🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <x-q3trb@rpi.edu> hoanga@rpi.edu writes:
>
>	Okay, I've played this game for so long now and here I am, an on the 
>verge non-tick master (but wouldn't mind learning how to tick) and I still
>have questions.  But then again don't the best always question themselves??
>their abilites, etc??  Well I dunno, you tell me on that since many of you
>seem to have hit master level according to my ratings.  
>
>	Anyways to the questions
>
>
>1.  I have heard the big old argument on the tiger Knee of Sagat.  Well I have
>    one thing to ask.   The moves of /  then O  is generally a consensus
>    but I'm wondering just  ONE     O       /    thing.  Does this back then up
>    move (similar to a Guile Jackknife) require any charging or some special
>    timing?  Please inform me.  I WOULD like to know.  
>
     Nope, no charging necessary.  The timing's a bit tricky, but you'll get
     the hang of it eventually.

>2.  The FB trap of Ryu (Ryules!  Flame me if you want but I'm going back to Ryu)
>    is a very nasty nasty item I have learned but am just wondering is Blanka
>    almost non-susceptible to this move (In Hyper FIghter that is).  Becuz 
>    the Blanka master I was fighting just hopped over them then started a 
>    slugfest on my face (ouch!).  I was just wondering the effectiveness of 
>    the fireball trap against certain characters.

     Hmmm.. HF hasn't come to my campus yet [ =( ] but I'm sure that one of
     the UIC folks would be thrilled to answer this one.

>
>3.  I've seen this and would like it confirmed.  Can you jump attack then 
>    do an air Hurricane kick?  I've seem some guy trying to come in with a 
>    flying short knee with Ken but at the last minute (BEFORE he landed) he
>    went into an air Hurricane Kick.  Is this possible and if so what is the
>    timing?
>
     Yes, but for some reason, the only way I've been able to do it is by
     treating it like a buffered move.  (i.e. jumping roundhouse, then
     do a HK _right_ after it connects)  Unfortunately, using this method,
     the HK flies right over your opponent's head.

>4.  Ryu's HK on the ground.  When is the time you do the move to hop over a
>    FB from Ken/Ryu?  Last moment?  A certain distance?  Far distance (I doubt
>    that).  I've been practicing the move and have sometimes jumped over Ken's
>    fireballs and hit the guy that just stood there dumbfounded.  I also love
>    using that move to knock out torpedo type attacks >:)  I love it when Blanka
>    does the rolling steam train (again and again balls) and I HK at the last
>    moment and then he goes sailing >:).  I love it.
>

     Ryu is invunerable while going up into the HK _and_ while coming down,
     so in order to phase though anything, you have to start the HK _right_
     before you get smacked.

>5.  I'm going to try Balrog soon and just wondered how long does the 
>    invincibility of the TAP last?  I wanna have an idea of its invulnerability
>    length so I have an idea of what to do.
>

     The TAP is only invunerable while Balrog is turned around.  It's a little
     bit longer than the invunerability of Ryu's HK

>6.  Is Dhalsim's teleport bufferable like a DP?  I mean like you're down and
>    someone jumps in to hit you just as you get up... can you buffer in the
>    teleport and go poof?  

     This isn't buffering, but I assume it's possible.  Ever since CE, the
     'man down' has always had an opportunity to get the first move off, 
     providing that it's a special technique or a throw.

>
>	Except for question 1, all the rest is assumed to be playing on the
>Hyper Fighter.  
>
>Thanx for the help if it comes, beforehand.

Your welcome

>
>hoanga@rpi.edu
>Alain Hoang
>"There is always something new to learn."
>
---
T. Cannon

>	Anyways to the questions
>1.  I have heard the big old argument on the tiger Knee of Sagat.  Well I have
>    one thing to ask.   The moves of /  then O  is generally a consensus
>    but I'm wondering just  ONE     O       /    thing.  Does this back then up
>    move (similar to a Guile Jackknife) require any charging or some special
>    timing?  Please inform me.  I WOULD like to know.  

No charge time required,  You can as many as you want in a row, w/o delay.

