cordless, but the best, toughest keyboards ever made,
> > > > were the old IBM PS/2 ones. Find one of those and you'll have it for
> life.
> > >
> > > Fraid not, I've changed over to USB now. Much better with a KVM.
> > >
> > > I agree tho, they appear to be about the last of the properly
> > > manufactured stuff with double injection moulded keytops.
> >
> > You know, there's been all this talk about IBM doing the proper double-
> > injection-molded keytops on the PS/2 keyboards in this thread....
> >
> > Tell me, then, on this IBM PS/2 keyboard I've got sitting on my desk,
> > how did they get two different colors of lettering on the number-pad
> > keys?  :)
> >
> > (Actually, on closer look, this one appears not to be double-molded.
> > Still solid and has every appearance of indestructability, though.  It's
> > vintage-1993, for what that's worth.)
> >
> > - Brooks
>
>

On Fri, 26 Apr 2002 16:18:19 +1000, "Stealth Technologies"
<stealthtech@vision.net.au> wrote:

>you would find that keys rubbing off has to do with what ppl have on their
>hands

LOL...  Absolutely, I usually dip my fingers in tar and sand right
before typing.

Ever hear of friction?


Dave
__________________________
Please Reply to Newsgroup,
@Home ate my email address

Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a9sivr$5pue2$1@ID-69072.news.dfncis.de...
> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to
use.
>
> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.
>
> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.
>
> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?
>

My microsoft keyboard has retained its letters for a good while.  But I've
had problems with keys sticking since day one. (not the actual key but the
contacts inside) I would go elsewhere.

el duderino <mattjh@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:ab1o06$k1r$1@paris.btinternet.com...
> Rod Speed <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote

>> Looking at a decent modern cordless keyboard, dont care too much about
>> cost, basically want something that will last for years and is decent to use.

>> I relatively recently got off my arse and sent for a decent
>> branded keyboard, instead of farting around with cheapys.
>> Went for the MS, for no particular reason, after getting
>> pissed off at how quickly the lettering wears off the cheapys.

>> Only to find that the MS Internet Pro is already showing significant
>> wear with the lettering after 6 months use. And significant physical
>> wear on those keys too, basically the roughened surface is now smooth.

>> Doesnt anyone do proper double shot injection moulded keytops anymore ?

> My microsoft keyboard has retained its letters for a
> good while.  But I've had problems with keys sticking
> since day one. (not the actual key but the contacts inside)

I got the exact opposite, works perfectly, just has seen
the lettering visibly worn after 6 months of pretty high use.

> I would go elsewhere.

Trouble is that no one can suggest anyone supplying
a cordless with double injection moulded keytops
today, let alone one that works perfectly as well |-)

I've basically decided to ignore the lettering wearing off, buy a
name brand like MS or Logitech locally with years of warranty and
take it back and demand a replacement when the letters wear off.

You all get to wear my behaviour in the price of those keyboards |-)

On Sun, 5 May 2002 11:03:01 +1000, as a billion Chinese slept on in blissful
ignorance, "Rod Speed" <rod_speed@yahoo.com> wrote:
  
> You all get to wear my behaviour in the price of those keyboards |-)

Maybe we should get together and buy you a Dvorak keyboard to slow you down a
bit?  <g d r>