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There were at least 2 greens - a deep green sort of like 3830, and the apple
green seen on 3801
Graham

"Spinner Brett Fitzpatrick" <spinner@mpx.com.au> wrote in message
news:499b8921.0412152257.6cf4ad6d@posting.google.com...
> "According to a 'bit of reasearch' the green used on the 38s 40, 41etc
> was Dulux Verdant Green Paint Number
> 388-04838. I believe this paint can still be made as the specification
> is
> still current.
>
> Please note that this statement, on the surface, appears to tell us
> that Larch Green = Verdant Green.  Perhaps the colour specifications
> were sent to Montreal and the UK."
>
> I've been asked, off group, what my research is to support what I said
> above.
>
> The source of the above information was a person called Doug
> Patterson, who used to work at Chullora Workshops, latterly the
> electrical section.  He used to work in the painting section when 38s
> were being done.  His statement on this was taken circa 1972.
>
> The 40 Class d/e's were imported and landed in primer, the paint was
> applied at Redfern (Eveleigh), the same paint as used on the 38's.
>
> The 41 Class d/e's were imported and landed fully painted so may have
> been different for the first period of their lives.
>
> The Dulux paint colour number, 338-4838, was derived from the year
> (1948) and application (38 Class), a point confirmed by Dulux.  338
> indicated the paint type and manufacturer.
>
>
> Brett

At least three, I think, but I wouldn't claim to be an expert. The three I
know about are the 'apple green', as used on 3801 from the time of its
return to green livery in 1963 or thereabouts; the olive green, which so far
as I know was unique to 3830 and dates from around the same time; and the
standard green in which the second series of 25 built at Eveleigh and
Cardiff entered traffic.

The five Cyde locos were also repainted from grey into this green in the mid
to late 1940s. This green APPEARS from photos (not a very reliable indicator
it must be admitted!) to be the same or very similar to that used on
passenger locos outshopped from around 1936 to 1940. Almost all the rebuilt
35s, a fair sprinkiling of 36s and 32s, and the odd 34 and 12 were painted
in this green. I imagine there was plenty of this paint left over when the
green livery was suddenly abandoned as the war got serious, but that's only
speculation.

If it's accurate speculation, then the 38s in the late 40s would have been
painted the same green as the pre-war passenger locos, many of which of
course were also still green (but faded and weathered) at that time. As I
said, though, I'm anything but an expert in these matters.

It's interesting that the Dulux paint specification dates from 1948, by
which time most of the second series of 25 were already in service. I don't
think these 38s were ever repainted in green, so carried their original
paint jobs until repainted in black just after Harold Young retired in 1951.
That means the last few 38s MAY have had the same paint as the 40s, but the
earlier ones MAY have been in a different (darker I think) green. Then
again, the 1948 specification may have matched closely or exactly what was
being used until then. But who knows at this distance???


"Graham Morphett" <graham@morphett.com> wrote in message
news:pOowd.26$g5.844@nnrp1.ozemail.com.au...
> There were at least 2 greens - a deep green sort of like 3830, and the
apple
> green seen on 3801
> Graham
>
> "Spinner Brett Fitzpatrick" <spinner@mpx.com.au> wrote in message
> news:499b8921.0412152257.6cf4ad6d@posting.google.com...
> > "According to a 'bit of reasearch' the green used on the 38s 40, 41etc
> > was Dulux Verdant Green Paint Number
> > 388-04838. I believe this paint can still be made as the specification
> > is
> > still current.
> >
> > Please note that this statement, on the surface, appears to tell us
> > that Larch Green = Verdant Green.  Perhaps the colour specifications
> > were sent to Montreal and the UK."
> >
> > I've been asked, off group, what my research is to support what I said
> > above.
> >
> > The source of the above information was a person called Doug
> > Patterson, who used to work at Chullora Workshops, latterly the
> > electrical section.  He used to work in the painting section when 38s
> > were being done.  His statement on this was taken circa 1972.
> >
> > The 40 Class d/e's were imported and landed in primer, the paint was
> > applied at Redfern (Eveleigh), the same paint as used on the 38's.
> >
> > The 41 Class d/e's were imported and landed fully painted so may have
> > been different for the first period of their lives.
> >
> > The Dulux paint colour number, 338-4838, was derived from the year
> > (1948) and application (38 Class), a point confirmed by Dulux.  338
> > indicated the paint type and manufacturer.
> >
> >
> > Brett
>
>