>3.  I've seen this and would like it confirmed.  Can you jump attack then 
>    do an air Hurricane kick?  I've seem some guy trying to come in with a 
>    flying short knee with Ken but at the last minute (BEFORE he landed) he
>    went into an air Hurricane Kick.  Is this possible and if so what is the
>    timing?

The HK can be done in the air just as it is done on the ground.  (You had
better know what the HK motion is!)  Once while playing, I hit the opponent
with a flying roundhouse, and proceeded to hit them with a mid-air HK.
Don't know if a combo or what, but I did it.

>4.  Ryu's HK on the ground.  When is the time you do the move to hop over a
>    FB from Ken/Ryu?  Last moment?  A certain distance?  Far distance (I doubt
>    that).  I've been practicing the move and have sometimes jumped over Ken's
>    fireballs and hit the guy that just stood there dumbfounded.  I also love
>    using that move to knock out torpedo type attacks :)  I love it when Blanka
>    does the rolling steam train (again and again balls) and I HK at the last
>    moment and then he goes sailing >:).  I love it.

The timing for the HK over the FB is right before it gets to you, so that 
it passes through his legs as he is going up for the HK.  I think it works
best for strong or fierce FB's only.

>5.  I'm going to try Balrog soon and just wondered how long does the 
>    invincibility of the TAP last?  I wanna have an idea of its invulnerability
>    length so I have an idea of what to do.

Similar to the HK.  Definitely more surprising though, but the opponent will
be expecting it after a while.  Use it in close quarters to assure they
can't counter.

-- 
Caine Schneider
"Attack me if you dare, I will crush you!" -Ken
"I've got a bad feeling about this..." -Solo -Skywalker -Leia
--

hoanga@nason109.its.rpi.edu (Alain Hoang) writes:


>	Okay, I've played this game for so long now and here I am, an on the 
>verge non-tick master (but wouldn't mind learning how to tick) and I still
>have questions.  But then again don't the best always question themselves??
>their abilites, etc??  Well I dunno, you tell me on that since many of you
>seem to have hit master level according to my ratings.  

>	Anyways to the questions



>2.  The FB trap of Ryu (Ryules!  Flame me if you want but I'm going back to Ryu)
>    is a very nasty nasty item I have learned but am just wondering is Blanka
>    almost non-susceptible to this move (In Hyper FIghter that is).  Becuz 
>    the Blanka master I was fighting just hopped over them then started a 
>    slugfest on my face (ouch!).  I was just wondering the effectiveness of 
>    the fireball trap against certain characters.

	Actually, the FB trap is extremely effective vs. Blanka, if begun from
	the correct distance.  It is possible to sweep him before he hits the
	ground, regardless of what move Blanka may do from the air.  It is
	not easy to describe generally, but the spacings aren't too hard to
	pick up if you watch someone who can do it.  Against other characters?
	There is far too much to be said here, maybe I'll post a guide when I'm
	not so sleepy...

>3.  I've seen this and would like it confirmed.  Can you jump attack then 
>    do an air Hurricane kick?  I've seem some guy trying to come in with a 
>    flying short knee with Ken but at the last minute (BEFORE he landed) he
>    went into an air Hurricane Kick.  Is this possible and if so what is the
>    timing?
	
	Yes, this is possible, but with only semi limited uses.  It IS a two
	hit combo, if done late, but does less damage than most Ken/Ryu combos.
	The only idea I have come up with is for an anti sac throwing maneuver.
	They take the hit... then they take another one before I have even hit
	the ground.  The timing for this will also come with a little practice,.	I got it after more or less two days.

>4.  Ryu's HK on the ground.  When is the time you do the move to hop over a
>    FB from Ken/Ryu?  Last moment?  A certain distance?  Far distance (I doubt
>    that).  I've been practicing the move and have sometimes jumped over Ken's
>    fireballs and hit the guy that just stood there dumbfounded.  I also love
>    using that move to knock out torpedo type attacks >:)  I love it when Blanka
>    does the rolling steam train (again and again balls) and I HK at the last
>    moment and then he goes sailing >:).  I love it.

	This is very intuitive, and VERY useful.  I use this move so much that
	I have almost forgotten how to get inside with Ken (who cannot go
	over FB's).  I'm afraid I cant describe the timing, but it is done very
	late into the approach.  Like I said, very intuitive.  Practice practice
        practice...

>5.  I'm going to try Balrog soon and just wondered how long does the 
>    invincibility of the TAP last?  I wanna have an idea of its invulnerability
>    length so I have an idea of what to do.

	I think that the "invulnerability" is actually quite a bit longer than
	the HK's, but takes some timing none the less.  I put invulnerability 
	in quotes, because I don't think that Balrog is actually invulnerable
	in the same sense as Ken/Ryu in the middle of a DP are.  I say this 
	because I have thrown B out of the TAP and I believe it was while still
	in the turnaround portion of the animation.

>6.  Is Dhalsim's teleport bufferable like a DP?  I mean like you're down and
>    someone jumps in to hit you just as you get up... can you buffer in the
>    teleport and go poof?  

	I have no idea.  Still too slow to be much good IMO.

>	Except for question 1, all the rest is assumed to be playing on the
>Hyper Fighter.  

>Thanx for the help if it comes, beforehand.

>hoanga@rpi.edu
>Alain Hoang
>"There is always something new to learn."

	Seth Killian

	Thanx to all that replied to my questions.  I have partaken a mission
to use the Hurricane Kick for Ryu as it hasn't been used before.  After watching
our local Ryu master (who doesn't have the HK down as good as all you Ryu nuts
but better than me by far) HK E.Honda out of a Torpedo one day I was inspired
to annoy people with this kick to no ends.  So far I keep forgetting about the
kick but I'll have to use it on Roll-happy Blankas :)

	Hmmm, I suspected that such a late use in the HK was necessary for 
jumping over fireballs and I believe that the HK doesn't go over Jab FB's that
well at all.  And I guess I'll have to go get and practice my timing to hop over
it.  *sigh* Oh well more practice.  Another question ....   DOes it matter
WHICH kick you use for the HK when jumping over Fireball's.  When I have done
it (wih major inconsistencies) it's always been the Roundhouse kick.  But I'd
like to use different kicks so I can mix up the distance partaken after jumping
over the fireball with the HK.

THanx Beforehand

Alain Hoang
hoanga@rpi.edu
"Whaddya know, learned somethin' new"

hoanga@sage4b.its.rpi.edu (Alain Hoang) writes:


 
B
>	Hmmm, I suspected that such a late use in the HK was necessary for 
>jumping over fireballs and I believe that the HK doesn't go over Jab FB's that
>well at all.  And I guess I'll have to go get and practice my timing to hop over
>it.  *sigh* Oh well more practice.  Another question ....   DOes it matter
>WHICH kick you use for the HK when jumping over Fireball's.  When I have done
>it (wih major inconsistencies) it's always been the Roundhouse kick.  But I'd
>like to use different kicks so I can mix up the distance partaken after jumping
>over the fireball with the HK.

	It does the old heart good to see someone aspiring to new levels of 
	annoyance with that wonderful HK!  I loooove the HK.  In answer to 
	your questions:  you CAN go over jab FB's with the HK, although I have
	not done it with the short HK (haven't actually tried).  You can also
	use the short HK to go over FB's of higher speeds.  Practice on Ryu or
	computer Chun Li (HF).  For going over FB's with the HK, I almost
	always use roundhouse, because it goes further.  You can hit the FB
	thrower from about 1/2 screen away safely.  Any farther and he'll
	have time to react and possibly squish you.  What most often happens
	is that some Ryu will be FBing mercilessly and when you sail on through
	one, he will have already started the motion for the next one.  This is
	funny because you cant have two FB's on the screen at once, and they
	expected the first one to have connected by now so their FB motion ends
	with an extremely foolish looking standing straight out fierce, while
	they stand frozen in recoil while you smash them.  This move is also
	wonderful for it's occasionaly amazing damage, sometimes better than a
	throw...