"Robert Lee" <robsl@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:gXqxd.80183$K7.953@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> At least three, I think, but I wouldn't claim to be an expert. The three I
> know about are the 'apple green', as used on 3801 from the time of its
> return to green livery in 1963 or thereabouts; the olive green, which so
far
> as I know was unique to 3830 and dates from around the same time; and the
> standard green in which the second series of 25 built at Eveleigh and
> Cardiff entered traffic.
>
> The five Cyde locos were also repainted from grey into this green in the
mid
> to late 1940s. This green APPEARS from photos (not a very reliable
indicator
> it must be admitted!) to be the same or very similar to that used on
> passenger locos outshopped from around 1936 to 1940. Almost all the
rebuilt
> 35s, a fair sprinkiling of 36s and 32s, and the odd 34 and 12 were painted
> in this green. I imagine there was plenty of this paint left over when the
> green livery was suddenly abandoned as the war got serious, but that's
only
> speculation.

Yes it is.

>
> If it's accurate speculation, then the 38s in the late 40s would have been
> painted the same green as the pre-war passenger locos, many of which of
> course were also still green (but faded and weathered) at that time. As I
> said, though, I'm anything but an expert in these matters.
>

The paint sample obtained from a railways model painted in the 1936 colour
was darker than the 38 green.

> It's interesting that the Dulux paint specification dates from 1948, by
> which time most of the second series of 25 were already in service. I
don't
> think these 38s were ever repainted in green, so carried their original
> paint jobs until repainted in black just after Harold Young retired in
1951.
> That means the last few 38s MAY have had the same paint as the 40s, but
the
> earlier ones MAY have been in a different (darker I think) green. Then
> again, the 1948 specification may have matched closely or exactly what was
> being used until then. But who knows at this distance???
>

The colour of the 40 class green paint sample was a shade or 2 lighter than
the paint sample from 3830. This could simply be poor colour matching. Those
who had painted their models with craftsman paints have the correct colours,
within a shade or too.

>
> "Graham Morphett" <graham@morphett.com> wrote in message
> news:pOowd.26$g5.844@nnrp1.ozemail.com.au...
> > There were at least 2 greens - a deep green sort of like 3830, and the
> apple
> > green seen on 3801
> > Graham
> >
> > "Spinner Brett Fitzpatrick" <spinner@mpx.com.au> wrote in message
> > news:499b8921.0412152257.6cf4ad6d@posting.google.com...
> > > "According to a 'bit of reasearch' the green used on the 38s 40, 41etc
> > > was Dulux Verdant Green Paint Number
> > > 388-04838. I believe this paint can still be made as the specification
> > > is
> > > still current.
> > >
> > > Please note that this statement, on the surface, appears to tell us
> > > that Larch Green = Verdant Green.  Perhaps the colour specifications
> > > were sent to Montreal and the UK."
> > >
> > > I've been asked, off group, what my research is to support what I said
> > > above.
> > >
> > > The source of the above information was a person called Doug
> > > Patterson, who used to work at Chullora Workshops, latterly the
> > > electrical section.  He used to work in the painting section when 38s
> > > were being done.  His statement on this was taken circa 1972.
> > >
> > > The 40 Class d/e's were imported and landed in primer, the paint was
> > > applied at Redfern (Eveleigh), the same paint as used on the 38's.
> > >
> > > The 41 Class d/e's were imported and landed fully painted so may have
> > > been different for the first period of their lives.
> > >
> > > The Dulux paint colour number, 338-4838, was derived from the year
> > > (1948) and application (38 Class), a point confirmed by Dulux.  338
> > > indicated the paint type and manufacturer.
> > >
> > >
> > > Brett
> >
> >
>
>
-- 
Terry Flynn