	P.S.  Just today on a CE machine, I went through TWO of computer Ryu's
	fierce FB's in the same short HK.  One on the way up, and one on the
	way down.  In all my years :) of HKing, I have never before seen this,
	and it will probably be tough to duplicate.  Perhaps this will lend some
	credence to the "invincible on the way down too" theory of HK...


>THanx Beforehand

>Alain Hoang
>hoanga@rpi.edu
>"Whaddya know, learned somethin' new"

About HF Ryu's mid-air Hurricane Kick:

Yes, you can get this move in a combo.  You can interrupt an aerial
attack with the hurricane kick.  This two hit combo comes in handy
in those annoying Ken/Ryu battles and gives Ryu and edge IMO.
The joystick motions for this combo are easy.  If you can do a roundhouse/
fireball combo, you can do a flying roundhouse/aerial hurricane kick
combo.

Now, when you use it:
Usually, you have to hit players around the neck or chest area with your
flying roundhouse so that you:
a) can land the rest of a combo successfully.
b) don't get sac-thrown
c) don't get foot-swept or worse before you land.

However, when jumping over a fireball, it's not always possible to hit
your opponent that late.  If you try to, you'll find yourself on the
fist end of a DP.  If you hit them early, then one of the above nasties
can spoil your attack.

With Ryu's flying roundhouse/aerial hurricane kick, Ryu can safely jump
in from distances and with poorer timing than he used to be able to.
There's a certain distance in every Ryu player's head where they regard
it as 'safe' to fireball.  You'll notice that during Ryu vs. Ryu battles,
players often throw fireballs simultaneously at this distance.  Now,
instead of countering with a fireball, you can jump over and attack with
your new combo.  Ryu's effective ground range has been increased!

Well, I'll leave you to ponder the implications.  Just wanted to let you
know that this move changes some of the subtleties of positioning of
Ryu/Ken battles.  Ken's flying roundhouse/hurricane kick just doesn't
cut it.
-- 
Eu-Ming Lee (aka CyberGeek)                      el27166@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
If you have nothing good to say, sit down, shut up, and post to USENET.

>	P.S.  Just today on a CE machine, I went through TWO of computer Ryu's
>	fierce FB's in the same short HK.  One on the way up, and one on the
>	way down.  In all my years :) of HKing, I have never before seen this,
>	and it will probably be tough to duplicate.  Perhaps this will lend some
>	credence to the "invincible on the way down too" theory of HK...

This is possible against computer Sagat or any human idiot who like throwing
only high tigers.  I've gone through two high tigers at once several times.
Like seven or eight times.  I used the short HK to do, and I never hit him
with it, but it looks like a trick that you'd plan.


-- 
Caine Schneider
"Attack me if you dare, I will crush you!" -Ken
"I've got a bad feeling about this..." -Solo -Skywalker -Leia
--

It's easier to go through fireballs with the roundhouse hurricane kick
because the lateral speed is greater than the short hurricane kick.

However, it is possible to go through jab fireballs with the short
hurricane kick.  I use the short hurricane kick to go through fireballs
most of the time.  The other ones leave you too vulnerable.  The
fireball thrower can simply block and then DP.  If they do this on your
short hurricane kick, they'll usually DP right through your hurricane
kick as you're invulnerable and coming down from it, or you'll already
be on the ground and blocking their attack.

IMO, it's usually safer to throw after blocking a hurricane kick, since
it will always work if done correctly.  The problem is doing it correctly
in the first place :-).  However, if I recognize a HK as a roundhouse one,
I'll have plenty of time to set up for a DP.

Side note:  My Blanka strategy against players who hurricane kick too
much is to block it and then bite.  Don't pound on the fierce button to
bite.  You can only bite after Ryu is out of the hurricane kick, so don't
even try before then.  If done right, Ryu can't DP or do anything.  But
that's his fault for losing the initiative by performing a HK in the
first place.
-- 
Eu-Ming Lee (aka CyberGeek)                      el27166@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
If you have nothing good to say, sit down, shut up, and post to USENET.