http://angelfire.com/clone/rail/index.html

HO wagon weight and locomotive tractive effort estimates

DC control circuit diagrams

HO scale track standards

"Graham Morphett" <graham@morphett.com> wrote in message
news:pOowd.26$g5.844@nnrp1.ozemail.com.au...
> There were at least 2 greens - a deep green sort of like 3830, and the
apple
> green seen on 3801
> Graham
>
> "Spinner Brett Fitzpatrick" <spinner@mpx.com.au> wrote in message
> news:499b8921.0412152257.6cf4ad6d@posting.google.com...
> > "According to a 'bit of reasearch' the green used on the 38s 40, 41etc
> > was Dulux Verdant Green Paint Number
> > 388-04838. I believe this paint can still be made as the specification
> > is
> > still current.
> >
> > Please note that this statement, on the surface, appears to tell us
> > that Larch Green = Verdant Green.  Perhaps the colour specifications
> > were sent to Montreal and the UK."
> >
> > I've been asked, off group, what my research is to support what I said
> > above.
> >
> > The source of the above information was a person called Doug
> > Patterson, who used to work at Chullora Workshops, latterly the
> > electrical section.  He used to work in the painting section when 38s
> > were being done.  His statement on this was taken circa 1972.
> >
> > The 40 Class d/e's were imported and landed in primer, the paint was
> > applied at Redfern (Eveleigh), the same paint as used on the 38's.
> >
> > The 41 Class d/e's were imported and landed fully painted so may have
> > been different for the first period of their lives.
> >
> > The Dulux paint colour number, 338-4838, was derived from the year
> > (1948) and application (38 Class), a point confirmed by Dulux.  338
> > indicated the paint type and manufacturer.
> >
> >
> > Brett
>
>

The  paint samples from the 40 was a shade or 2 lighter than that of 3830.
It indicates that the colour as mixed and delivered from Dulux varied, which
is to be expected.

-- 
Terry Flynn


http://angelfire.com/clone/rail/index.html

HO wagon weight and locomotive tractive effort estimates

DC control circuit diagrams

HO scale track standards

>> "Spinner Brett Fitzpatrick" <spinner@mpx.com.au> wrote in message
>> news:499b8921.0412152257.6cf4ad6d@posting.google.com...
>> > "According to a 'bit of reasearch' the green used on the 38s 40, 41etc
>> > was Dulux Verdant Green Paint Number
>> > 388-04838. I believe this paint can still be made as the specification
>> > is still current.

Paint manufacture has changed about three times since that specification.
It is unlikely you will get much satisfaction if trying to order it.

>> > The Dulux paint colour number, 338-4838, was derived from the year
>> > (1948) and application (38 Class), a point confirmed by Dulux.  338
>> > indicated the paint type and manufacturer.

388 indicates it is a Dulux brushing enamel.  The paint number 4838 is 
purely coincidental.

From the 1950s, Sydney's trams and buses were painted with Dulux Non-Fading 
Green 388-0011, although I have also seen a can with the number 388-11007, 
and it appears that at some stage Dulux's numbering changed from a 
four-digit number to five digits.

The Public Transport Commission (NSW) blue and white were 388-12128 Mandarin 
Blue and 388-09828 Riviera White.  Mandarin Blue was also available in three 
other formats as indicated by the three digit prefix.  Prefix 393- was Dulux 
Solid Spraying Enamel, 426- was Dulux Acran Solid Acrylic Enamel and 526- 
was Dulux A-type Solid Acrylic Lacquer.393, 426 and 526.  The paint format 
and composition of the mix depended on how the paint was to be applied.

Bob Merchant